The GWJ JRPG Club - Q3 2020 - The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel II

This is kind of embarrassing, but I reloaded a save to try the festival night event at the end of CS1 with several different companions. Now I can't remember which one is on my clear save!

Nice! It'll tell you near the beginning of the game. You see a flashback to that person interacting with Rean, during what I think was the final fight (Rean, in Valimar, vs. Crow). At least, I got a flashback to that scene with Emma.

Same with Jusis for me.

LastSurprise wrote:

Nice! It'll tell you near the beginning of the game. You see a flashback to that person interacting with Rean, during what I think was the final fight (Rean, in Valimar, vs. Crow). At least, I got a flashback to that scene with Emma.

The flashback in my game was with Jusis, it's safe to say this is tied to who you danced with at the end of the first game

Went through the summary yesterday. For the most part I remembered the story correctly. I am still in the prologue. I might play more today, and hopefully complete the prologue this weekend.

So, I'm almost done with the prologue. I've beaten what I think is its boss, and now I'm traveling through Exposition City.

Spoiler:

Specifically, I paused when the game cut to Rufus Albarea's airship.

It seems like there are a lot of organizations to keep track of, with competing goals. I tried to look up some information on the Trials Wiki, but very quickly ran into spoiler territory. Like a character profile will tell you -- before getting into game content -- whether he or she died, ended up in prison, etc. Yikes. I don't want that.

I am trying to remind myself what I've already learned, and have forgotten, about the different antagonists. For people that have played Cold Steel 1, or have played other Trails games set before this one, I'd love some more background.

Noble faction: secretly were building Gundam units ... I mean, Panzer Knights ... in a plan to take over the country. Used assassination of the Chancellor as an opportunity to assert themselves , purge the army of dissidents, and "unify" the country under their rule. May have planned the assassination, together with the ILF?

Imperial Liberation Front: seem to be working in concert with the Nobles, but I imagine for different ends. Members don't seem to be noble and the association between them seems odd. Crow had a vendetta against the Chancellor for his past actions, that seem unrelated to the Nobles' disagreements with the Chancellor's reform agenda.

Ouroboros: Secret society with shady motives? Honestly I don't understand how or why they're tied into this particular conflict, but maybe I'm not meant to understand that yet.

LastSurprise wrote:

Ouroboros: Secret society with shady motives? Honestly I don't understand how or why they're tied into this particular conflict, but maybe I'm not meant to understand that yet.

I can't say for the others, as I am myself not sure, but Ouroboros was featured quite prominently in the Trails in the Sky series, as they were the main antagonist. They were indeed a secret society, and they tried to take over the kindom of Liberl in the Sky series. Typically, they are supposed to be super efficient and great at martial arts (see Fie in Cold Steel, and Joshua in Sky). Bleublanc (or is it Blancbleu? I can't remember, anyway it's a combination of blue and white written in French) is a member of Ouroboros, I believe, and did show up a few times in Trails in the Sky.

bobbywatson wrote:
LastSurprise wrote:

Ouroboros: Secret society with shady motives? Honestly I don't understand how or why they're tied into this particular conflict, but maybe I'm not meant to understand that yet.

I can't say for the others, as I am myself not sure, but Ouroboros was featured quite prominently in the Trails in the Sky series, as they were the main antagonist. They were indeed a secret society, and they tried to take over the kindom of Liberl in the Sky series. Typically, they are supposed to be super efficient and great at martial arts (see Fie in Cold Steel, and Joshua in Sky). Bleublanc (or is it Blancbleu? I can't remember, anyway it's a combination of blue and white written in French) is a member of Ouroboros, I believe, and did show up a few times in Trails in the Sky.

All correct, I believe. They're meant to be the super secret Illuminati that are doing a bunch of stuff behind the scenes.

Who or what they are is believed to be the entire arc of ALL the Zemurian games, more or less.

Thanks guys. I remember them faintly from Trails in the Sky 1, but I never finished the game. I knew they were featured more prominently in Trails in the Sky 2.

I've been on a tear today. Into the first bit of combat in Act 1, and holy hell, those apes are tough. It's like the game is trying to teach me to pay attention to status ailments (faint, here). I don't think I can take them with my current party and setup.

Update: with a couple extra levels under my belt, I was able to backtrack and beat those Apes pretty easily. The new Overdrive combat mechanic helped. Right now, I'm into the next set of maps in Act 1, and have a feeling I'll be finding a third party member before long.

Spoiler:

Specifically, I'm on the road back to Trista. Wonder what we'll find, at school?

Overall, I feel like the team at Falcom did a really nice job integrating story and gameplay in the transition that's natural to any sequel. Backsliding a bit on levels makes sense, as Rean likely lost some strength and conditioning during his recovery. Harder enemies fit the plot, as the world has gotten more dangerous. And I like Toval and Elise as a mechanism for re-introducing Combat Links. Neither of them have a link with Rean that's quite as effective as the other party members, but then, neither has used an ARCUS to fight with him, before. This definitely feels more organic, and better written, than in a game like Metroid where some deus ex machina disables all your previously-acquired suit upgrades.

Also I liked the intro to this game (before the prologue) much more than the intro to Cold Steel 1. Guiding Rean down the mountain allowed the game to explain its basic mechanics step-by-step, rather than that whole "control the entire party in the middle of a conflict" thing.

Just finished the Prologue... very good so far and got me interested. Still confused by mechanics and arts, crafts etc.. but overall going good.

Finished the prologue as well, and go through the first area of the first part of act 1. (Weird that they went from chapters to acts and parts.)

I'm pretty sure I brought it up in the past when JohnKillo was playing the game, but I expect this will reuse a lot of assets from the first game (similar to what Sky SC did).

I don't know if I need to bring this up, but I will anyway, in case it helps somebody: You can break crates and various other objects you find in areas where you find monsters, and they may give you random items (some, like U-Material, more valuable than others).

I am very very confused by Arcus... crafts... the different levels of the arcus etc... i hope everything makes sense in a while....

Arcus levels just related to the level of spell you can slot into it. Bigger the spell the higher level to unlock. It shouldnt be a big worry yet. You will be able to slot whatever type (color) into it soon enough.

You can easily turn Rean into a monster.

Another question... What is the "real" difference between Arts and Crafts... and I still find it very complex the description n some of them.... how CLOSE attention do i need to pay to those?

Arts burn magic.

Crafts use a limit or ability tree that gets restored when hitting or getting it.

You don't need to play a lot attention to it. Enemies can be scanned and know their elemental weakness.

Crafts you should pay attention if they say "delay" or "break". They can slow a big attack or break big enemy spells.

Crafts 100 to 200 can use the limit break. Limit breaks are good for jumping the line. Attacks or heals depends on the character.

Well, I've reunited with the first of Rean's classmates:

Spoiler:

Machias Regnitz. At first, I was not excited, as Machias was a brat through a good part of Cold Steel 1. But, his character did develop and show nuance over time, and he was a damn good support character by the end. Also, he apparently had reason to be bratty, as the events at the end of Cold Steel 1 shows that he was right about the Noble Alliance, at least.

Really excited to have three characters again! Though, I was hoping that one of my favorites would show up in the Celdic area.

Spoiler:

Emma and Laura specifically. I'd also have liked to see Jusis or Gaius. Gaius is back in Nord, I imagine.

Darkhaund wrote:

Another question... What is the "real" difference between Arts and Crafts... and I still find it very complex the description n some of them.... how CLOSE attention do i need to pay to those?

I kind of struggled with the "arts" and "crafts" distinction too, in Cold Steel 1.

Like JohnKillo says, Arts are magic. They are freely interchangeable between characters based on the regular and master quartzes you have equipped. Arts will be your primary way of dealing elemental damage -- which, against some enemies, is quite powerful. Also, because there is some delay between preparing to cast an Art, and casting an Art, you can sometimes use Arts to push enemies and allies down in the turn order, so that (for example) you can bump a "Critial" turn from an enemy to an ally.

I've also read that physical attacks have less of a chance to hit in this game than in Cold Steel 1, both for the player and for the enemy. And, every time an attacker misses, the target gets a free counterattack if in range. Arts don't miss, as far as I know. So, they're a good way to avoid triggering a counter. But on the other hand, they can't trigger link attacks.

Crafts are specific to each character. Think of them as the character's unique skills. They can trigger links, and even when they don't, some of the buffing crafts are exceptional. As an example, in Cold Steel 1, Elliot had a craft called Resounding Beat which essentially gave a defense buff + regen. Every chapter featuring Elliot was just a little bit easier than the others.

Apart from Delay (Rean's bread-and-butter) and Break, you should also pay attention to any craft that says "Unbalance +X%" Those attacks increase the chance that you'll stagger an enemy and trigger a link attack.

Played a bit more last night and I now have 6 of the gang back together! I haven't noticed much change in combat from the first game, but so far I haven't had to pay a lot of attention to it either.

From the reunion I know now that I must have bonded with

Spoiler:

Alisa

at the end of the last game... not my first choice to be honest but all the characters have some endearing qualities, so I'm fine with it for now.

Well.. did some play during the weekend, (not as much as i would have liked)
Still trying to understand the game. In the outside it looks very complex.. crafts, artes, links, slinks, overdrive etc. And then the arts or crafts (can remember) have some complex info on them for example

"True Autum Leaf cutter" CP 20
No.. this i understand.. this craft costs 20 cp.. but then this

Attack (set) - Area (S) - Impede - Delay+15
Class C+ Slashes foes while dashing by them. Unbalance +10%

Now... how much attention do I need to put on this? And I assume this attack is not related to any element right?

I have to admit I feel a little overwhelmed.
I am 6 hours into the game!!!

Darkhaund wrote:

Attack (set) - Area (S) - Impede - Delay+15
Class C+ Slashes foes while dashing by them. Unbalance +10%

Now... how much attention do I need to put on this? And I assume this attack is not related to any element right?

I have to admit I feel a little overwhelmed.
I am 6 hours into the game!!!

Area (S) -> Attack targets a small area (instead of targeting one individual enemy)
Impede -> Cancel art or any other kind of attack that needs charging
Delay -> Target moves down the turn order list
Unbalance +10% -> Not 100% sure on this one, but I think it means there is an extra 10% chance of triggering a link attack when the enemy is attacked by a party member

At normal difficulty, you certainly do need to pay attention, particularly with the delay and impede. If, for example, a strong enemy is preparing an attack, canceling that attack can be very beneficial. I hit several road blocks in my playthrough of Cold Steel 1 (particularly with some of the bosses).

If there are some significant upcoming turn bonuses (like 50% healing), "Delay" can certainly have a major impact. LastSurprise also brought up the fact that you can use casting arts as a tactic to move enemies down the turn order list in order for those bonuses to target your characters instead of enemies. Having at 50% healing bonus occur on a tough boss can be... annoying.

I can't help you with the orbments unfortunately, as I never paid much attention to them (which probably explains why I had such a hard time with CS1).

Thank you so very much. I decided to play on "easy" in order to focus on the story with the time restrictions that I currently have

ComfortZone wrote:

Played a bit more last night and I now have 6 of the gang back together! I haven't noticed much change in combat from the first game, but so far I haven't had to pay a lot of attention to it either.

From the reunion I know now that I must have bonded with

Spoiler:

Alisa

at the end of the last game... not my first choice to be honest but all the characters have some endearing qualities, so I'm fine with it for now.

I played a bit more today and I'm back up to a party of 5! I assume the 6th will be coming soon.

So far, I'm enjoying the combat/exploring-to-chatting ratio more here than in Cold Steel 1. These games are built around the idea that you'll talk to everyone in town after each major story beat. I find doing that in a place the size of Ymir or Celdic to be much more appealing than doing that in Trista and at the school for multiple times in every single chapter.

Darkhaund wrote:

Thank you so very much. I decided to play on "easy" in order to focus on the story with the time restrictions that I currently have

That's probably a good call, and I think you'll enjoy that. I found the arts & crafts system, plus 7 different elements, plus so many status effects, to be a lot, and I didn't think it was all implemented as well as it could have been. That said, it makes more sense to me now and I feel like I'm engaging with it better -- probably just because I've played Cold Steel 1.

Darkhaund wrote:

Well.. did some play during the weekend, (not as much as i would have liked)
Still trying to understand the game. In the outside it looks very complex.. crafts, artes, links, slinks, overdrive etc. And then the arts or crafts (can remember) have some complex info on them for example

"True Autum Leaf cutter" CP 20
No.. this i understand.. this craft costs 20 cp.. but then this

Attack (set) - Area (S) - Impede - Delay+15
Class C+ Slashes foes while dashing by them. Unbalance +10%

Now... how much attention do I need to put on this? And I assume this attack is not related to any element right?

I have to admit I feel a little overwhelmed.
I am 6 hours into the game!!!

I think you're right, no element. I think that only arts have elements. Maybe some rare crafts do, but that'll be pretty explicit.

"Area" will be as opposed to something like "line" (attacks everyone in a line; width varies) or a single-target, or some rare skills that target the whole battlefield. This is an area where I think the combat system falls down. You have area of effect skills that have to be centered on a target, and some you can center as you'd like. But the measurements like "small" are rough estimates and, if you need to spend a turn moving, there isn't any way to check how close or far you'll need to be, on your next turn, to get something working. Class may indicate rough power levels, but it's hard to gauge that -- and unlike the names used by Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest, arts / crafts names do not help you figure it out.

If I were in charge, I'd change a whole bunch of arts names and put combat on a grid.

LastSurprise wrote:

I played a bit more today and I'm back up to a party of 5! I assume the 6th will be coming soon.

So far, I'm enjoying the combat/exploring-to-chatting ratio more here than in Cold Steel 1. These games are built around the idea that you'll talk to everyone in town after each major story beat. I find doing that in a place the size of Ymir or Celdic to be much more appealing than doing that in Trista and at the school for multiple times in every single chapter.

Yes, this one seems to be chuffing along at a better pace than CS1, so far at least. Still very thankful to have turbo mode though! Except for the time when I left it on while fishing

I just finished the prologue and have ventured into the old market city. Just a few thoughts:

  • It's still just a bit slow. I don't recall feeling bogged down by the framerate or pauses in battles this much in the first game, but it's been a while so I can't really say. I still prefer handheld, but I'd kill for the turbo feature.
  • I remember almost nothing about CS1, and the summaries only did an "ok" job of filling me in. Maybe it was because they were very wordy, but a lot of it went over my head. I'm a bit confused about the factions and who's who. I'm going to have to do a lot of work to catch up.
  • It's so...anime. Rean touches everyone's head which is weird, and dramatic moments feel a bit cheap because they are done with in-engine animations. It's typical Falcom, but it takes me out of the moment whenever something clunky happens.

And onto the positives!

  • I really like how you start with a very robust skill set and with all of your old abilities unlocked. It feels like this is "disc 2" of a longer game. It wouldn't have made sense to start you off as a amnesiac weakling like most sequels, and what they've done with the combat system (overdrive) is just fantastic.
  • This time, I'm taking my time and talking to a few townsfolk. Not all, but a few. I rushed CS1 because I hated the pacing, but it's been nice to meander through each location in CS2.
  • Pacing. Pacing is so much better in this game. I'm only 7 hours in but it's already much more interesting.
  • I hope the mecha combat is a bit more exhilarating than what we saw at the start. I LOVE the aesthetic they've gone for here so I want to see it these things featured more prominently -- only if we get a bit more tactical depth to the fights though.

So far I'm having a lot of fun. I'm a bit lost, and it's a bit too slow for my liking, but it's cozy and I'm looking forward to playing more.

I am also in the Market City. Still figuring out ALOT OF THE GAME. I like what I see so FAR and will be patient with the system and mechanics. I also would like to takes things easy and explore a bit. I am playing it on my PS VITA and on easy mode the experience the story. I have the 3rd game demo on the switch so hopefully this game will get me to be a fan of the franchise.

So far, I have 3 characters and things are going well. I can say that so far the game looks interesting and promising. I dont know what made me put the 1st game down back then... it was probably bravely default or even Tales of hearts R, cant recall.

The old "talk to everyone" is enforced. Hidden side quests are everywhere.

The first wasn't as anime until the very end. The only real thing to remember is that Rean wants to help people while your military class is drawn around you. Also Rean is a super powered boy too.

A_Unicycle wrote:

[*] I remember almost nothing about CS1, and the summaries only did an "ok" job of filling me in. Maybe it was because they were very wordy, but a lot of it went over my head. I'm a bit confused about the factions and who's who. I'm going to have to do a lot of work to catch up.

For what it's worth, I played CS1 fairly recently but I'm still a bit confused about the various factions, most of which only appeared right near the end of that game. Imperials v nobles is familiar, but the Ourobouros and other hangers on were suddenly revealed and not really explained. The rivalry between Erebonia and Crossbell was bubbling away in the background but I'm not sure where that is at now either.

Crossbell was more in Trails from Zero and Azure. I didnt play them (I want to). So there isn't a whole lot of viewpoint from them.

ComfortZone wrote:
A_Unicycle wrote:

[*] I remember almost nothing about CS1, and the summaries only did an "ok" job of filling me in. Maybe it was because they were very wordy, but a lot of it went over my head. I'm a bit confused about the factions and who's who. I'm going to have to do a lot of work to catch up.

For what it's worth, I played CS1 fairly recently but I'm still a bit confused about the various factions, most of which only appeared right near the end of that game. Imperials v nobles is familiar, but the Ourobouros and other hangers on were suddenly revealed and not really explained. The rivalry between Erebonia and Crossbell was bubbling away in the background but I'm not sure where that is at now either.

Yup, I think the idea at the end of CS1 was to show just how complicated the conflict is by having players feel that same overwhelming sensation.

Made it through the Terra Shrine this morning. That was a nice throwback to the old schoolhouse. Also, now all of the classmates in my current party can pair with each other for overdrives!

Not going as fast as I WOULD LIKE.. but so far... I got 3 characters in my part and I think I just reunited with 2 more.. Game looks nice so far and will try to make some decent progress

Just picked up a third party member, and the game is really starting to sink its hooks into me. The pacing is much better so far, and I actually want to take my time with it.

The master quartz system is pretty cool and I feel like I have real ownership over my party. It's nice slotting in abilities and making them all feel unique!

Something that I remember from the first game (and something that is definitely returning) is how interesting the characters are mechanically. You don't really have a typical "tank/healer/mage" system, everyone has an intriguing mix of abilities that make them feel unique.

E.g, the third character has a gun so he doesn't need to be close to enemies, therefore he doesn't take hits. His master quartz gives him the ability to take less damage the higher his health is. He's not a tank, but he's uniquely positioned to not take damage to begin with - do you build him up as a support? Do you double down on his AOE abilities? It's really good!