Outriders - Catch All

Maclintok wrote:

I would like to do co op more but the matchmaking system is fraught with long loading screens. And when a host bounces its back to more long loads. This is on PS4 anyway so I’m sure it’s much less of a hassle on PS5.

This is for PC as well. It's actually my top concern for the game because i suspect it's NAT issues, but they had 0 ways of showing what your setup was.

ranalin wrote:
AcidCat wrote:
ranalin wrote:
AcidCat wrote:

The gameworld itself is disappointing. Just small arena style areas broken up by awkward loading interruptions like jumping a small gap or climbing a small ledge. This kind of world design feels like a relic of past gen when compared with the likes of Division 2 or Destiny 2. After playing some more tonight Im definitely waiting on a deep discount before I think about a purchase.

It's almost like they took one of the bigger complaints of those 2 games and decided to base their game on the more popular Diablo design instead... Go figure.

Complaints? This literally makes no sense to me, but if you like the archaic structure of this gameworld Im not gonna argue with preference.

One of the biggest complaints i've seen leveled at Destiny and Division was their map design and how everyone is tired of how big and open they are.

I have literally never seen anyone complain about this, in fact quite the opposite, but these things are anecdotal by nature so, agree to disagree on our perception of this issue.

I've enjoyed it quite a bit. Have had a few bugs and some of the mechanics are a bit wonky. Played MP with zero issues with a fellow member of GWJ via Steam. It was a lot of fun. It is definitely more tightly focused than other looter shooters, but I like that. I will say the devs have been very forthright that this isn't a cover shooter, cover is designed for a brief respite to regen powers or get a lay of the land. The world tiers are no joke and until you have all blue and green gear, anything over 4 is problematic especially bosses. The game is exactly what I hoped it would be and I look forward to the full release; Diablo with guns. That being said I derive my joy from the playing of games not from deriding games or others enjoyment of it. As the byline of this forum says: Anytime reality gets in the way of fun, fun wins. - Warren Spector

I'm very interested in this game. I'm loving the story so far. I also really prefer 3rd person games. I'm only like 40 minutes in, though - haven't even finished the prologue.

But seriously, as hardcore sci fi buff, I'm REALLY liking the story thus far.

I’m actually okay with the story. There’s some bad delivery, leaps in logic, and way too much attitude from certain characters BUT I was legitimately surprised by a few things and there’s just enough intrigue to push me through.

And it is only the first 3 hours of a purported 20 hour game...

I will finally be able to try it tomorrow. So yay me!
Can't wait.

I've read impressions that the one class that thrives without cover is the one that plays the "way the game should be played". And that playing that class (devastator) will help grok how to play the other classes better. I don't know if this holds as well with the other aggressive play style class, the trickster. I'd wager it does.

I am feeling stronger about this game but the complaints remind me to a lesser degree of the complaints for Hellgate London. Though it appears that legendaries address skill impotency a lot in this game.

Technomancer with an auto-sniper w/ vulnerability on it, three pieces of gear with buffs to Blighted Rounds (30% extra critical damage, 40% of damage done as healing to all party members when skill ends, and a buff that makes blighted rounds last 2 magazines instead of 1). At world Tier 5 I’m grinding the Terra Firma mission for a Legendary and killing the mini-boss there in one clip of the auto-sniper before he can even proc a skill. The final altered boss goes down in less than 20 seconds. I hope they keep some of these broken builds in the full release

I have an auto rifle that leeches 13% of the damage as health. Seems unfair, but I’ll take it.

I also haven’t seen anything about the crafting system so I think that will be an interesting wrinkle to add to the mid/late game.

Just read up a bit and they haven’t talked about it too much but looks like they have a lot of smart features in crafting like being able to upgrade loot rarity.

Others I’d hope for would be the ability to craft specific loot with abilities too. For example if I wanted a better version of my blighted round healing pants I could deconstruct a pair with that ability and then craft a new one with bonus firepower. While I can’t see any reference to this being a mechanic I suspect it might be in the game because of the smart ways they’re pulling best practices from all of the looter genres (broad world tier system, lots of fast travel points, simplified stats systems (you either spec into firepower which is a % buff to gun damage, anomaly power is a % buff to ability power, or Max health increased), auto loot filters, etc.)

One thing I saw from the videos is if a weapon or armour has a mod on it that you like, dismantle it, and the mod goes into storage for you to put on another weapon/armour.

Yeah crafting a dismantling mods will add another layer of flexibility for builds. Really exciting stuff in the release!

I played the demo with Higgledy for about an hour & enjoyed it a decent amount. My worries are the level design, lots of waist high cover in nearly every area, some cover you can't actually go into, generic looking base, far too many cutscenes interrupting gameplay. I thought the male voice actor was actually pretty decent, the writing isn't great but it has the odd moments of interest.

The sphere ability that slows down time with the Trickster (if memory is serving me correct) is pretty satisfying & can change the flow of a battle. The guns felt fairly punchy & solid, not Destiny level good but still they felt good. I had the same problem someone mentioned earlier with the tricksters 'temporal slice' it just didn't seem to register hitting enemies at times.

I'd probably get the game on a fairly hefty sale but I'll definitely not be spending £50 on it. I can see this getting a lot of 6's & 7's. I hope it turns out better than my initial impressions.

Warming up to this. I think the Devastator is more my speed right now and what fangblackbone said earlier appears to be holding true for me.

I stopped treating sticky cover as a core mechanic and felt the 'combat sandbox' flow a whole lot better. Their sticky cover system is jank. Sometimes I can stick, sometimes I can't. Sometimes I unstick without knowing why. I wonder if they can just refactor the game to remove sticky cover and replace it with a crouch toggle while also allowing you to sprint into a slide by crouching. Lol. Yeah way too late for that. I think other games like Rogue Company do cover nicely by allowing you to crouch behind low cover and if you hold down LT it will let you peek up from cover to shoot.

Shotgun still feels the best, followed by LMG, snipers, assault rifles and lastly, pistols.

I do hope they add the screen shake and motion blur toggles to the final game. It is already a very busy game visually, the motion blur and not-totally-smooth framerate just tires out my eyes quite quickly.

Will keep grinding away but on the whole this game has progressed from a 'meh' to an 'okay, I'm willing to see what comes next'.

The classes play very differently from one another.

I started with the pyromancer, and had trouble getting into the flow of the class. Just never sat right. I then switched to the technomancer, and it just felt better.

One thing they don't tell you about the technomancer is that you can aim some of your bots by holding it and then releasing.

If you are interested in grinding out some legendaries & epics in preparation for the full game - there are some decent guides on YouTube. I had a legendary drop and it was pretty game changing. I find the powers interesting and the classes fairly unique. I really have enjoyed the Trickster and the gear synergy. Going to start a Devastator next and evaluate the playstyle. My intent is to have one of each at final release, but my main is most likely going to stay the Trickster.

I agree with the wonkiness on the cover system and the motion blur could certainly be toned down. I am really looking forward to the crafting system. I hope the game does well as it is hitting a sweet spot for me and would like to see DLC/sequels in the future.

I wonder if they can just refactor the game to remove sticky cover and replace it with a crouch toggle while also allowing you to sprint into a slide by crouching.

This. It is such a simple solution that works. I will note that enemies seem to be invulnerable in cover. No 2 pixel head shots sadly

I chose the technomancer and I feel that the story mission once you get to the base works counter to their skills. Lots of lobby things in a tight monster closet with low ceilings.

I also question that world tier 2 is supposed to be easy but definitely is anything but. I know gear will make a difference in this game but their needs to be adjustments when you don't have gear at the start. I assume the chosen starting powers of the classes will have a lot to do with that as well.

I will have to check the settings to see if there are different cursor options. I lose the cursor a lot in the enemies in tight and close quarters which means I tend to frustratingly empty clips into nothingness.

I've only spent an hour or so with the game. I need to see more. I need to get a feel for the classes. I only reached level 4 with the techno so there is more levels there and I just unlocked the next skill that I think is the combo mini gun or rocket launcher.

I do like what I see so far and it seems like I am benefiting from turning off the audio. The story seems fine and is probably enhanced without the supposed janky voice acting.

Okay so I'm back and...

You will have the most fun from the start with the devastator. (and second the trickster)
-devastator has hp regen that triggers when you kill something close to you
-devastator has an easy to use skill that ignores cover and height or ceiling collision issues
-devastators 3rd power is the gravity leap that everybody and their brother is going to have a blast with

-trickster starts off with a shield
-trickster's first skill is a powerful cone (melee skills are critical so far)
-trickster has a teleport "backstab" that is brutal with a shotgun
-trickster 2nd skill is a slow time bubble and it rocks
-trickster I did the first side quest and looted a life leech smg and it helped a lot with elites and bosses

-pyro has probably the most difficult start
-pyros 1st skill is a nicer version of the devastator's
-pyros only way to heal is to shoot enemies marked by skills
-pyros 2nd skill is powerful but unclear at first; it marks and paralyzes a target
-pyros 3rd skill explodes on target death doing a ton of damage

-techno has better healing options than pyro otherwise it would have a worse start
-techno 1st power is nice but its a grenade so it is difficult to aim indoors and bounces erringly a lot
-techno 2nd skill again has problems; it is a freeze turret which sounds awesome but it has severe LOS issues

techno was the first class I played so I have learned more about the game and will go back and try it again. But if you are just starting off or one of the classes didn't click, try a Devastator or Trickster for sure.

Not mentioned but Techno's melee is a AoE freeze and you can also do a running ground pound that freezes in a pretty wide arc. I wish I had known that earlier. Also, it's 3rd power is another turret that shoots a very fast missile barrage.

I will note that I have not figured out the "melee" key if there is one. Any of the melee powers I describe are class skills. If there is a "melee" key which I think I saw videos that it does different things whether you are sprinting or backtracking.

If that is the case then a lot of classes will work a lot better. (pyro and techno I kept on saying I wish I had a melee button, followed closely by a grenade button) Still, you can't beat hp regen on kill and having a shield+slomo skills.

Also FWIW I don't get the complaints about the level design. Maybe I am just so familiar with Diablo and what they are trying to do that it doesn't phase me.

Melee is F on the keyboard. Push right stick on controller. Melee is very important for Technomancer against the melee guys or Breachers. Damages and freezes for several seconds.

Sorry for the wall of text. I guess I am excited and having fun.
I went back to the technomancer and it just doesn't work for me at this point solo. I can definitely see that they weren't kidding with the "support class" descriptor. I found the melee skills and they are great but the other techno skills just don't work indoors. The cryo turret mostly just sits there or fires into the top of cover. The frost grenade thing gets stuck on ceiling lights or hits in front of cover. The rocket barrage is devastating but only hits in a line so it missing most moving targets. I guess maybe I should throw the grenade at the floor and use it like a melee aoe. It'd probably be more effective that way

By contrast, the pyro is a lot more fun but suffers from feast and famine. When there skills are available they are monsters. When the skills are on cooldown, well I did buy a life leech weapon and that has helped but their options are limited. If goes that way with their healing as well, feast or famine. I find myself constantly getting beat down and then one of my skills goes off and I am full again.

For whatever the reason people don't like the arena level design, it does offer what I'd call twitch tactics. This was especially so with the pyro as there were several areas that were designed in such a way that you had to choose how you were going to climb the mountain. Some classes might be less discriminant climbers but the pyro tried 3 ways and ended up getting pinned half way every time. But the 4th way up the mountain worked like a charm.

I find it a TPS convention to restrict vertical movement unless the core mechanics specifically includes abilities like flying or leaping that would call for more vertical map designs. Gears of War (at least the original trilogy that I played) and The Division don't bother with jumping and prevent the player from falling off big environmental ledges/cliffs. I actually appreciate that because it lets me get on with the business of shooting without feeling like I played myself every so often by falling into a pit I was too busy to see.

Outriders follows the same philosophy and it will sadly restrict the variety of environments we get to see and to play in but that's the bed they made for themselves. I totally get the fields of waist-high cover as being a relic of a bygone era and again, they could probably mitigate that by ditching their wonky sticky cover system so they can replace them with some more natural-looking meshes for us to take cover behind. The game is out in a month and some change so understandably there's only so much demo feedback they can take action on. In the foreseeable future we may see it undergo a "2.0" refresh of sorts but until that happens the core of what we have in the demo is most certainly the core of what we'll get in April.

So being the stubborn mule that I am, (I'm a Taurus after all) I kept playing the technomancer.
I leveled her to 7 and I have done all the quests and side quests except for payback. I just can't beat that boss. I'll have to try now that I am running with blighted weapon with a mod that heals for the damage it does.

I am having fun with it but it is more difficult to play compared to the other classes.
I am getting a lot of mileage out a free demo.
I should probably take advantage of the nice discount on GMG.

fangblackbone wrote:

-techno has better healing options than pyro otherwise it would have a worse start
-techno 1st power is nice but its a grenade so it is difficult to aim indoors and bounces erringly a lot
-techno 2nd skill again has problems; it is a freeze turret which sounds awesome but it has severe LOS issues

techno was the first class I played so I have learned more about the game and will go back and try it again. But if you are just starting off or one of the classes didn't click, try a Devastator or Trickster for sure.

yea totally disagree about the slow start. It's the only class where i could down a boss with almost skills alone. Get them to a sliver and then finish off with sniper or shotgun. Trickster a close second on boss ttk.

Went back and finished off the demo boss with Trickster. Not nearly as easy as it was with Devastator, mainly because the timing of my skills use had to be more strict.

Where are you guys picking up side quests, from NPCs sprinkled around at the base?
I still need to grind for goodies and hit the demo level cap with the devastator.

It’s a pretty meaty demo even playing thru a single class. Shows a lot of confidence from People Can Fly and Squenix, however misplaced. It could be a slowish Q2-Q3 for new releases so I could see this doing much better than expected.

[Edit:] oops wrong thread

yea totally disagree about the slow start. It's the only class where i could down a boss with almost skills alone. Get them to a sliver and then finish off with sniper or shotgun. Trickster a close second on boss ttk.

What's your secret? I frustratingly can't beat "The Captain" boss for the side quest "payback".
I've had better success since I have thrown the grenade at the ground but I've switched it out for blighted weapon. The demo boss wasn't too hard but the adds and the fire tornado skill sucks for the payback boss.

Anyways to each his own. You and I rarely see eye to eye on classes we prefer. But that is a good thing for this game as I see a bunch of stuff down the tree I like for the techno even if the trickster and devastator grab me from the start.

I think this game gives incredible advantages for strong aim. Headshots and critical multipliers mean that the stronger your aim skills the better long range encounters feel. Technomancer thrives on aim where Devastator and Trickster are more forgiving and up close. Though I can take down most captains and bosses in a magazine or two, as soon as I miss one or two shots it becomes a much harder affair

fangblackbone wrote:
yea totally disagree about the slow start. It's the only class where i could down a boss with almost skills alone. Get them to a sliver and then finish off with sniper or shotgun. Trickster a close second on boss ttk.

What's your secret? I frustratingly can't beat "The Captain" boss for the side quest "payback".
I've had better success since I have thrown the grenade at the ground but I've switched it out for blighted weapon. The demo boss wasn't too hard but the adds and the fire tornado skill sucks for the payback boss.

Anyways to each his own. You and I rarely see eye to eye on classes we prefer. But that is a good thing for this game as I see a bunch of stuff down the tree I like for the techno even if the trickster and devastator grab me from the start.

Early game i threw turret close to him and it would freeze him while i popped off adds with sniper. When he was about to cast something i would throw the scrapnel grenade which interrupts and throw down the barrage at an angle that covers him and any remaining adds. Which also interrupts, walk up to him and take a couple shots with shotgun if needed to finish him. Level 6+ i picked up a LMG and replaced the turret with blighted rounds. I'd start the fight with blighted rounds and unload the clip on him and throwing grenades to interrupt as needed and barrage to finish.

Trickster is still my goto because the playstyle is more my preference, but i was surprised at how OP the support class felt right out of the gate.

Another thing i noticed is that armor does matter. By the time you're doing The Captain having all greens and maybe a blue or two makes it MUCH easier than having all grey gear.