Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous

EDIT: I note from the steam achievements that only 8.3% of the people who've played Kingmaker have ever completed it. That feels a very low percentage?

I am surprised it is that high. Witcher 3 is like 25% if I remember right, and I just checked Divinity 2 and it is around 20%.

I've just started act v as an Aeon and this is without a doubt my least-favorite mythic path so far. The spells and abilities are cool, but the flavor's still not doing anything for me, and the time travel aspects are much more minimal than I'd hoped they would be.

Also, neither angel nor legend nor aeon can begin to hold a candle to the azata in terms of cool abilities. The mix of superpowers and the extra companion you get are just amazing. Opens up some incredibly cool builds.

Once I finish with this one, I will probably take a crack at Trickster or Gold Dragon, or maybe I'll go back and try Angel all the way through to the endgame.

Trickster always looked cool to me. There are a good variety of summons IIRC. (like beer golem?)

The Trickster kinda looks like a rogue to the Azata's bard.

Agreed. But not just in the rogue as a class sense. But a rogue in the character sense: mischief, vices, opportunistic. I am just wondering if its chaotic good or chaotic neutral alignment

It can be either, I think. I'm pretty sure the mythic paths work like being the cleric or paladin of a god in Pathfinder; you have to be within 1 step of the "default" alignment for it. So LG for the angel, CG for the Azata, LN for the Aeon, and CN for the Trickster. So you could have a CG Trickster (or a CE one, if you wanted), but the default flavor is probably more CN.

I've so far finished as Angel => Legend and Azata. I'm thinking for Angel (without switching to Legend) and Gold Dragon, I'll just reload my Act V "big decision" save and pick up from there, but Trickster would require starting from the early game again.

Once I knock down Gold Dragon, Angel, and Trickster, I'll have explored all of the options that allow you to be some flavor of Good. I'm not sure if I'll want to try Lich after that or just put the game down. I really don't like playing bad guys in most cases.

The thing that's appealing about Trickster is that I feel like none of the other characters I've played would even consider taking help from Areelu, Nocticula, etc. So I've never seen what happens with any of those choices because it's always "Nope, don't think so, leave me alone, get bent, I don't deal with demons, I don't trust you, nope, nope, nope."

Yeah, no, I'm done with this damn Aeon business. I just got an act V quest that had me banishing

Spoiler:

Woljif (okay, he's a thief, fair enough) but also Arushalae (trying her very hardest to redeem herself) and Seelah (thoroughly and completely redeemed for her past misdeeds as a thief).

Screw this nonsense. The whole "law with no justice or proportionality" thing it wants me to do is really chafing me, though because my Aeon is LG, I can probably reload my save from entering the city and switch to Gold Dragon.

YUP. That's much better. Can tell from the first couple of events with the Gold Dragon that this is MUCH more my speed.

Despite all my frustrations at the end of Kingmaker, I've picked up Wrath of the Righteous in the Epic sale for about $30 (currency conversions allow) using the $10/£10 voucher they give you on top of the sale discount.

Not sure I'll be playing it through straight away, but at that price it felt like a bit of a steal.

Sorbicol wrote:

Despite all my frustrations at the end of Kingmaker, I've picked up Wrath of the Righteous in the Epic sale for about $30 (currency conversions allow) using the $10/£10 voucher they give you on top of the sale discount.

Not sure I'll be playing it through straight away, but at that price it felt like a bit of a steal.

I'll be anxious to hear what you think of it. I find it an improvement from Kingmaker in basically every way.

Timespike wrote:

I'll be anxious to hear what you think of it. I find it an improvement from Kingmaker in basically every way.

"Not sure I'll play it straight away" he says.

Yeah so I'm through the prologue

Spoiler:

Got a proper spanking from the demon that's seducing the Wardstone or whatever she's doing, but I guess that's part of the plot

and it feels like they've spent more time making all the interfaces a lot clearer, although it's still very detailed explanations. I guess my familiarity with how Owlcat present the Pathfinder system helps there.

I've started playing as a Wizard but I'm not sure if I'm happy with that or not. I am giving some thought to restarting as something else but I don't really know what. I did Kingmaker as a Sword Saint / Magus which I enjoyed a lot, this time I want something magical which builds to serious firepower. So far the Wizard does feel very limited early stages but I know that can change fairly rapidly.

The Mystic path stuff is confusing purely because there is zero explanation of what it means at the early stages, or the differences between the different Heaven and Hells and their denizens. You get a reference to it after several conversation choices have already gone through! I like the little warning sign you get when you add items to characters that have "Wasted" bonuses (AC bonuses, that type of thing) - that sort of thing is actually extremely helpful, so you do get the impression they really were listening to the issues a lot of people had with Kingmaker.

But basically, so far so good. I know most of my problems with Kingmaker didn't really start until much later into the game though, so I'm still reserving my judgement a little.

You can play through the end of Act 1 and it feels like a mostly-complete game (length-wise at least). Then, if you want, keep going for 200 hours. Or start over. Or tap out for a bit. I have done the latter 2, working on the first option.

Sorbicol wrote:
Timespike wrote:

I'll be anxious to hear what you think of it. I find it an improvement from Kingmaker in basically every way.

"Not sure I'll play it straight away" he says.

Yeah so I'm through the prologue

Spoiler:

Got a proper spanking from the demon that's seducing the Wardstone or whatever she's doing, but I guess that's part of the plot

and it feels like they've spent more time making all the interfaces a lot clearer, although it's still very detailed explanations. I guess my familiarity with how Owlcat present the Pathfinder system helps there.

I've started playing as a Wizard but I'm not sure if I'm happy with that or not. I am giving some thought to restarting as something else but I don't really know what. I did Kingmaker as a Sword Saint / Magus which I enjoyed a lot, this time I want something magical which builds to serious firepower. So far the Wizard does feel very limited early stages but I know that can change fairly rapidly.

The Mystic path stuff is confusing purely because there is zero explanation of what it means at the early stages, or the differences between the different Heaven and Hells and their denizens. You get a reference to it after several conversation choices have already gone through! I like the little warning sign you get when you add items to characters that have "Wasted" bonuses (AC bonuses, that type of thing) - that sort of thing is actually extremely helpful, so you do get the impression they really were listening to the issues a lot of people had with Kingmaker.

But basically, so far so good. I know most of my problems with Kingmaker didn't really start until much later into the game though, so I'm still reserving my judgement a little.

Yeah, that's a little aggravating the first time through.

Here's what I wish I'd known the first time playing:

Basically up until the end of act II, you are unlocking possibilities and closing them off. In the early part of the game, you can unlock six different mythic paths, but you are free to choose the dialog options from any that you haven't closed off to yourself with you actions.

For example: both the Angel and the Azata are very good-aligned, so if you know you're going to play a good character, you can select options from both of those before you pick one to go with.

You won't actually make that decision until the end of act II. And trust me, it is a very unambiguous event. There's no missing it. Epic, dramatic, etc. Until then, you are free to choose dialog options for any mythic path you haven't closed off. And there are various places you can do that. For example, one mythic path is tied to a specific physical object in the world. If you decide to break that object in a dialog tree, you can't choose that path any more.

Once you have made your decision at the end of act II, you are going to be sticking with that particular mythic path for a while. There's another decision point later in the game (beginning of act V) that allows you to switch paths, and I think with a couple of other specific ones, you'll get a chance somewhere in the middle. But up until that decision point in act II, you are basically every mythic path that you haven't specifically decided you aren't, confusing as that sounds.

The first time I played, I was keen to play an angel, and I was worried up until that decision point in act II that I'd somehow missed it. I hadn't, they just signpost the mythic stuff poorly.

Oh, and if you want a guide to help you navigate the eye-popping, bountiful madness that is the classes in that game, I'll link the spreadsheet I made again so you don't have to dig through back posts. It's here.

Small piece of unsolicited advice: I personally have found that the spell resistance a lot of demons have makes playing a pure caster a little frustrating. The builds I've wound up sticking with in my playthroughs have mixed weapons and spellcasting.

Trickster is tied to a single dialogue option in a side quest early in the game.
So if you think you want to go trickster I will spoil it for you here:

Spoiler:

After you reach the surface again, in the black library some soldiers are trying to burn the storyteller and some crusaders. (on a pile of books I believe) Choose the trickster dialogue option here and you will have the option to choose the trickster mythic path.

Bought this last week full edition using Epic's coupon for 6 bucks, what a difference from PoE which I was completing last couple of weeks.

I like this game's writing a bit more, characters arent squinting and being subtle at every damn sentence they say, as PoE does to no end (I like PoE in general as a BG update of sorts, but the world building and the writing I'm not that invested in)

So far I can say I really like the interface, it reminds me a lot of Kingdom Come: Deliverance in it's medieval - illustrated tome style. The pace is glacially slow for a change, but I enjoy knowing at all times during combat what my party is exactly doing.

Edit with +20 hours

Dear Shelyn I love it!

The "Barony" really turns this game on its side and into its own different kind of beast, I can only assume a single playthrough would require 150-200 hours to complete. Wow.

Still, I love the game so far, it has rough edges in that are easily forgivable, I really like its humour (Most Honest Guy!)

What the game doesn't do well is caring for the player's well being, as in please dear god game, don't make me right-click and drop items one by one when I'm encumbered, or having to click the little drop-down arrow in the weapon slots in order to close it if I happen to have it opened because I had to change weapons. In those kind of instances, it's not the best modern BG-inspired RPG, but I think the rest of the experience diludes this kind of oversights / not-inspired interface design decisions.

Pathfinder: Kingmaker is todays free game on Epic games store.

Wow!
Be sure to spend the $$$ to get the Beneath the Stolen Lands DLC...

Feeank wrote:

Bought this last week full edition using Epic's coupon for 6 bucks, what a difference from PoE which I was completing last couple of weeks.

I like this game's writing a bit more, characters arent squinting and being subtle at every damn sentence they say, as PoE does to no end (I like PoE in general as a BG update of sorts, but the world building and the writing I'm not that invested in)

So far I can say I really like the interface, it reminds me a lot of Kingdom Come: Deliverance in it's medieval - illustrated tome style. The pace is glacially slow for a change, but I enjoy knowing at all times during combat what my party is exactly doing.

Edit with +20 hours

Dear Shelyn I love it!

The "Barony" really turns this game on its side and into its own different kind of beast, I can only assume a single playthrough would require 150-200 hours to complete. Wow.

Still, I love the game so far, it has rough edges in that are easily forgivable, I really like its humour (Most Honest Guy!)

What the game doesn't do well is caring for the player's well being, as in please dear god game, don't make me right-click and drop items one by one when I'm encumbered, or having to click the little drop-down arrow in the weapon slots in order to close it if I happen to have it opened because I had to change weapons. In those kind of instances, it's not the best modern BG-inspired RPG, but I think the rest of the experience diludes this kind of oversights / not-inspired interface design decisions.

I really enjoyed Octavia and Jubilost in particular among the companions. It's definitely a fun game. All my time with WotR has me contemplating going back to it, but I'd miss turn-based mode so badly, I'm not sure I can.

Use the turn based mod?

Kingmaker has turn-based mode. I gather it was added after release, maybe for the Enhanced Edition?

Turn-based is the only way I have played it, but I was late getting around to starting it.

started playing this - it's ok! It's pathfinder, so i automatically loathe its unnecessarily crunchy rules-set , but at least i can drop the difficulty and generally ignore that. so far... it's 'aright.

one thing though - can you turn off the constant creature statblock popups on mouse-over? it is REALLYannoying to have that cover half the screen every time you're trying to target a creature.

pyxistyx wrote:

one thing though - can you turn off the constant creature statblock popups on mouse-over? it is REALLYannoying to have that cover half the screen every time you're trying to target a creature.

In Kingmaker this was 'inspect mode' and toggled with 'Y' or the 'eye' icon in the bottom left. I haven't played WOTR yet but from what I've read it's pretty much the same.

I also played Kingmaker with the difficulty turned way down; I'm interested in playing with the rule set but not as a tactical puzzle game.

qaraq wrote:
pyxistyx wrote:

one thing though - can you turn off the constant creature statblock popups on mouse-over? it is REALLYannoying to have that cover half the screen every time you're trying to target a creature.

In Kingmaker this was 'inspect mode' and toggled with 'Y' or the 'eye' icon in the bottom left. I haven't played WOTR yet but from what I've read it's pretty much the same.

I also played Kingmaker with the difficulty turned way down; I'm interested in playing with the rule set but not as a tactical puzzle game.

Definitely can be toggled. Agreed on the super annoying part.

ah cool ta! I'll fix that next time i boot it up.

Ahh, didn't realize this was the thread for the sequel, I had this idea that WOTR was a DLC for the original game and the thread had changed its title because of it. Still, love this game even thou my Barony failed on the second Seldon Crisis* called season of the Bloom, I have to go back to a save before the downward spiral kicks in and try to salvage it. Still, looking forward to try WOTR after this one!

*for the Asimovians in the crowd

Its the thread for both. The title change happened because the sequel was released and we all had LOTS of things to say about it