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Ongoing discussion of the political news of the day. This thread is for 'smaller' stories that don't call for their own thread. If a story blows up, please start a new thread for it.

Well, I think Sally's perspective puts mine out of play. Thanks for posting that.

Chairman_Mao wrote:

24% over 5 years barely puts them ahead of inflation.

I've increased my pay by about 20% in 22 years, and there's no union for what I do. Never in my career have I gotten a 24% jump, except once early in my career when I doubled my low first job salary into the lower ranks of average for what I did at the time. Ever since then, most years, no raises (not just for me, for everyone), and when they come, 2.5% is considered excellent.

At least the bennies are good. I did get about 7% this year - first time ever - but I suspect that's for retention.

The only paid sick leave I get is when I qualify for disability (which I have not, yet). Otherwise, it's vacation time. The railroad guys are not alone, but they are treated much worse than they should be.

I've never gotten anywhere near a 24% jump myself, even switching jobs. So I'm certainly not downplaying that it's a big jump in terms of raw percent -- although spread out over 5 years... I'd say I've made a jump that significant once in the form of changing jobs twice within five years (and that was really, really dumb luck on my part, not planned at all -- I was insanely fortunate to turn a layoff into a career advancement but until that went through I was physically ill from the stress of the layoff and forced job search).

If I were jealous and self-serving, I'd definitely be telling the rail unions "f*ck off and take your money, ya greedy gits." But I want a solid rising tide for the lower & middle class, it's desperately needed by far too many people. I think part of my attitude is that we're at such a horrible disparity at this point that I don't see things getting forced back into a sensible disparity range unless there's either a revolution of some type or a labor movement so painful and severe that it forces the hand of the government to intervene, which... this is kind of one of those possible moments.

I have a lot of mixed thoughts, but overall I fall into the bucket of "f*ck the oligarchy, it's time to take away their power by force if necessary". I know this makes me rather a fringe extremist, so I'm certainly not expecting to convince anyone; merely sharing my perspective.

Robear, please don't take my responses as having any intention of belittling or invalidating your own perspective. You're one of the voices of moderation I depend upon.

As I understand it, the union contracts lock the rates for life of the contract - so a 5 year contract means your hourly rate stays the same for 5 years.

I typically get a 3-5% raise every year and I would assume most of you do as well. When you compound the raises, that isn't far off from a 24% raise on year 6, but you aren't being made whole for what you could have been making on year 3, but that's collective bargaining for you. This is catching them up(over the course of 5-years), not making them whole.

Again, the bonuses that these CEOs are getting is obscene. Just look at the golden parachutes that the retiring CEOs get - it's publicly available - and ask if the RR workers are getting their fair share.

Railroading does have a lot of benefits - namely, well, the benefits and the RR retirement(which is basically a generous pension).

The Supreme Court heard oral arguments for Moore v. Harper today, which means the existence of US democracy might now have an imminent expiration date.

The union rail engineer that was a guest on the Bad Faith podcast said that the 4 out of 12 unions represent something like 55% of the workers in those unions, so it's not so black and white about how many want to take the deal and move on.

As for the politics, I would rather someone be attacked for doing the right thing and supporting labor, than be attacked for not supporting labor. Especially given how disingenuous the Republicans would be about it. If you're going to be attacked no matter what (and you always are in this climate), show some spine and do the right thing.

Mixolyde wrote:

As for the politics, I would rather someone be attacked for doing the right thing and supporting labor, than be attacked for not supporting labor.

Except the attacks won't be about who supported or didn't support labor.

They'll be about how Democrats ruined Christmas because the gifts for little boys and girls that were supposed to be under the Christmas tree were stuck on trains somewhere.

They'll be about how Democrats caused already high food prices to spike even higher and put even more pressure on working-class Americans because tens of billions of dollars worth of food couldn't be transported and was spoiled with a side of "why, oh, why do the Democrats hate hard-working American farmers?"

They'll be about how Democrats got several hundred thousands to a couple of million workers laid off--just in time for the holidays--because they worked in industries dependent on JIT railroad deliveries of raw materials and components.

They'll be about how Democrats caused every shortage of goods shipped by rail and every price increase going forward. Can't buy a new car? It's the Dem's fault. Can't get construction materials for the new house you're trying to build (or they got more expensive)? It's the Dem's fault.

They'll be about how Democrats caused billions of dollars in loses to the US economy each and every day of the strike and caused the economy--which was already shaky because of inflation--to threaten to tip over or actually tip over into recession.

They'll be about this is concrete proof Democrats are all really communists who hate capitalism, baseball and, apple pie (and the Republican direct marketing campaigns targeting various Hispanic communities about how the Democrats want to turn America into what their families fled will practically write themselves).

It will all be the Democrat's fault and very few people will be saying "It was all worth it to try to give 120,000 railroad workers some sick days."

There are reasons why Congress has nearly century-old laws about managing labor disputes between workers and railroads: the entire economy touches the railroads and as much as some people want those workers to be able to negotiate better contracts a lot more aren't super keen on losing their jobs because of that dispute or having most things they buy get more expensive and much harder to even get hold of.

Well, we certainly wouldn't want Republicans to start saying nasty things about the Democrats for the first time ever.

Imagine how yesterday's run-off election in Georgia might have gone if Democrats had effectively forced a strike. The election was between a highly competent minister and a brain-damaged moron who literally made several women he had affairs with get abortions and Warnock barely eked out the 'W'.

And, as a reminder, this is also a country that made it perfectly clear that they much preferred workers getting sick and dying from COVID over them not being able to get mozzarella sticks or not getting their hair done.

An assload of voters--including those that aren't Republicans--aren't willing to be even slightly economically inconvenienced.

Well we could have passed free child care and a whole bunch of other good stuff 18 months ago that would have helped out a ton of people. Can still blame Manchin for that, or maybe races like this wouldn't have needed a run off

Who’s Behind a West Burnside Storefront Selling Psychedelic Mushrooms at Retail?

I know a couple people who waited in line for six hours at this place last week but prices are outrageous, it’s like $50 for 3.5 grams, but you can *legally* purchase spore syringes online “for microscopy research” for the same price that will produce 4 or 5 times that.
Also the store keeps your ID on file which seems like it should be a deal breaker considering it’s an illegal business.

ruhk wrote:

Who’s Behind a West Burnside Storefront Selling Psychedelic Mushrooms at Retail?

I know a couple people who waited in line for six hours at this place last week but prices are outrageous, it’s like $50 for 3.5 grams, but you can *legally* purchase spore syringes online “for microscopy research” for the same price that will produce 4 or 5 times that.
Also the store keeps your ID on file which seems like it should be a deal breaker considering it’s an illegal business.

$50 for 3.5 grams? Holy sh*t... That's (consults calculator) $1400 for an ounce!

There's some work/science involved in actually growing mushrooms from spores successfully so I guess these people are doing the math (badly) and paying for convenience and/or are so desperate for the therapeutic help that mushrooms can provide that they're willing to go this route. I just hope this store doesn't screw up the progress that's being made towards legalization.

I wonder how long till this place gets shut down.

JC wrote:

There's some work/science involved in actually growing mushrooms from spores successfully

Granted I only tried once but I had great success just dumping the spores in a flowerpot full of compost in the backyard. I saw the ridiculous instructions online that involved more thorough cleaning than medical labs I’ve worked at and thought it was a bit overdone for something that grows naturally in similar climates. Maybe I got lucky.

There is a 75k reward for info on the Moore County power equip shooting. I wonder if any enterprising Rs will be turning their friends in?

karmajay wrote:

There is a 75k reward for info on the Moore County power equip shooting. I wonder if any enterprising Rs will be turning their friends in?

That could buy a lot of meth!

Mixolyde wrote:
karmajay wrote:

There is a 75k reward for info on the Moore County power equip shooting. I wonder if any enterprising Rs will be turning their friends in?

That could buy a lot of meth!

Or, apparently, about five kilograms of psychedelic mushrooms.

Maybe we shouldn't let our citizens go to Russia since they keep arresting them for nothing and getting prisoner exchanges in return

Ethan Hawke could not be reached for comment.

SallyNasty wrote:

I typically get a 3-5% raise every year and I would assume most of you do as well.

OMG no! I've worked in tech since '85 (and some before that), and that's completely atypical for both vendors and contractors, especially on a yearly basis. Maybe - MAYBE - in management but they don't talk about that stuff. I know folks with decades of experience, like myself, with Masters and PhDs, and no f-ing way would any tech company give them 3-5% per year. Much less a pension. That's like time travel back to the '50's.

I was one of a team of 3 that saved a critically important $10B govt system from total failure in the mid-90's, and we all got plaques.

The *only* place I've worked were that *might* happen is in the Financial industry, which is rolling in cash and can afford to pay for retention every year. I was just not there long enough to get the car that was half a year's salary for me, at the time. Maybe if I'd known I would have stayed but things were very uncertain.

If I had gotten a 4% raise each year since, say, '98 (when I moved to a server vendor), I'd be making about 5% more than I do now, but that's after my bonus. So around 20% more on top of that with the bonus. And the only reason I got the "raises" was because I secured a few points each time I changed jobs, not because of raises.

And I have no pension.

That's insane and you are the only person I have ever heard that from. Literally every job i have ever had, as a warehouse worker then logistics manager and then as a contracts manager has had some sort of performance based increase every year as part of the compensation package.

I mean no insult, but I think you should look around at other options if you have no path for increase outside role change. It is a worker's market. I got a 15% raise to change jobs about 18 months ago, and since then have gotten a 4% raise and am about to get another 4% raise next month.

As a state employee I haven't gotten a regular raise in 10 years. A couple of times they have found money for one time bonuses but no consistent pay increases
I am not complaining really. They are great about flexible schedules so I can take kids to the doctor, etc. without a hassle.

I've worked for 8 companies in my field, and spoken with hundreds of people over the years about their compensation, and I'm confident in my assessment of pay in Tech. No one below the level of Director expects a pay raise every year, very few outside Sales get quarterly bonuses, and raises tend to be in the 1%-2.5% range every 3 years or more. And I consistently rate top 1% to 5%! The money goes to execs and shareholders.

This is why most Tech workers change jobs every 2 to 3 years, I guess. I prefer what I know, but many folks I've talked to leave perfectly good jobs where they are high achievers just to get an extra $5K to $10 at another company. Then they discover something wrong with that job and jump again, and again, and again.

I'd rather keep my solid benefits, build a support network where I'm valued and put up with the lower pay.

And my god, yearly raises and possibly bonuses AND a pension? Mcnealy and Ellison would stroke out at the very thought.

I left my last position because I didn't get a raise for three straight years. My job before that, four. Regular raises are NOT typical.

I am seriously stunned to read this. I don't think a lot of my jobs were terribly prestigious, but even as a handler at FedEx I got yearly increases. I am glad for the conversation/education. I guess I have been luckier than I assumed.

FWIW, according to Payscale yearly raises are more common than not, https://www.payscale.com/compensatio...

I once got a 1 dime raise as a Sr Tester. It was somehow more insulting than no raise.
I got a $45 sales bonus once for my contributions on a successful sports video game. It's still the only sales/revenue bonus I've gotten.
Until coming to Amazon my only real pay increases came from quitting for a new job.

I went from 28k to 40k going from my first job to the second
45k to 90k going from my 5th job to Amazon and got a few 3-5% raises there
105k to 95k going to my 6th job at a startup
and 95k to 182k now at Amazon again and working through a promotion along with 4 and 11% raises.

All of the significant changes came from quitting, even the promotion wasn't nearly as significant as moving to a new job. The 11% raise was Amazon 'correcting' its pay compared to Google and has been the most significant raise I've ever gotten. It was driven by the market, not individual performance.

Current job is an exception that actually gives decent annual raises (last one was 11%) but most of the jobs I’ve had the yearly pay increase was a fraction of a percent, if there was one at all, and those that did labeled it as a “merit increase” for performance and it wasn’t guaranteed.

SallyNasty wrote:

Literally every job i have ever had, as a warehouse worker then logistics manager and then as a contracts manager has had some sort of performance based increase every year as part of the compensation package.

My first 12 years in my career, I was traditional IT support (help desk, then desktop, then enterprise desktop). Most years I got a 1-2% raise. On the years I didn't, it was because we got no raise due to "financial hardship" (Spoiler alert: that was bullsh*t, since other parts of the company did get raises and/or bonuses). My only significant pay increases came from changing job positions.

Since switching to healthcare IT, the last ten+ years I've had mostly annual pay increases in the 2-4% range, which is an improvement at least. I also had a couple of really solid opportunities that worked out for me in terms of new job opportunities. My current employer for the past ~4 years has been -- with the exception of 2020-into-2021, understandably, as we were hit pretty hard -- very generous with pay increases as the business does well, which is honestly quite encouraging to see. First company I've worked for where I feel like the employees are actually sharing somewhat reasonably in the company's success.

But the fact that this is in healthcare also rather angers and disgusts me. I've worked in a couple other private sector areas, but healthcare is the one where we're rolling in cash, just... what the f*ck. That's pretty damning of our healthcare system, at least in my limited anecdotal perspective.

One thing to keep in mind is that raises are proportional to how your annual pay compares to the average for your job. I've gotten raises every year, usually 2-5%, but as my pay rose to above average for my job they have gotten smaller and smaller. I know of people who haven't gotten raises in years, BUT they are at the top pay rate for their job.

Tech here. I've only ever received 1 to 3 percent raises. Sometimes nothing. While switching jobs usually got me 20 to 50 percent raises. So I changed jobs ever 2 or 3 years.

Which I hate. Since I've had comfy jobs with good bosses and wished to stay.