Harebrained Schemes' BattleTech Catch-All

Boudreaux wrote:

I'm not sure if the main game AI has been tweaked or it's one of the mods I'm using, but I've noticed in my last career that the enemy AI is much better about concentrating fire on one of my Mechs vs. spreading it out.

The AI definitely started focus firing better with the Flashpoint expansion. My fastest/lead mech pilot always has bulwark, sensor lock, and master tactician now, because they've got to be able to take the hits, make the approaching enemy miss, and then maybe run away.

Big patch today - I think it may break save games from mods. I'll test and let you know. Later I'll post my tips and tactics for the game. YMMV.

Edit: Yup broke my ECE 3025 save, sigh....

Doh!

Boudreaux wrote:

Doh!

Doing a completely fresh install now to see if I can get the mod working with the new update - if not I may try a roll back. Lost lots and lots of time. Not happy, but my fault - I should have turned off auto updates.

Edit - clean install didnt work - going to try and roll back to the previous vanilla version.

Roll back to 1.6.2 worked. The main mod files were also updated in the 5th and 6th of September in case you are running old version. Not going to lie, I almost shed a tear over the potential loss.

SpyNavy wrote:
Boudreaux wrote:

Doh!

Doing a completely fresh install now to see if I can get the mod working with the new update - if not I may try a roll back. Lost lots and lots of time. Not happy, but my fault - I should have turned off auto updates.

Edit - clean install didnt work - going to try and roll back to the previous vanilla version.

Roll back to 1.6.2 worked. The main mod files were also updated in the 5th and 6th of September in case you are running old version. Not going to lie, I almost shed a tear over the potential loss.

PHEW!!!! I'm glad you were able to save it. I can't imagine losing my campaign. (I'm currently building up for the final battle where I need multiple lances of assaults according to the description).

Anyway, glad you saved it! Keep plugging away!

Patch notes here

Spoiler:

Thank you for playing BATTLETECH! Release 1.7 is now available! The main areas of improvement are issues identified by the community, AI, combat performance improvements, and map graphics. We have also improved gameplay difficulty balance in the Kamea campaign and addressed many minor glitches.

Release 1.7 Notes, 9/10/2019

From the Community
Fixed a formatting problem with the json for the PNT-9R
Updated the Hatchetman HCT-3X faction so that it is part of more lore relevant enemy lances
Fixed an issue where the ‘Double Agent’ Flashpoint awarded the wrong faction reputation
The Packrat now moves as a light wheeled vehicle
Stock lances in skirmish mode are no longer duplicated in the dropdown when the budget is unlimited
Several libraries for Ubuntu Linux users are now installed along with the game by default
AI
Improved AI’s ability to avoid a potential ECM exploit
ECM carriers will now work harder at keeping their allies cloaked
Further pathing fixes for several missions where the AI could become stuck
Updated lance role tags for a number of ‘Mechs (such as “tank”, “sniper”, “scout”, etc.)
Combat Performance Improvements
Particle system optimization
UI rendering optimization
Map Graphics
Many small map polish fixes - closing seams, grounding assets, clipping corrections, etc.
UI
Fixed a bug where an event may reference a random star system rather than the currently orbited one
Other
Re-balanced the Attack/Defend encounter type
Fixed many small grammar and translation errors
Improvements to missile trajectories
Balance adjustments to the Kamea story campaign:
Lowered mechwarrior hiring cost
Increased payout in c-bills for contracts
Increased base salvage for contracts
Increased the frequency of non-weapon rare items in salvage
Increased the starting cbills from 980k to 1000k
Increased the starting morale from 25 to 28
Increased MechWarrior XP per mission from 400 to 500
Updated difficulty settings to match new defaults
Fixed an issue where certain sounds on Urban maps would persist after save/load
Fixed an issue where player ‘Mechs could not melee units cloaked within an ECM field
The 'White Lies' Flashpoint is now available during career mode as well as after completing the campaign
Fixed an issue where buildings could collapse while they still had health
Fixed the contract results page for the ‘Hearts and Minds’ Flashpoint with the correct objectives
Fixed an issue where ally defense turrets would not turn on in Attack and Defend - Retaliation contracts
Fixed an issue where attacks would pass through buildings without causing stray shot damage
Gyro+++ component gameplay effects can no longer be stacked
Fixed an issue where Pre and Post mission autosaves would not properly generate for procedural contracts when any Flashpoint was active
Known Issues
Small amounts of text remain untranslated
The game does not always enter turn-based mode when hostiles drop in

IMPORTANT: Additional note for players who mod various game files…Reminder that modding is not officially supported. If you have saved a game with any mod active, that saved game will not work after an update has been applied unless you replace all modded files exactly as they were when the save game file was created. Saved games require the exact same data state in order to function properly.

Roll Back
It is possible to revert to past versions of our game in case you have trouble with this update. For more platform specific information go to our forums at: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru....

As always, if you experience further issues please contact Customer Support at: https://support.paradoxplaza.com

EDIT: It's a 4GB patch.

Yeah big patch, but it breaks all the mods. Unless you are good with just the vanilla campaign don't update.

I just started playing Pillars of Eternity 2 so I may give the BE 3025 mod folks some time to update it for 1.7, then reinstall everything and start a new career game. I am probably 200-300 days past the end of the scoring cutoff in my current game. I was just trundling merrily along, no real end goal. Although I was only two items away from fully upgrading the Argo...

Even though Paradox doesn't officially support mods I have to wonder if they include that "Roll Back" option and note specifically for modders.

Boudreaux wrote:

I just started playing Pillars of Eternity 2 so I may give the BE 3025 mod folks some time to update it for 1.7, then reinstall everything and start a new career game. I am probably 200-300 days past the end of the scoring cutoff in my current game. I was just trundling merrily along, no real end goal. Although I was only two items away from fully upgrading the Argo...

Even though Paradox doesn't officially support mods I have to wonder if they include that "Roll Back" option and note specifically for modders.

Pretty sure that's exactly why it's there. They even mention in the patch notes that specific fact.

Paradox does that because people get aggravated when a patch makes (not necessarily breaking) changes to an in-progress game. And not everyone likes the features they put into their patches and want to play older versions. The mod thing too of course.

They do the same for all of their in-house developed games too.

I might have to give Attack/Defend missions another try now, to see just how they've been rebalanced.

My current game is vanilla with DLC, and the only change I've experienced so far is the UI text rendering.

to circle back to the pre-patch discussion on mission difficulty...

I find that the maps themselves and the starting positions on them are what generate the highest difficulty spikes(and ones that are unaccounted for by the star rating).

fighting two lances that each outweigh you is hard but doable when you can manoeuvre, use cover and play with LoS.

what's frustratingly impossible is when they start you backed into a corner, at the bottom of a canyon with lances up above you on either side.

as for the patch.. we'll that's a disappointing. I don't really mind starting over but waiting around for the mod to be updated means shifting my focus to other games in the meantime.

I agree, Grandmafunk. What causes difficulty for me (other than attack and defend missions) is always some sort of randomness where I'm on the low ground and can't even face my opponents. To be fair to the ai, most of the time I'm choosing the ground and where to engage, etc. They get their shot and I think it's unfair, but it might be the most fair thing ever for the poor ai.

So, on balance, considering that I’ll never apply a mod to this game and that I have a low tolerance for cheating video game Ai, is it worth getting it through this months Humble Bundle?

doubtingthomas396 wrote:

So, on balance, considering that I’ll never apply a mod to this game and that I have a low tolerance for cheating video game Ai, is it worth getting it through this months Humble Bundle?

I can't speak to value, but that's a very low price point. I think if you make it through the tutorial mission with minimum fuss, you'll like it. Especially when you're learning, I feel like it can be a bit punishing early when you don't have the tonnage to really make up for a mistake.

Eventually, the game is basically as hard or easy as you want it to be, and you can always back out of a mission if you don't like what's going on. You choose your difficulty for individual missions and you can play with in-game saves. (This way, if you feel the ai cheated or the game doesn't properly explain a mechanic and it gets a beloved character killed, you can rectify the situation. I had it happen once, but decided to live with a lost pilot - the story missions sometimes don't follow the regular missions rules necessarily).

doubtingthomas396 wrote:

So, on balance, considering that I’ll never apply a mod to this game and that I have a low tolerance for cheating video game Ai, is it worth getting it through this months Humble Bundle?

I played the game at launch. No mods, no expansions, none of the latest patches, and it was my GOTY. If big stompy robots and missiles to the face sound fun to you it's a no-brainer.

doubtingthomas396 wrote:

So, on balance, considering that I’ll never apply a mod to this game

Why?

and that I have a low tolerance for cheating video game Ai

Not sure how you got the impression there's any "cheating." Some games allow AI to cheat by giving them advantages like unlimited ammunition, etc. This is not the case in BattleTech. There's a lot of OPFOR to make up for the fact the OPFOR isn't very bright, but the OPFOR plays by the same game mechanics as you do.

Yeah, the most critical I can be of the AI is that is occasionally unsportsmanlike. "You expect me to defeat these 12 heavy Mechs with my 4?" But it doesn't cheat.

I easily put 100hrs into it before I even thought about mods. $12 is a steal.

Yeah that price is great. 300 plus hours in and it is still rewarding. Do yourself a service and get the game and play through with the mods that supports the campaign. And then restart as a new career with the full 3025 mod.

Like it so much I posted twice.

Middcore wrote:
doubtingthomas396 wrote:

So, on balance, considering that I’ll never apply a mod to this game

Why?

I have never modded a game, and I never will. If it’s not worth playing as the developers made it, there are a couple of million other games that are.

Middcore wrote:
and that I have a low tolerance for cheating video game Ai

Not sure how you got the impression there's any "cheating." Some games allow AI to cheat by giving them advantages like unlimited ammunition, etc. This is not the case in BattleTech. There's a lot of OPFOR to make up for the fact the OPFOR isn't very bright, but the OPFOR plays by the same game mechanics as you do.

Perhaps I was imprecise in my use of language.

By “cheating” I mean “routinely puts the player in impossible situations to create the illusion of challenge.”

Egregious offenders include Mario Party, RTS games with “craft” in the title and any RPG that’s ever made you restart a mission because you died after missing a shot that had a 99% chance to hit.

It sounds like Battletech does that on occasion by placing your units into locations that are impossible to win from (ie outnumbered AND surrounded AND stuck in the low ground with no meaningful/effective way to actually shoot back. The reviews acknowledge this, and you all have confirmed it. My question is basically how bad it is.

$12 isn’t a lot unless I can expect to rage-quit after an hour, at which point the money would have been better spent paying a homeless person to kick me in the junk.

The AI doesn't cheat in Battletech at all, but sometimes the game design is such that it leaves you at a serious disadvantage. Sometimes that's deliberate, sometimes it's circumstantial - as mentioned by LocalGod54 it is very veryannoying when you are stuck at the bottom of a valley, can't get out well enough to get line of sight on who's firing at you and see wave after wave of Long Range missile fire start to destabilize your Mechs, from enemies you can't see.

It's all in the game rules though, and when all is said and done doesn't happen very often. It's a steal at $12 tbh

doubtingthomas396 wrote:

So, on balance, considering that I’ll never apply a mod to this game and that I have a low tolerance for cheating video game Ai, is it worth getting it through this months Humble Bundle?

I reckon if you liked the flavour of combat in XCOM2, you will like Battletech. They're different systems, but have a similar vibe on difficulty.

Also, sometimes an unwinnable position is just a result of choosing the wrong mechs/loadout. Jumpjets will get you out of many a tight spot -- the one mech that doesn't have them will suffer.

Yeah, the game puts you in tough situations, but it always feels weirdly authentic. Like sometimes you will get bad intel and get dropped in a situation where you need to scratch to survive because you're in a bad position or have the wrong loadout. But IMO it earns it. And fighting through that is deeply satisfying.

You can always retreat if the situation is impossible or going to be too expensive too.

The fact that it was a Black Knight is just icing on the cake.

IMAGE(https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/813306660769773545/BAC9B7B3CF63D64CF90E9AB85F454C6B39903115/)

doubtingthomas396 wrote:

So, on balance, considering that I’ll never apply a mod to this game and that I have a low tolerance for cheating video game Ai, is it worth getting it through this months Humble Bundle?

I already have it so, does anyone want my copy from this month's Humble Bundle at, let's say half off?

I'm going to gamble 6$ on the mystery games every time I paused I dearly regretted it

EDIT: sold to Kronen

I agree. If you think that XCOM 3 is rage-quit territory because it puts you in situations where your team can get wiped out in a turn, then this game is not for you. But if you understand how much depends on your loadout, mech choices, team skills, terrain, etc, then you'll find that it's maybe 1 in 75 or so that just make you stop and restart, or go back to an earlier save and avoid altogether.

Battletech is a very faithful port of the tabletop game rules. It's a *steal* for $25, much less $12. I charged in on the initial release and have been very, very happy with it. It will live on my drive for years.

BTW, mods are not always - these days, not *usually* - fixes to a bad game. Usually, they are extensions. That's the case for the BTech ones we've been discussing here. The game is not broken or fatally flawed, at all.

Wait, Robear, you've played Xcom 3!?

I agree regarding the mods for this game. Early on there were some mods that offered performance tweaks, but that's all been cleaned up as far as I can tell. Now they're just made by enthusiasts who want (and want to provide) more. This is because the game is so good, rather than bad.

I totally understand the other perspective. There are millions of games to play, so no need to tinker with mods unless you find a game where you can't get enough.

Isn't it at 3? The latest one, with the aliens and psychics and such. I'm bad with names. (Yeah, it's 2, sorry about that.)