Book Recommendations?

Higgledy wrote:

As research for a science fiction book I’m in the throws of writing I’m reading ‘I contain multitudes’ by Ed Yong. It’s about the microbes we and other living creatures evolved alongside and, as a consequence, incorporated into the bodily systems that keep us nourished and healthy. It’s one of those books folks claim will change they way you see living creatures and irrevocably alter the way you see your own body. In this case, for me at least, it’s true.

Neat! Good showing on the Ri circuit:

Higgledy wrote:
trichy wrote:

Need a suggestion. If someone loved Rothfuss and Lynch's books, but wants a series that actually has a &$#%&#&ing ending, what's a good recommendation? Basically, plot-driven fantasy with a sense of humor, rich characters, and solid writing. My friend tore through both author's books, and wants more. She's not a fan of the grimdark stuff, so Martin and Abercrombie aren't her jam.

I spotted this video. He seems to have solid recommendations.

https://youtu.be/bzuyYGiGp_Q

Interesting list, but missing the Wheel of Time makes me question that youtuber's credentials.

Danjo Olivaw wrote:
Higgledy wrote:

As research for a science fiction book I’m in the throws of writing I’m reading ‘I contain multitudes’ by Ed Yong. It’s about the microbes we and other living creatures evolved alongside and, as a consequence, incorporated into the bodily systems that keep us nourished and healthy. It’s one of those books folks claim will change they way you see living creatures and irrevocably alter the way you see your own body. In this case, for me at least, it’s true.

Neat! Good showing on the Ri circuit:

Oh thanks. I’ll get that watched.

Thanks for the heads-up on the new Nora Kelly book! Preston and Child are real comfort reading.

Math wrote:
Higgledy wrote:
trichy wrote:

Need a suggestion. If someone loved Rothfuss and Lynch's books, but wants a series that actually has a &$#%&#&ing ending, what's a good recommendation? Basically, plot-driven fantasy with a sense of humor, rich characters, and solid writing. My friend tore through both author's books, and wants more. She's not a fan of the grimdark stuff, so Martin and Abercrombie aren't her jam.

I spotted this video. He seems to have solid recommendations.

https://youtu.be/bzuyYGiGp_Q

Interesting list, but missing the Wheel of Time makes me question that youtuber's credentials.

Have you tried to re-read Wheel of Time lately? I tried a couple of years ago, and it was just... not good. Teenage me in the 90s liked them. Current me not so much and I quit halfway into book number 2. Definitely one of the cases of don't revisit your heroes.

Higgledy wrote:

As research for a science fiction book I’m in the throws of writing

Throes? I hear Wordsmythe is an excellent editor.

Seriously though, best of luck with your writing!

Coldstream wrote:
Higgledy wrote:

As research for a science fiction book I’m in the throws of writing

Throes? I hear Wordsmythe is an excellent editor.

Seriously though, best of luck with your writing!

Thanks. I have an outline I’m extremely pleased with. Now I just have to get it written.

I’ve never typed out throes before. Thanks for the correction. Spelling is definitely a weakness with me.

Higgledy wrote:

As research for a science fiction book I’m in the throws of writing I’m reading ‘I contain multitudes’ by Ed Yong. It’s about the microbes we and other living creatures evolved alongside and, as a consequence, incorporated into the bodily systems that keep us nourished and healthy. It’s one of those books folks claim will change they way you see living creatures and irrevocably alter the way you see your own body. In this case, for me at least, it’s true.

That is a fantastic recommendation. Very interested in your book.

LeapingGnome wrote:

Have you tried to re-read Wheel of Time lately? I tried a couple of years ago, and it was just... not good. Teenage me in the 90s liked them. Current me not so much and I quit halfway into book number 2. Definitely one of the cases of don't revisit your heroes.

Actually, I began a reread of the entire series last July and am wrapping up book 13 right now. I would still count it as one of the best epic fantasy series of all time, though I would not say it's perfect by any stretch.

Natus wrote:
Higgledy wrote:

As research for a science fiction book I’m in the throws of writing I’m reading ‘I contain multitudes’ by Ed Yong. It’s about the microbes we and other living creatures evolved alongside and, as a consequence, incorporated into the bodily systems that keep us nourished and healthy. It’s one of those books folks claim will change they way you see living creatures and irrevocably alter the way you see your own body. In this case, for me at least, it’s true.

That is a fantastic recommendation. Very interested in your book.

Ed Yong's book is on sale for $5 now on Audible if you're a member, FYI

As someone who has never read or watched the Expanse what is the best touch point to compare the books to? Are the series finished? I really prefer not to be waiting if I really get into something

The last book is due to be released in the next couple of months I think.

Touchstones are tricky since I don't know what other SF you've read, and "GoT in space" is misleading for lots of reasons. Imagine a fairly colonised solar system with class inequality between factions, the story follows a small crew on the low end of the social scale getting caught up in big events. It's fairly cynical in tone, and one character is intended to be exasperating because he acts as if he's in Star Trek, and the plot punishes him for his wrong genre savviness.

It's like Peter F Hamilton channeled through Bruce Sterling, but with Robert Forward as the technical advisor. Sweeping stories that cover many domains - business, diplomacy, warfare, etc. Tons of really good characters who act reasonably (and unreasonably at times) and change and grow as well (for the most part). The story moves along - none of Hamilton's early tendency to use 10 sentences when one would do. The science reduces the number of necessary hand-waving technologies to a minimum (the Juice being the big one, and that one is not really that outrageous, it just allows faster movement to compress timeframes). And it takes elements from Cyberpunk and Dystopian SF as well as space opera, which is really nice to see. The world-building is amazing.

I would start it now, savor every book, and the last one should be out by the time you are done, or soon after. Alternatively, and I should have thought of this a few moments ago, read Luna: New Moon. That is actually reasonably close in style to the Expanse, but more grounded in characters, culture and society and tightly focused to the Moon in a relatively near future. But Ian McDonald writes at the same level of quality as the authors of The Expanse. You'll enjoy it as much, and the major series is finished, although he might add some more novels and certainly some smaller works into the mix.

DudleySmith wrote:

one character is intended to be exasperating because he acts as if he's in Star Trek, and the plot punishes him for his wrong genre savviness.

Which eventually led to my abandoning the series. I got to Persepolis Rising, said “How can this guy still be so naive after everything?” and “Surely these authors must know ways to kick off a plot other than the same character always doing counterproductive things?”, and returned the book to the library unfinished.

Your mileage may vary, of course.

The science reduces the number of necessary hand-waving technologies to a minimum (the Juice being the big one, and that one is not really that outrageous, it just allows faster movement to compress timeframes).

Really, the handwave in The Expanse is the Epstein drive, a nearly unlimited source of delta-V for rockets. It's never explained, it's just some magic thing that produces insane acceleration from a small amount of fuel for an extended period of time.

The 'juice' is a spinoff of that.... it's a chemical that's injected into people undergoing high-G acceleration for long periods of time when they can't get into a gel bed. It reduces the damage from the G-loading, but does not eliminate it, and can be quite dangerous. It's a necessary additional tech to make the Epstein drive actually work with human physiology, so it's part of the same handwave.

So except for that gimme (and all SF gets at least one gimme), human technology is hard SF; physics works in expected ways, and pretty much every tech used by the characters is a direct outgrowth of something we already use. For instance, they have mag boots they use to walk around in zero G, which can be turned on and off. This isn't really explained, but we could probably build something like that now, although the batteries might be problematic.

Characters in space use propellant to move around, they die if their suits are breached, and so on. The tech is very polished, and probably works too well to be realistic, but it's all related to things we can actually do ourselves right now.

They also interact with alien tech, which is mostly not explained and which is far past human levels. That part of the story is not at all hard SF.

As far as what's like The Expanse... there isn't anything that's super-close. I suppose it might be closest to Niven and Pournelle, like Ringworld and The Mote In God's Eye, but without the crazy conservatism and wild misogny.

Did you read the Luna series, Malor? You don't think that's close in feel?

I started it, but bounced off pretty hard. Everything was just so miserable that I had trouble picking it back up after reading twenty pages or so.

Yeah, I get where Malor is coming from. I am always surprised by how much love those books get here. I have read the first two, and they are good, but they are so bleak. I need to read the third, but haven't had any excitement for it.

Also, the libertarianism nature of lunar society is pretty distasteful to me.

Well written but miserable is about right.

Sorry to hear it. I always recommend those. I love the world-building and the characters.

The Epstein drive is powered by fusion if the 4th season is to be believed. It is a tiny blurb when the alien technology is messing with the ships in orbit.

The Expanse is also a "First Contact" genre story. First contact in a fairly realistic physics and political universe. Large cast of flawed characters that mostly feel realistic put in this environment.

And it's in the universe of The Martian. There's a ship named the "Mark Watney".

(I believe it's not the same universe but nod to Andy Weir's book.)

My take is it's one of my favorite series of books. If you're interested, jump in. You're not going to get hung out to dry, as these things seem to come out on schedule.

If you like the Expanse but want fantasy instead, take a look at Daniel Abraham's books. He's one half of "James S.A. Corey" along with Ty Franck, who I believe was (is?) George R.R. Martin's assistant.

I will say that 20 pages is not enough to judge Luna: New Moon. It's still in the "setting the stage" phase, and the character's situation at that point shows one side of the society, not the totality.

It's interesting in that it *is* a functioning society based on libertarian ideals. Flawed, like every other society, but is it worse or better than the alternatives? That's one of the over-arching questions the series posits.

Thanks all, I think ill give the first one a go. I literally just finished Deathworld so will probably read something non fiction as a break in-between. Looking forward to it already!

bbk1980 wrote:

Thanks all, I think ill give the first one a go. I literally just finished Deathworld so will probably read something non fiction as a break in-between. Looking forward to it already!

If you enjoy these (I bet you will), there are several very good novellas that go along with them that either fill in event details, character backstory, or technology development. I think there was only one that I really had to push my way through. The rest were great.

I read 2 books last week:

This Is How You Lose The Time Wwar by Amal El-Mohtar and Max Gladstone - An epistolary book about two opposing agents fighting for their factions across time and versions of Earth leaving messages for each other in rocks and animals and the like. It was OK. I think I didn't really "get" it on some level, like I was expecting something grander and got a small character study instead, which didn't work for me because I don't feel I knew the characters well enough.

Spellbreaker by Charile Holmberg - Urban Fantasy set in Victorian England. Whilst there were no djinni, it reminded me of the Bartimaeus books by Jonathon Stroud in setting. The upper classes hoard the magical resources, and the protagonists are the titular spellbreaker, a woman rescued from a workhouse, who has the power to undo spells, and a mixed race minor lord butting against the establishment. It was no great shakes, but it was a fun yarn and I enjoyed it enough to pre-order the sequel. I'm still inexplicably bothered about the use of the word "math" which jumped out at me (for all know this might have been accurate for the English period, since a lot of Americanisms are Englishisms from that period, but I suspect not. Yes, I know "mathematics" isn't a real plural).

It's interesting in that it *is* a functioning society based on libertarian ideals

Is that what it is really about? If so then that series is a hard pass for me.

No, that's not what it is about. But it does motivate various conflicts between corporations and governments, and it also allows for social conflict galore. The book is NOT libertarian propaganda, but rather an interesting look at how such a society might play out in the near future. It's background, not foreground. An interesting twist, you might say.

(And yes, it shows yet another way libertarianism exacerbates inequality and capitalist principles. To its detriment... In reality, it's a multi-corporation oligarchy, with the idea that *everything* can be handled with contractual agreements. Which, again, can be deeply bad.)

DudleySmith wrote:

I read 2 books last week:

This Is How You Lose The Time Wwar by Amal El-Mohtar and Max Gladstone - An epistolary book about two opposing agents fighting for their factions across time and versions of Earth leaving messages for each other in rocks and animals and the like. It was OK. I think I didn't really "get" it on some level, like I was expecting something grander and got a small character study instead, which didn't work for me because I don't feel I knew the characters well enough.

I read this just after it came out when it was all the rage and even met the authors at a reading. It was a neat idea, it just didn't ultimately really grab me. They created a world in which there were no rules, so the zigs and zags of the plot became mechanical.

A lighter faster read than the expanse were Martha Wells' Murderbot series. Each book is short and punchy. I wanted more of it.

I also finally got around to the Windup Girl. That was dark but amazing as a setting.