Stealth Shooters: A Confession

Forgive me, Father, for I have sinned. Oh boy, have I sinned.

I have a great love for games in which stealth is an option for completing levels. I'll even try games that are a programmed stealth puzzle (like Splinter Cell), or in which gameplay seems to be a way to "earn" lengthy cutscenes (like Metal Gear Solid 2).

But I am a clumsy man, an impatient man, and rarely mindful of my surroundings. In short, I suck at stealth.

I give it a good try, I do. I try to sneak about, obtain disguises, creep along unused pathways to avoid enemies... but it never works. I mean, it goes okay at first, but then comes The Bust. Someone figures out you're there by spotting you, or spotting a body (I always try non-lethal stuff first--honest), or just, I don't know, they're psychic and can smell sucky assassins or something.

After regrouping in a quiet hidey-hole, I try harder to make the stealth thing work. But the guards are now on edge, and so am I. If I somehow pull it out and succeed in my mission without further incident or bloodshed, a cool wave of mingled relief and pride washes through me. More often, though, there comes a second bust, which prompts The Breaking Point. I lose patience with the stealth thing, and the kid gloves come off--for reference, the "kid gloves" are the ones with pockets of sand sewn over the knuckles to knock people out.

The surest way not to be seen is to keep others from seeing anything at all. Death works well for this. Once I have a hidey-hole, I go on hit-and-run operations and wipe out guards and, yes, the occasional innocent. If people get agitated and come after me, I zip back to my sanctuary like a big, creepy funnel spider.

I must confess, I actually enjoy this bit. There's a Warhammer creature called a Sneaky Git, and that's what I like being. Planting bombs, sniping from the darkness--these give me a tittering joy that rivals the sense of accomplishment of being completely stealthy.

The end result is a bloodbath straight from the Standard Manual of Shadowy Arts section on "When Things Go Wrong". But with my objectives accomplished, I feel like the usurping lord of my environment; I take an unhurried, triumphant walk on the now-squishy carpets, admiring my handiwork. Next time, though, next time I will keep my homicidal instincts in check and be totally sneaky.

In the name of Garrett, the Church, and the holy Spector,

HPL

The loci of my sins:

Deus Ex, Deus Ex 2, & Project Snowblind
Thief 2 (The Metal Age) & Thief 3 (Deadly Shadows)
Hitman: Contracts
Tenchu & Tenchu 3: Wrath of Heaven

Verily, I too have sinned.

I feel you on the Splinter Cell.

Playing the Thief games on the highest difficulty level is the only reason I didn't follow suit. There's something satisfying about being able to just leisurely stroll around an entire level because you've, well, depopulated it.

Of course, there was that one time I threw an unconscious guy down a well, and went along with the mission until it inexplicable failed me 5 minutes later because the bastard drowned.

One thing I think makes stealth games unnecessarily hard is how all the enemies become instantly psychic once you're discovered. I mean, I expect them to be on high alert, especially in games where they can communicate via walkie-talkies or something, but if I'm hiding in a box, under a dock, completely still and silent in the pitch black and 30 guys from the level all swarm on me (I would like to point out recklessly abandoning their posts in the process) even though not a single one could have possibly seen me hide... that's just idiotic. Perfect Dark, I'm looking at you.

I've learned that with stealth shooters like Splinter Cell or MGS, it helps to have just a bit of OCD.

NOLF/NOLF2 hooked me on this genre. I so enjoy sneaking about wreaking death from the shadows

Most recent was The Darkness on the 360 in a 100% light controlled Home Theater - fun times!

Don't get me going about Oblivion's psychic guards. I kill one townsfolk while he's sleeping in his house and ZIP!, there's a guard breathing in your face. And every guard in every town throughout the land now has your picture on his clipboard too. (Yes, I loaded the No Psychic Guards mod and it does help a bit.)

Marsman wrote:

Don't get me going about Oblivion's psychic guards. I kill one townsfolk while he's sleeping in his house and ZIP!, there's a guard breathing in your face. And every guard in every town throughout the land now has your picture on his clipboard too. (Yes, I loaded the No Psychic Guards mod and it does help a bit.)

Yeah, I understand, and that's the only thing making me hesitate getting Oblivion. I remember that from the "Halt-halt! Halt-halt!" of Daggerfall. I get it that the designers are trying to nudge you in a particular moral direction, but the GTA "angry hornets" approach is more effective without seeming unrealistic.

NOLF is pointedly not on my list. It has wonderful production values and a great concept. But the on-a-rail level design had one-solution stealth puzzles, eagle-eyed AI, crap collision detection for aiming... and there was no way to lean. No lean! Even Soldier of Fortune had leaning at the same time NOLF came out.

H.P. Lovesauce wrote:

NOLF is pointedly not on my list. It has wonderful production values and a great concept. But the on-a-rail level design had one-solution stealth puzzles, eagle-eyed AI, crap collision detection for aiming... and there was no way to lean. No lean! Even Soldier of Fortune had leaning at the same time NOLF came out.

But it was soooooo campy! How can you not love the camp?

MikeMac wrote:
H.P. Lovesauce wrote:

NOLF is pointedly not on my list. It has wonderful production values and a great concept. But the on-a-rail level design had one-solution stealth puzzles, eagle-eyed AI, crap collision detection for aiming... and there was no way to lean. No lean! Even Soldier of Fortune had leaning at the same time NOLF came out.

But it was soooooo campy! How can you not love the camp? :(

I love the camp! Love it! Love the music, love the cutscenes... it's just the gameplay that didn't do it for me. For me--just for me--things like the "monkey conversation" weren't reason enough to keep plodding through. I mean, same with the RTS Evil Genius; great Austin Powers vibe, but not all that terribly much fun to play.

H.P. Lovesauce wrote:

The surest way not to be seen is to keep others from seeing anything at all. Death works well for this. Once I have a hidey-hole, I go on hit-and-run operations and wipe out guards and, yes, the occasional innocent. If people get agitated and come after me, I zip back to my sanctuary like a big, creepy funnel spider.

In the Thief and Deus Ex games, I did exactly this. Except, in Thief, they were all blackjacked since on Master you can't kill any humans (but you can knock them out indefinitely, so what's the diff?). If a level was too big, I would end up with multiple rooms full of bodies.

I'm actually really good at stealth games, yet most people I've spoken with say they're hard. I think my main advantage is my deep well of patience. I've no problem and even enjoy sitting in a darkened corner (within a game) memorizing guard patterns. So, that's my advice if you want to be a better stealth gamer. Be more patient.

McChuck wrote:

I think my main advantage is my deep well of patience. I've no problem and even enjoy sitting in a darkened corner (within a game) memorizing guard patterns.

Same here, I've spent many hours hiding in the dark watching and listening, memorizing, timing, plotting horrible deaths - then there's days I play stealth games

HP, 100% agree re: Evil Genius - it fed my inner Dr. Evil for a while, but was ultimately unsatisfying.

I too am guilty. I'll blatantly murder every NPC in a Hitman game before you can say fiber wire!

Same here. I have a very shallow pond of patience, which dries up very fast with the heat of a mere LCD screen. When that happens, all hell break loose.

What I hate the most is when you are not allowed to kill anyone in a mission. I always end up grabbing my pistol and still shooting someone in the face, just because he was standing on that nice carpet...mission failed.

Or those nice missions where you are supposed to be super stealthy to make sure no alarms get set off. Those usually end up in me rushing in a room and shooting the guys before they can get to the alarm. If I fail, quickload, if I succeed, quicksave and get ready for the next room.

I liked the stealth of Riddick a lot. You could get some benefits from using stealth, but it was never the only way. In most of the stealth part I would just run from door to door, because the AI tended to miss you while you were running (really action movie like). That was so great.

The games that let you do it both ways are pretty great. Muddling through is always my favorite way to RP.
"Oops! 'Guess I'll just have to shoot everyone!"

This reminds me of Farcry, where supposedly you could sneak your way past. I started playing the game on the 'realistic' setting (whatever the hell that really means) and I simply find it easier to clear the enemies in front and carve a large path through to the end. If I think there's a save point up ahead, I might sprint for it, but otherwise, if I try to stealth, when I get caught -- and it will happen -- I have enemies in all directions, which makes for a pretty quick headshot death.

Guess I'll be the one to kind of revive this thread. I'm going to focus on the AI of guards, etc.

Psychic guards are bad, but I think it's symptomatic of the way AIs cheat. It feels like lazy programming, basically.

Commandos comes to mind. Maybe I felt like I was being cheated on that sometimes, too, but at the very least tehre was an attempt to have each NPC have a field of view and a value put on sounds and how close they were, plus levels of alertness.

Certis kind of puts Tenchu Z up as good for enemy AI. Does it solve any of these problems?

It felt like the earlier Hitman games did a nice job of allowing you to play the casual stealth game. Sneak your way inside the gate and then unleash hell.

Replaying Thief 3 and trying really really hard to be stealthy. Thing is, you can sneak away if there's a "near miss" and someone comes sniffing after you; you can be in the corner, holding your breath, enjoying the tension, rather than having UberGuard automatically knowing where you are. I like the whole "hiding bodies" aspect, and that civilians will run to get guards.

I also like being able to crouch in the shadows and pluck the key off a guard's belt as he passes by two feet away from me.

I'm being really good about the killing. Only did in two private thugs (the mission said to "deal with" them), and a Hammerite guard (okay, he didn't have to die, but he spotted me before I spotted him and he chased me and I felt humiliated).

Yeah I just can't play the Hitman games the right way. The first half a second where I feel like I've been spotted and out comes the shotgun.

H.P. Lovesauce wrote:

...
I also like being able to crouch in the shadows and pluck the key off a guard's belt as he passes by two feet away from me.
...

There's nothing like stealing keys of money bags from guard's belt. I want this kind of feature in other stealth game.

I'll echo the statement of "I suck at stealth games". It probably took me twice as long as it should have to beat the first Metal Gear Solid.

*fwing!* Huh? What was that noise?

-cue me cursing silently as I crouch-waddle my way back to my hiding hole-

The only reason why I kept with Hitman 2 (the only one I ever beat to completion, let alone gave a chance) was, like previously stated, if your cover is blown you can always just pull out your trusty Ballers (also known as personal hand cannons) and literally blow the opposition against the wall. Sure you'd be running for your life for the rest of the mission but at least you'll have more than a water arrow to defend yourself with.

Speaking of Thief, I guess that's why I never got too far with Thief 2 or 3 when I played them.. I suck at stealth, and get pissed off when I'm deep into a mission and my strategy is blown to pieces.

Zaro wrote:
H.P. Lovesauce wrote:

...
I also like being able to crouch in the shadows and pluck the key off a guard's belt as he passes by two feet away from me.
...

There's nothing like stealing keys of money bags from guard's belt. I want this kind of feature in other stealth game.

I think someone asked in the podcast how stealth plays in Oblivion. I can happily attest that I've gotten out of jail this way.

Not that it is a FPS, but the Shadowbane Thief class was uproariously fun to play. Being able to steal the loot off of a monster that someone happened to be fighting was brilliant. You would pop up visible for a couple of seconds, but you hoped that in the massive combat on the screen helped hide your presence long enough to get away and hoped they couldn't track your ass down...

Good evening. Please turn off all your cellphones, and welcome, to Out of Context Theater.

Vrikk wrote:

The only reason ... I ever beat to completion...like previously stated, if your cover is blown you can always just pull out your trusty Ballers... and literally blow the opposition against the wall.

Thank you. This has been the Out of Context Theater edition for August 2008.

Stealth in Oblivion is quite excellent until you become a journeyman. Then people can walk w/in a yard of you, in broad daylight, and you manage to stay hidden. At the lower levels though I spent many an hour sneaking through undead dungeons because I had left all my blunt weapons in my shack near the thieves guild. Combine this with an excellent marksman rating and some decent poisons and you have a beautiful way to play that game... until you level up.

Commandos was a gem. Honest and unforgiving, that one took timing, skill and patience. However, there was no way in hell you could shoot your way out of that one. I still never got through the last French level in Commandos 2.

I hate you, Mex.