Peter Jackson directs "The Hobbit"

Thats the thing with Tolkien though. He made such a rich mythology you can discuss it although it is one of the 'actual' mythologies from any world culture.

You can become a Middle Earth geek in the same way you can become a Norse mythology geek.

MrDeVil909 wrote:
Grenn wrote:

When fighting Balrogs, death is assured. But if you're strong enough, you can take it with you. That's about the best you can do. Even Galdalf didn't survive his fight.

I never really read it that way, but even so, his resurrection would most likely be due to his divine nature.

I'm pretty sure in the Silmarillion there were some elves who were killing Balrogs left and right.

McChuck wrote:
MrDeVil909 wrote:
Grenn wrote:

When fighting Balrogs, death is assured. But if you're strong enough, you can take it with you. That's about the best you can do. Even Galdalf didn't survive his fight.

I never really read it that way, but even so, his resurrection would most likely be due to his divine nature.

I'm pretty sure in the Silmarillion there were some elves who were killing Balrogs left and right.

Oh, sure, Fingolfin was, but this guy permanantly wounded Morgoth, so he's the exception.

Feanor was wounded by Gothmog, lord of the Balrogs. His sons were able to fight them off long enough to get him back to camp so he could die. Ecthelion and Gothmog later killed each other in the attack on Gondolin. And Glorfindel and a Balrog killed each other in the mountains, buying the Gondolinians or whatever time to escape. I can't think of any other instances where it says Balrogs were killed. Maybe in those great wars, but Morgoth usually kept them in reserve until the Men/Elves/Dwarves got right up to his doorstep, and then he unleashed them with his dragons and hordes he kept in reserve to chase the Allies from his lands.

And I always thought Gandalf died in combat with the Balrog, but was sent back to Middle-Earth because Illuvitar said he wasn't done with Sauron yet. I could have read that wrong though.

Remember that Aragorn gets up to all sorts of stuff between The Hobbit and LOTR, including serving underneath Thengel in Rohan and Ecthelion in Gondor. Also, Gandalf goes into Dol Guldur, Balin goes into Moria. There's a lot of cool stuff they could show, but it's pretty episodic. I have no idea how they'd crowbar it into a three act structure.

I thought I'd read that Sam Raimi was in the director's chair. Is that not a lock, then?

DudleySmith wrote:

I thought I'd read that Sam Raimi was in the director's chair. Is that not a lock, then?

Nothing official yet. I think it's Jackson's wish that Raimi do it. Kinda the student becoming the master type of deal and paying Raimi back for being such a huge influence.

Grenn wrote:
McChuck wrote:
MrDeVil909 wrote:
Grenn wrote:

When fighting Balrogs, death is assured. But if you're strong enough, you can take it with you. That's about the best you can do. Even Galdalf didn't survive his fight.

I never really read it that way, but even so, his resurrection would most likely be due to his divine nature.

I'm pretty sure in the Silmarillion there were some elves who were killing Balrogs left and right.

Oh, sure, Fingolfin was, but this guy permanantly wounded Morgoth, so he's the exception.

Feanor was wounded by Gothmog, lord of the Balrogs. His sons were able to fight them off long enough to get him back to camp so he could die. Ecthelion and Gothmog later killed each other in the attack on Gondolin. And Glorfindel and a Balrog killed each other in the mountains, buying the Gondolinians or whatever time to escape. I can't think of any other instances where it says Balrogs were killed. Maybe in those great wars, but Morgoth usually kept them in reserve until the Men/Elves/Dwarves got right up to his doorstep, and then he unleashed them with his dragons and hordes he kept in reserve to chase the Allies from his lands.

And I always thought Gandalf died in combat with the Balrog, but was sent back to Middle-Earth because Illuvitar said he wasn't done with Sauron yet. I could have read that wrong though.

Balrogs and the Istari (wizards) are both Maiar, something akin to angels. Sauron was also a Maia, so obviously they possess different degrees of power. However, the Balrog and Gandalf were essentially equal in origin so I'm not surprised that they killed each other.

You are right, Gandalf did die and was sent back by Eru Ilúvatar to complete his mission.

souldaddy wrote:
Grenn wrote:
McChuck wrote:
MrDeVil909 wrote:
Grenn wrote:

When fighting Balrogs, death is assured. But if you're strong enough, you can take it with you. That's about the best you can do. Even Galdalf didn't survive his fight.

I never really read it that way, but even so, his resurrection would most likely be due to his divine nature.

I'm pretty sure in the Silmarillion there were some elves who were killing Balrogs left and right.

Oh, sure, Fingolfin was, but this guy permanantly wounded Morgoth, so he's the exception.

Feanor was wounded by Gothmog, lord of the Balrogs. His sons were able to fight them off long enough to get him back to camp so he could die. Ecthelion and Gothmog later killed each other in the attack on Gondolin. And Glorfindel and a Balrog killed each other in the mountains, buying the Gondolinians or whatever time to escape. I can't think of any other instances where it says Balrogs were killed. Maybe in those great wars, but Morgoth usually kept them in reserve until the Men/Elves/Dwarves got right up to his doorstep, and then he unleashed them with his dragons and hordes he kept in reserve to chase the Allies from his lands.

And I always thought Gandalf died in combat with the Balrog, but was sent back to Middle-Earth because Illuvitar said he wasn't done with Sauron yet. I could have read that wrong though.

Balrogs and the Istari (wizards) are both Maiar, something akin to angels. Sauron was also a Maia, so obviously they possess different degrees of power. However, the Balrog and Gandalf were essentially equal in origin so I'm not surprised that they killed each other.

You are right, Gandalf did die and was sent back by Eru Ilúvatar to complete his mission.

Whatever. Radaghast PWNS your face anyway!!! RED FTW!!!

Grenn wrote:

And I always thought Gandalf died in combat with the Balrog, but was sent back to Middle-Earth because Illuvitar said he wasn't done with Sauron yet. I could have read that wrong though.

souldaddy wrote:

You are right, Gandalf did die and was sent back by Eru Ilúvatar to complete his mission.

I always saw it as being more of a case of transcending that actually dying, but it really is a matter of interpretation so I will allow you heretics to have your say.

This is fun, I must read the Silmarrilion again, and all the Unfinished tales etc.

Yeah, I was always fascinated with the Maiar myself, their stories and history.

All this Middle Earth geek talk has me itching to dig up my Silmarrilion, too, DeVil.

Latest round of rumours is showing that Guillermo del Toro may be the director that picks this up.

ranalin wrote:

Latest round of rumours is showing that Guillermo del Toro may be the director that picks this up.

Looks like the rumor has become official now. I think he can pull it off, I just hope he adheres to what Jackson has already done.

I'm a huge fan boi of del Toro's. I believe he has the scope of vision needed for something like this and no doubt he'll step in line with Jackson.

Vega wrote:
ranalin wrote:

Latest round of rumours is showing that Guillermo del Toro may be the director that picks this up.

Looks like the rumor has become official now. I think he can pull it off, I just hope he adheres to what Jackson has already done.

Well, I wouldn't call that "official." All it says is that he's "in talks" to direct the movies. I can't count the number of times I've heard that phrase and then later it turns out a different director is chosen. If we're lucky, it won't be Paul W.S. Anderson.

Maybe this'll go the way of X-Men 3 and they'll get Brett Ratner to direct after a committee of New Line writers "updates" the script.

dhelor wrote:
Vega wrote:
ranalin wrote:

Latest round of rumours is showing that Guillermo del Toro may be the director that picks this up.

Looks like the rumor has become official now. I think he can pull it off, I just hope he adheres to what Jackson has already done.

Well, I wouldn't call that "official." All it says is that he's "in talks" to direct the movies. I can't count the number of times I've heard that phrase and then later it turns out a different director is chosen. If we're lucky, it won't be Paul W.S. Anderson.

I think the deal is to the point of del Toro just needing to say yes and sign on the dotted line. So unless he gets anything else lined up that would conflict i think this is done deal.

Some cool casting news!

Can't imagine anyone else in that spot now anyway.

Woo!

Dang I just assumed it was a given. That is awesome though. Do you think they'll include some stuff from the Silmarillion to fluff it out to 2 movies?

With del Toro gone looks like Jackson is asking for and may see Neill Blomkamp as the director for this now.

I couldn't be happier that del Toro is out. I find his fantasy creatures really offputting and ugly.

Blomkamp works for me much better.

SallyNasty wrote:

I couldn't be happier that del Toro is out. I find his fantasy creatures really offputting and ugly.

Blomkamp works for me much better.

I'm sure they're using Jacksons Weta effect company regardless of who directs.

ranalin wrote:
SallyNasty wrote:

I couldn't be happier that del Toro is out. I find his fantasy creatures really offputting and ugly.

Blomkamp works for me much better.

I'm sure they're using Jacksons Weta effect company regardless of who directs.

Good stuff. Del Toro's aesthetic sensibilities have always put me off, and I was always opposed to his directing the film.

It's too bad. I think Del Toro was the perfect director for the project, if Jackson isn't interested. He gets the fairy tale feeling, plus can handle the dramatic well.

While I loved District 9, I'm not sure about Blomkamp. Don't feel like I know his work enough.

Grenn wrote:
McChuck wrote:

I'm pretty sure in the Silmarillion there were some elves who were killing Balrogs left and right.

Oh, sure, Fingolfin was, but this guy permanantly wounded Morgoth, so he's the exception.

I believe it was more than just Fingolfin, there were at least 3-4 of them. I also thought that one of the first human kings did in a couple. I agree that no one in the fellowship had a chance though, Aragorn doesn't seem to be nearly as powerful as his predecessors, and Legolas is no where near that powerful either.

As far as Istari power levels go, that's really difficult to say. Sauron is obviously more powerful than this random Balrog, and at the beginning Saruman is significantly more powerful than Gandalf. After Gandalf is "reborn" however he is so much stronger than Saruman that he doesn't even try anything, just meekly listens to him.

The question is whether these things are from their own innate power, or whether the wizards are going easy on things. Their purpose was to go to Middle-Earth as mentors and mediators, beings to go teach the men and elves to protect themselves rather than single handedly fight against Sauron. When Gandalf fought the Balrog was he allowed to put forth all of his efforts because he was fighting a peer, or was the Balrog only a match for his weakened form? When he came back was he actually more powerful than before, or did returning as the White Wizard just give him greater freedom to use the powers he already had?

lostlobster wrote:

While I loved District 9, I'm not sure about Blomkamp. Don't feel like I know his work enough.

You've seen District 9. The rest of his work seems to be made up of a few short films that can be seen on youtube. Not a big track record there.

SallyNasty wrote:

I couldn't be happier that del Toro is out. I find his fantasy creatures really offputting and ugly.

Blomkamp works for me much better.

Как будто aliens in District 9 не off-putting and ugly!

Gorilla.800.lbs wrote:
SallyNasty wrote:

I couldn't be happier that del Toro is out. I find his fantasy creatures really offputting and ugly.

Blomkamp works for me much better.

Как будто aliens in District 9 не off-putting and ugly!

Yah but they were supposed to be off-putting and ugly - they were aliens, and that was integral to the plot:)!

But in Hellboy 2, the elves, which are usually beautiful and graceful, came across as albino, emaciated people with cat-eyes:)

Gorilla.800.lbs wrote:
SallyNasty wrote:

I couldn't be happier that del Toro is out. I find his fantasy creatures really offputting and ugly.

Blomkamp works for me much better.

Как будто aliens in District 9 не off-putting and ugly!

Hey man, prawns deserve your respect too.

SallyNasty wrote:
Gorilla.800.lbs wrote:
SallyNasty wrote:

I couldn't be happier that del Toro is out. I find his fantasy creatures really offputting and ugly.

Blomkamp works for me much better.

Как будто aliens in District 9 не off-putting and ugly!

Yah but they were supposed to be off-putting and ugly - they were aliens, and that was integral to the plot:)!

But in Hellboy 2, the elves, which are usually beautiful and graceful, came across as albino, emaciated people with cat-eyes:)

Whose style comes from Mignolia. Just one thing del Toro can be complimented on is his faithfulness to the source he's working with. Now Pan's Labrynth is all him and i can see people being worried some, but personally i thought he was a perfect fit.

Blomkamp while isnt as tested shows with District-9 a nice understanding of pacing and balancing action along with slow emtional beats. With Jackson behind him to keep the story straight the movie is in good hands.

Blomkamp, if he has nothing else to do, needs to go back to making the Halo movie. Those Firefight trailers/shorts were awesome.