[Discussion] Impeachment, Legacy, and Discussion of Individual 45

Though noted as discussion, news, debate, and all things related to events that occurred during the Tr*mp administration can go here. The scope of this thread is specific to the former administration and it's hangers-on in the aftermath of the shift in power for the United States and impacted areas worldwide.

Pillow Man wrote:

we have precedent in our county, every single elected official in the history of the United States...when you find out, fraud overrides, a crime overrides everything, so the real winner always gets put back in.

[laughs in Al Gore]

Vrikk wrote:
SallyNasty wrote:

Everything he says makes me respect his supporters lesssigns ossible. Apparently the bottom keeps going lower).

Yup. Every single time I read whatever DJT spews, I laugh harder at the rubes that voted for him, and I feel more confident that I will never let one willingly into my house.

We should sell yard signs and doormats. "No Trump Voters allowed" or something.

Welcome!*
* Except Trump voters

Man, that was some comma use. Does he speak in Christopher Walken?

H.P. Lovesauce wrote:
Pillow Man wrote:

we have precedent in our county, every single elected official in the history of the United States...when you find out, fraud overrides, a crime overrides everything, so the real winner always gets put back in.

[laughs in Al Gore]

If this is the way it works then we have to undo the Iraq War, the Afghanistan War, all the judicial picks after 2000. I like this way of thinking. It rocks.

hbi2k wrote:

Trump's followers believe in him the way fundamentalist Christians believe in the Bible. Which is to say, they believe what they imagine or hear at third hand that it says, and seldom think to consult the primary source.

That's not completely true. A fairly significant reason why his supporters love him and back him to the hilt is because he pisses people like everyone here (including myself!) off. Every moment of his political relevance is a gigantic f*ck you to liberals.

Trump's great week is continuing.

Kremlin papers appear to show Putin’s plot to put Trump in White House

The Guardian wrote:

Vladimir Putin personally authorised a secret spy agency operation to support a “mentally unstable” Donald Trump in the 2016 US presidential election during a closed session of Russia’s national security council, according to what are assessed to be leaked Kremlin documents.

The key meeting took place on 22 January 2016, the papers suggest, with the Russian president, his spy chiefs and senior ministers all present.

They agreed a Trump White House would help secure Moscow’s strategic objectives, among them “social turmoil” in the US and a weakening of the American president’s negotiating position.

Russia’s three spy agencies were ordered to find practical ways to support Trump, in a decree appearing to bear Putin’s signature.

By this point Trump was the frontrunner in the Republican party’s nomination race. A report prepared by Putin’s expert department recommended Moscow use “all possible force” to ensure a Trump victory.

Western intelligence agencies are understood to have been aware of the documents for some months and to have carefully examined them. The papers, seen by the Guardian, seem to represent a serious and highly unusual leak from within the Kremlin.

The Guardian has shown the documents to independent experts who say they appear to be genuine. Incidental details come across as accurate. The overall tone and thrust is said to be consistent with Kremlin security thinking.

The Kremlin responded dismissively. Putin’s spokesman Dmitri Peskov said the idea that Russian leaders had met and agreed to support Trump in at the meeting in early 2016 was “a great pulp fiction” when contacted by the Guardian on Thursday morning.

The report – “No 32-04 \ vd” – is classified as secret. It says Trump is the “most promising candidate” from the Kremlin’s point of view. The word in Russian is perspektivny.

There is a brief psychological assessment of Trump, who is described as an “impulsive, mentally unstable and unbalanced individual who suffers from an inferiority complex”.

There is also apparent confirmation that the Kremlin possesses kompromat, or potentially compromising material, on the future president, collected – the document says – from Trump’s earlier “non-official visits to Russian Federation territory”.

The paper refers to “certain events” that happened during Trump’s trips to Moscow. Security council members are invited to find details in appendix five, at paragraph five, the document states. It is unclear what the appendix contains.

“It is acutely necessary to use all possible force to facilitate his [Trump’s] election to the post of US president,” the paper says.

This would help bring about Russia’s favoured “theoretical political scenario”. A Trump win “will definitely lead to the destabilisation of the US’s sociopolitical system” and see hidden discontent burst into the open, it predicts.

Prederick wrote:
hbi2k wrote:

Trump's followers believe in him the way fundamentalist Christians believe in the Bible. Which is to say, they believe what they imagine or hear at third hand that it says, and seldom think to consult the primary source.

That's not completely true. A fairly significant reason why his supporters love him and back him to the hilt is because he pisses people like everyone here (including myself!) off. Every moment of his political relevance is a gigantic f*ck you to liberals.

Why not both.jpg.
Obviously there are outliers and opportunists but on the whole Trump supporters pick and choose what they like and ignore everything else. Ask a random Trump supporter what they view as Trump’s ton ten successes in office and one or two things might be something he actually did, the rest will be a mixture of things Trump mentioned off the cuff during rallies or press conferences and then immediately forgot about, and things that are just made up fantasies.
I’ve seen people insist that Trump finished his border wall but Biden had it taken down before anyone could see it.

Surprising no one....

Republicans throw a tantrum and leave....

Pelosi said in a statement Wednesday she was vetoing the appointment of two of the five Republicans appointed by McCarthy, Reps. Jim Jordan of Ohio and Jim Banks of Indiana. Both are allies of Trump and had objected to the certification of the November 2020 election in the House on January 6. McCarthy had selected Banks, the chairman of the Republican Study Committee, to be the top Republican on the panel.

"With respect for the integrity of the investigation, with an insistence on the truth and with concern about statements made and actions taken by these Members, I must reject the recommendations of Representatives Banks and Jordan to the Select Committee," Pelosi said. "The unprecedented nature of January 6th demands this unprecedented decision."

Pelosi is doing the right thing. I'm just surprised she did it.

Jim Jordan is a jackass, so good. Can't wait until his district gets reorged. Eventually. Right?

garion333 wrote:

Jim Jordan is a jackass, so good. Can't wait until his district gets reorged. Eventually. Right?

We can hope.

There is no amount of gerrymandering that would get that jackass out of that part of Southern Ohio, better known to its neighbors as wannabe Kentucky.

UpToIsomorphism wrote:

There is no amount of gerrymandering that would get that jackass out of that part of Southern Ohio, better known to its neighbors as wannabe Kentucky.

Jordan's district is in Northern Ohio, just outside of Cleveland.

Southern Ohio has Steve Chabot and Brad Wenstrup--both MAGA f*cks--because everything outside of Cincinnati and some suburbs is blood red.

Hah! Many conservatives in my part of Southern California are fleeing to Ohio and Colorado in droves. I’m convinced that in the future it’s going to be looked at as white flight. This time it might be a good type of white flight. Except that real estate is so expensive here that those fleeing whites might just get replaced with even wealthier whites rather than having a diversifying effect. Time will tell.

Colorado has long had an influx of folks from California.

I don't know why anyone leaving SoCal would choose Ohio simply based on weather. Go to Texas instead.

Trump’s PAC collected $75 million this year, but so far the group has not put money into pushing for the 2020 ballot reviews he touts

Washington Post wrote:

Former president Donald Trump’s political PAC raised about $75 million in the first half of this year as he trumpeted the false notion that the 2020 election was stolen from him, but the group has not devoted funds to help finance the ongoing ballot review in Arizona or to push for similar endeavors in other states, according to people familiar with the finances.

Instead, the Save America leadership PAC — which has few limits on how it can spend its money — has paid for some of the former president’s travel, legal costs and staff, along with other expenses, according to the people, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe the group’s inner workings. The PAC has held onto much of its cash.

Even as he assiduously tracks attempts by his allies to cast doubt on the integrity of last year’s election, Trump has been uninterested in personally bankrolling the efforts, relying on other entities and supporters to fund the endeavors, they said.

The tactic allows Trump to build up a war chest to use in the 2022 midterms on behalf of candidates he favors — and to stockpile cash for another potential White House run, an unprecedented maneuver for a former president.

...

A spokeswoman for Trump did not answer questions on whether the group is considering putting money into the ballot review efforts. The group will have to publicly disclose its fundraising and spending for the first half of the year by July 31.

Since leaving office, Trump has repeatedly pushed for various states to overturn the election results, sending out a blizzard of statements with unsubstantiated claims of voter fraud. He has consulted with state officials in Arizona, Pennsylvania and Georgia, and has described state ballot reviews as the key to prove he won the 2020 election. And his political group has repeatedly urged donors to give by claiming that Trump is working to protect their vote — fundraising pitches that his advisers say remain the most lucrative.

“We need you to join the fight to SECURE OUR ELECTIONS!” reads one Facebook ad.

...

Trump launched the group after the election, and it quickly raised $31.5 million last year as he blasted the integrity of the vote, but had spent little of its haul by Jan. 1, according to its public disclosure for that period.

Trump has told some advisers that he wants to keep a large bank account to show strength for a potential 2024 campaign. He continues to tell advisers that he will probably run for president again, though some in his orbit suspect he will not. Some advisers have also urged him to save the money for travel next year to barnstorm the country on behalf of candidates he has endorsed.

“That is probably the most lucrative thing he’s had in terms of cash flow since the Plaza casino in Atlantic City,” said Tim O’Brien, a Trump biographer and frequent critic. “This is just as lucrative. He has recognized because of what happened after the election — he can make money as a candidate.”

Besides fundraising, Trump has begun renting the massive trove of data that his campaign amassed to other candidates he supports in exchange for a share of their fundraising revenue, according to people familiar with the deal. That could ultimately prove another valuable cash flow for him.

The $31.5 million his Save America leadership PAC took in last year doesn't include the $255.4 million his presidential PAC and the RNC took in after the election to the end of the year.

My crystal ball says: Trump will spend all of this money traveling the country in order to continue the grift. The only way he runs for President again is if, by doing so, the grift results in more money.

I’m praying that diet and life style choices decide for him.

Of course it's a grift. It always has been. He preys on his misinformed, ignorant white voters who think that he actually cares about them.

He would not be caught dead talking to one of the MAGA idiots if it didn't personally enrich his business or brand, and they are too stupid to realize that the grift continues after the election.

I don't think Trump actually thinks he won the election. He's mad that it makes him look weak, and he lost of the power of the Presidency.

Vrikk wrote:

[i]I don't think Trump actually thinks he won the election. He's mad that it makes him look weak, and he lost of the power of the Presidency.

I get the feeling Trump's ego absolutely cannot deal with the fact he lost and that makes him extremely susceptible to believing "explanations" about why that happened.

I mean part of the Ukraine scandal was Trump's belief in the conspiracy theory that it was really Ukrainians who interfered in the 2016 election and they interfered to help Hillary. That was a very convenient story for Trump because it negated reality--that Russia interfered and did so to help him--and let him continue to believe that he won solely because he's better/more popular/etc.

Then there was him reacting to being called bunker boy by having protestors violently removed just so he could pose for a propaganda pic (all while internally calling for the leaker to be uncovered and executed).

garion333 wrote:

Colorado has long had an influx of folks from California.

I don't know why anyone leaving SoCal would choose Ohio simply based on weather. Go to Texas instead.

People from California I think, are the United State's first "climate refugees". I left SoCal cause it was way too hot, and getting hotter for longer every year.

All border crises are climate crises now.

McCarthy made news today for blaming Pelosi for "not protecting the Capitol".

It struck me as insincere as Tim McVeigh or Terry Nichols blaming Janet Reno for not protecting the children in the Murrah Building day care.

Twitter suspended the Maricopa Arizona Audit and the Audit War Room accounts. They also shut down audit accounts for Nevada, Georgia, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.

Paleocon wrote:

McCarthy made news today for blaming Pelosi for "not protecting the Capitol".

It struck me as insincere as Tim McVeigh or Terry Nichols blaming Janet Reno for not protecting the children in the Murrah Building day care.

This was always going to be one of their approaches because of how the capitol police and other security is aligned. It's all BS and has been debunked, but it sure gives them a nice sound bite to feed MAGA nation.

I wish someone would just start playing on repeat McCarthy's video and comments about Jan 6th the day it happened.

I look forward to him being subpoenaed as well

JC wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

McCarthy made news today for blaming Pelosi for "not protecting the Capitol".

It struck me as insincere as Tim McVeigh or Terry Nichols blaming Janet Reno for not protecting the children in the Murrah Building day care.

This was always going to be one of their approaches because of how the capitol police and other security is aligned. It's all BS and has been debunked, but it sure gives them a nice sound bite to feed MAGA nation.

I wish someone would just start playing on repeat McCarthy's video and comments about Jan 6th the day it happened.

I look forward to him being subpoenaed as well

Pretty much since Jan 7 there have been Republicans claiming that Trump tried to call in the Nat’l Guard but Pelosi cancelled the deployment orders until after the undercover antifa provocateurs tricked the crowd into storming the Capitol.

ruhk wrote:
JC wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

McCarthy made news today for blaming Pelosi for "not protecting the Capitol".

It struck me as insincere as Tim McVeigh or Terry Nichols blaming Janet Reno for not protecting the children in the Murrah Building day care.

This was always going to be one of their approaches because of how the capitol police and other security is aligned. It's all BS and has been debunked, but it sure gives them a nice sound bite to feed MAGA nation.

I wish someone would just start playing on repeat McCarthy's video and comments about Jan 6th the day it happened.

I look forward to him being subpoenaed as well

Pretty much since Jan 7 there have been Republicans claiming that Trump tried to call in the Nat’l Guard but Pelosi cancelled the deployment orders until after the undercover antifa provocateurs tricked the crowd into storming the Capitol.

I remember pointing out to my state senator how No that isn't an Antifa tattoo, that's from a video game.

How could the Speaker countermand orders from the CiC?

Nevin73 wrote:

How could the Speaker countermand orders from the CiC?

It's been 40 years since Reagan's "welfare queens" and the nine scariest words. Logic from Republicans is waiting for a train that don't come.

My buddy believes the Welfare Queens are still a major factor. Democrats keep them going to get their votes. Pay for play, baby!

Prompting the question of why is he still your buddy? The past four years should be proof enough that humoring otherwise okay people on this stuff won't work. They won't pick you over Q when it comes down to it.