"Ticket To Ride"/ "Settlers of Catan"/"Memoir '44" Questions

Ok, sort of a question to those "boad game cognoscenti" in the forums here--

I'm a board game noob. I played "Formula De" fanatically in a league about 5 years ago, but I've never really played any of the other classics like Catan or Carc (although I bought Carc and Carc Castles a few years ago... never played them).

I recently downloaded the XBLA demo of TICKET, and really enjoyed the presentation and the game mechanics. It actually got me interested in buying a copy of the physical game, which led me to the Days Of Wonder website and the online version.

So I guess my question is, which version of the game should I buy?

The actual games are WAY too expensive, especially when you consider each and every variation costs $50 or so... I don't know a lot of people who I would actually game with, so that makes me think it'll end up staying in the closet most of the time. I know buying the box gives you an access code to the online game, though.

The XBLA game seems decent enough, although I currently don't have a "gold" subscription. The price is much cheaper, and they seem willing to offer add on tracks and rules (I think the Europe game just came out). The drawback seems to be that... well, you're forced to play with LIVE subscribers... and I'm not sure if there is an option to play against bots/computer controlled players. I'd probably spend most time playing it by myself in order to not look like a chump.

That leaves the official version reviewed here previously by Elysium. The DoW version seems to offer three different sets (USA, Europe, Switzerland), has bots, seems to look a lot less crowded than the XBLA version... I'm not sure what other pluses or minuses this version may have. Looks like you only get a year of online play before you have to pay for another subscription.

Any suggestions?

Can't talk about any differences in the versions, but the XBLA version does have bots. I think you can have up to three computer opponents.

Not sure if it's cheap enough to be enticing, but don't pay MSRP on boardgames.

The access code you get is only for six months at the Days of Wonder site. Once that's up you'll either need to buy another Days of Wonder board game or pick up more play time on their site. $12 for 6 months and $18 for a year.

If you're really interested in playing other people the Days of Wonder site isn't a bad way to go. I think there's generally a good number of people playing at any point in time and the interface is good. I like the 360 version but I'm guessing you won't find many people playing online.

As for the board game, I've only played the original and the 1910 expansion for it and I think it's just fine. There are several versions now (Europe, Marklin, Switzerland, Nordic Countries) and I think they all add in slightly different rules. There's plenty of fun to be had with the original, though, and the expansion adds a little bit of extra challenge. It'd also probably be the best option for getting others to play as the USA map will be the most familiar.

If you really want to have a steady stream of human opponents to play I think the DoW site is really your best bet. Interest in the 360 version is only going to dwindle over time if there's even anyone playing online right now anyway. If playing against bots most the time is good enough for you then go with the 360 version, especially if you're already paying for Live.

The board game is good, though, and I think it's well worth picking up. You might be surprised how much people will get into it once they try it out. The mechanics are very simple and it's just basic set collection, something people will easily recognize from simple card games of their youth. Have some friends over, maybe set the board up ahead of time. I have no doubt people will get interested when they see it all set up.

LiquidMantis wrote:

Not sure if it's cheap enough to be enticing, but don't pay MSRP on boardgames.

Yeah, thoughthammer rocks, although most retailers can't offer much of a discount on Days of Wonder games these days. Unless you are ordering enough other stuff to get free shipping you won't be saving a significant amount by ordering online.

Can't speak to 360 vs. PC versions. Although I will say that you should definitely play the game in some form. It's a really fun game. One thing I love about the 360 is that it got me into boardgaming in a big way. I bought Catan and Carcassonne on XBLA and promptly spent about $150 in analog board games. I never would have even considered that had I not first played around with other people online. It was a fun way to learn the games and rediscover something I'd forgotten I enjoyed.

Now my wife and I play cards, Ticket To Ride, Backgammon or Carcassonne weekly. We go to friends' houses and play various games. It's opened up a whole different avenue of gaming I never thought I'd enjoy. So definitely give it a try in some fashion.

Thanks for the comments.

Dreaded Gazebo wrote:
LiquidMantis wrote:

Not sure if it's cheap enough to be enticing, but don't pay MSRP on boardgames.

Yeah, thoughthammer rocks, although most retailers can't offer much of a discount on Days of Wonder games these days. Unless you are ordering enough other stuff to get free shipping you won't be saving a significant amount by ordering online.

I was looking at Thoughthammer last night... the game is cheap enough, but as you said, the shipping is killer. Someone was selling a sealed game on eBay for $43 with free shipping... might go that route. I was thinking of trying to buy enough "gateway games" to get to $150, but I don't know if I can do it... I'm not too familiar with which games might be better for new players (I already have Carc, as I said). I was looking through BGG the other day, and aparently "Agricola" is the hot game du jour. Looks a little too "crunchy" for me right now... hell, I don't even really understand how to play Carc!

DSGamer wrote:

I bought Catan and Carcassonne on XBLA and promptly spent about $150 in analog board games. I never would have even considered that had I not first played around with other people online. It was a fun way to learn the games and rediscover something I'd forgotten I enjoyed.

What other games did you pick up?

I bought Backgammon first on XBLA. Then I bought Catan, then Carcassonne, then Ticket To Ride.

After buying Carcassonne, though, I quickly bought the following board games.

Settlers of Catan
Carcassonne
Carcassonne: Inns and Cathedrals
Carcassonne: Traders and Builders
Alhambra
Backgammon
Ticket to Ride
Five Crowns (card game, but a great one)

I think the original Ticket to Ride is the cleanest version, and easiest to teach. That makes it a great game with which to bring people to the hobby.

TTR Europe adds some rules that make for a different flavor, adding some additional randomness to routes and the ability to get around people cutting you off.

TTR Marklin is probably the best one to get after you get into TTR, it adds some more scoring possibilities with passengers, and adds a lot to the base game.

Switzerland is for 2 or 3 only, and requires the base game for components.

looks like the Marklin edition (and maybe Europe?) adds in things like passengers and cargo to the mix.

As for the Switzerland set... I wish ALL the expansions were like this, instead of each being a separate (and expensive) full game. I might check it out, as I'll probably be lucky to ever get more than 2-3 people to play. Looks like the upcoming "Nordic Countries" game is also designed for 2-3 players.

How essential is the "1910 expansion" set?

Only Marklin has the passenger mechanic. Europe has stations (you can put a station in a city, to use the route of another player, as your turn), ferrys (have to use a locomotive in your route), and tunnels (draw three cards from the train deck, if you pull any locos or the color the route, have to lay those additional cards down to finish the route).

1910 is good, but certainly not essential.

As long as the Simply version can handle the expansions, i'd go for it.

here's another question:

If you were going to buy "Settlers of Catan" for the first time, which version would you go with? The mayfair games version (which seems kind of cheaply made) or the SimplyFun "Simply Catan" version (which has both basic and advanced rules, a nice boad, molded plastic cities/settlements/roads, but uses hex "strips" instead of individual hexes)?

IMAGE(http://images.boardgamegeek.com/images/pic195977_md.jpg)

I'm leaning towards the "simply" version... it's on sale right now for $26 from the SimplyFun site ($8 shipping, though).

jonnypolite wrote:

As long as the Simply version can handle the expansions, i'd go for it.

I dunno... how do the expansions interact with the main game?

My guess is that the Simply version *could not* handle the expansions. Some of the expansions involve adding new hex tiles and the Simply version seems to have a fixed number of hex tile spots. My vote would be for the Mayfair version. It's what most people play and it really isn't "cheap", IMHO. I rather like the site. Cool little wooden roads and houses and cities.

Dreaded Gazebo wrote:

Yeah, thoughthammer rocks, although most retailers can't offer much of a discount on Days of Wonder games these days. Unless you are ordering enough other stuff to get free shipping you won't be saving a significant amount by ordering online.

Agreed, and I don't mind helping support my FLGS (Friendly Local Gaming Store) for they are a dying breed in my neck of the woods.

DSGamer wrote:

My guess is that the Simply version *could not* handle the expansions. Some of the expansions involve adding new hex tiles and the Simply version seems to have a fixed number of hex tile spots. My vote would be for the Mayfair version. It's what most people play and it really isn't "cheap", IMHO. I rather like the site. Cool little wooden roads and houses and cities.

Agreed, get the "original" Catan. After some games you'll want the expansions, especially Knights (Seafarers is a pass IMO).

For the original question about Ticket to Ride:
I picked up a copy of the game a few months ago and have played a handful of times.
Like most new games I found myself puzzling through the rules when reading them, but it quickly becomes clear how to play once you actually begin. It's easy to set up and explain, which makes it pretty good for newcomers.
I found playing with two people is fun but a little too fast-paced; It is always your turn or almost your turn and having a few extra rounds before it comes back to you gives more time to agonize over whether the route you want will still be available.

I only have the USA version so I can't speak for what the other additions add. I can definitely recommend the game however. I don't think I have or would play any board game obsessively, the way one might play the same FPS for months, or RPG, or MMO, etc... but rather as part of a rotation, and Ticket To Ride would unquestionably get a spot in the lineup.

As for the price, it's not a local game store, but you can find it on Amazon for $41 with free shipping. That's about the best price I've seen. $40 is a lot more palatable to me than $50 is for some reason.

SommerMatt wrote:
jonnypolite wrote:

As long as the Simply version can handle the expansions, i'd go for it.

I dunno... how do the expansions interact with the main game?

That "simply" version should work with Cities and Knights, since that does not involve additional hex tiles, but it will not work with Seafarers. As Shoal indicated, Cities and Knights is the best expansion, but both are worthwhile. Personally, aside from the XBLA version, I always play with Cities and Knights, and almost always play with Seafarers too. So yeah, you are definitely going to want the Mayfair version (which, by the way, is not cheaply made at all -- the hex tiles are a nice, sturdy cardboard nearly as durable as a typical board and the player pieces are all made of wood which beats plastic in my book any day of the week).

Just a note about playing Ticket to Ride online via Days Of Wonder: You only have to pay (or get an access code via the game box) to host a game. It's free to join a game and play (unless that's changed). That's probably cheapest way just to play a game of TTR, but if you have local people who would play the board version, I'd personally spring for that (and have).

Here is a recent opinion about Simply Catan that I enjoyed from the BGG site (from pkreynolds on his GenCon 2008 list)

My original copy of Catan was due for a replacement, and this streamlined family- and time-friendly version fit my needs perfectly. It's also the best looking version of Catan I've seen, which didn't hurt. Simply Catan is the full version of Settlers with only one difference - rather than separate tiles for the hexes, it has five strips of connected tiles, and a board with the island shape cut out of it, making setup a much quicker affair than with the basic Settlers game. Yes, it reduces the amount of randomness, but since the tiles are double-sided and the number counters are still separate, you've still got plenty of setup options and a more family-oriented version of the game. Additionally, the game uses very nice sculpted plastic roads, villages and cities instead of the basic wooden sticks and blocks. The trade-off of simple setup and nicer appearance was worth the loss of complete randomness in setup for me.

A lady working at GenCon convinced E Hunnie to give Ticket a shot, so I might be picking it up. I've also got Catan and the 6-player expansion, if you want to play at a future S&T.

phragged wrote:

Here is a recent opinion about Simply Catan that I enjoyed from the BGG site (from pkreynolds on his GenCon 2008 list)

My original copy of Catan was due for a replacement, and this streamlined family- and time-friendly version fit my needs perfectly. It's also the best looking version of Catan I've seen, which didn't hurt. Simply Catan is the full version of Settlers with only one difference - rather than separate tiles for the hexes, it has five strips of connected tiles, and a board with the island shape cut out of it, making setup a much quicker affair than with the basic Settlers game. Yes, it reduces the amount of randomness, but since the tiles are double-sided and the number counters are still separate, you've still got plenty of setup options and a more family-oriented version of the game. Additionally, the game uses very nice sculpted plastic roads, villages and cities instead of the basic wooden sticks and blocks. The trade-off of simple setup and nicer appearance was worth the loss of complete randomness in setup for me.

Also, this won't work with any 5/6 player expansions. It really sounds like a game designed for 4 player Settlers alone and I wouldn't be surprised if there were a few issues trying to integrate Knights into it.

Again, thanks for the tips.

Right now, I am a gaming neophyte without much of a player pool... I'm more worried about finding TWO players, and five or six seems slightly beyond the realm of possibility. The "simply" version seems like it will be more than enough for me, but I am a nerd, so I am still drawn to the idea of expansion even if I'll most likely never actually use them.

I'd read a few reviews of the Mayfair 4th edition that said the cardboard was thin, and the pieces didn't lay flat. I don't know if that's a universal feeling, or just one person's opinion.

SommerMatt wrote:

Right now, I am a gaming neophyte without much of a player pool... I'm more worried about finding TWO players, and five or six seems slightly beyond the realm of possibility. The "simply" version seems like it will be more than enough for me, but I am a nerd, so I am still drawn to the idea of expansion even if I'll most likely never actually use them.

Far as Catan goes, I say just stick with the 360 version It's a good game but I've always found it drags on a bit when played in person. Something like Ticket to Ride is far easier to teach to people not into gaming. Catan isn't bad, I just think there are many more interesting games that can be played in the same amount of time or less.

There are a lot of great two player games out there ranging from extremely simple to highly complex. If you think you can round up a second player, check out games like Lost Cities, Mr. Jack, Dynasties, Battle Line, Battlelore/Commands & Colors: Ancients and Tide of Iron. Just to name a few

I don't think the 5-6 versions are too big, way out of the sweet spot. I think 3 player Cities and Knights is the best version of Catan. As for Ticket, I think Marklin is by FAR the best version, although it's *slightly* more complicated than the main game. The rules still fit on two pages though, and it is NOT difficult to teach. Learning the passenger system is a bit tricky, but unless you're REALLY going for pure gateway drug, I think its awesome.

Ah, but you're hardcore, Rabbit. Marklin has more strategy, while the Vanilla TTR has the beauty of the unadulterated core mechanic. They're both awesome.

rabbit wrote:

I don't think the 5-6 versions are too big, way out of the sweet spot. I think 3 player Cities and Knights is the best version of Catan. As for Ticket, I think Marklin is by FAR the best version, although it's *slightly* more complicated than the main game. The rules still fit on two pages though, and it is NOT difficult to teach. Learning the passenger system is a bit tricky, but unless you're REALLY going for pure gateway drug, I think its awesome.

I don't think 5-6 players are "too big." I am saying that I'll never GET 5-6 people to play at the same time

I'm nearly a complete noob to "eurogames" and am just looking for some solid gateway material right now.

Speaking of which, how's MEMOIR '44 in regards to ease of entry?

Mem 44 isn't too difficult to pick up at all.

I got to try out Memoir '44 at Gencon (everyone who was doing the demos was awesome, all the demos I got were a positive experience.)

They were actually showing off the Overlord Expansion, but from my understanding it's mostly the same game but it allows you to go from 2 players to 4 or 6 (1 per side to 2-3 per side) and adds a few new units.

It seemed like a lite version of a tabletop miniatures wargame, and I don't mean that as a slight. We got to play for 45+ minutes and they weren't trying to kick us out, but we didn't get very far. That was on a game that was already set up and laid out before we even arrived.

If we had just bought the game on our own it would have taken far longer, far longer to get started and to play out the few rounds we got to. Of course it lacks the 3D terrain and guys using a tape measure to figure out the range on their artillery, but it's still a much bigger investment than a game like TTR or Catan.

It wasn't overly complicated - you draw a hand of cards that allow you to perform the action decribed on the card. You can play one card per turn, which may allow you to move one, two, four, all of your units (etc...) or use some other ability. The difficult thing is recalling (or learning) how many attack dice you get and the bonuses you get for firing into hills/hedgerows and how many dice you lose for firing from a distance.

It was not an impossibly complex game - we all felt like we were developing a good grasp by the end of our play session - but it's the sort of game you'd get if you had one dedicated friend to game with regularly. It does not seem like a game you could use to introduce friends new to gaming.
Of course, we demoed and picked up Battlelore the next day, which is very similar (it seems a tad more complex actually), so I'll try and remember this thread once I have more than first impression.

Memoir is very easy to get into, the simplest of the whole series, next to Battle Cry (which isn't available anymore). And if you like the system, you can get into more complicated versions like Battlelore or the fantastic Commands and Colors Ancients.

Ok, here's what I have so far:

Amazon is having a special 20% off deal when you buy "toys" and use their "bill me later" payment option. It only works with games that are sold by Amazon, and maxes out at $20.

My cart currently has a copy of SETTLERS OF CATAN (4th ed.), TICKET TO RIDE, and LOST CITIES. With the discount, the price is $74, which seems pretty good. Even if I buy a copy of MEMOIR '44 for $45, it's still cheaper than going through Thoughthammer.