The GWJ JRPG Club - Q1 2019 - Persona 5!

LastSurprise wrote:
Darkhaund wrote:

I HATE YOU GUYS lol

I had persona 4 Golden unopened just there on my collection. Then a few days ago my cousin said he has addicted to persona 5... and kept talking about it over and over. So on Xmas dinner at this place... i saw the game... went back home immediately and launched my persona 4 golden on my vita to see what the fuss was all about.. DAAAAAAAM.. im 20 hours in just like that. Just ordered p5 on amazon ... so count me in. I will tyr be best to keep up

DAMNIT... why why why.... my backlog is huuuuuge... Xenoblade chronicles 2, octhpath.... ys... but this damn game got me hooooked. (P4G)

IMAGE(https://i.imgur.com/1ShPoAK.jpg)

NEVER... NEVAAAAA NEVAAAAA I will never...

BAHHH... who am I kidding.!!!!

I already made peace with myself and placed Ys lacrimosa of dana, Star ocean and Xenoblace Chronilces 2 on a "brief" hold.

I will work and advance as mucha as i CAN ON PG4. But i can play then alongside since P5 IS ON THE PS4

I like the relaxed schedule for this and I will make my best to keep up.

I’m in. I absolutely loved P3 and P4, played them both portable, and P5 has been on my pile of shame mostly bc it’s harder to log 100 hours on the living room TV. Will try some Vita remote play for this.

Oh yeah good point. PS4 remote play works on Vita or on a PC. I have done the PC thing quite often when I can't get the TV from my wife. Even though P5 is a beautiful game and deserves full 1080p, something is better than nothing.

I played a little more today and have progressed far enough to have a full party (about 3-4 hours in). This is near the end of the first calendar week, and I recall that within the next few days, the game will take off the training wheels, let me choose how to spend my time, and give me a deadline for infiltrating the first palace. I'm going to stop here for a bit, I think, until some more of the group gets started.

I had one pleasant surprise inside the first palace: the game let me skip shadow negotiation altogether. I had forgotten that if you try to recruit a shadow that was already in your persona compendium, you could bypass negotiation by telling the shadow "There's no need for that." Well, in a NG+, your persona compendium carries over, so apparently there's no need to negotiate with any shadow you gained during your first playthrough. That will help speed things up considerably.

It's New Year's Eve! Should we go out and party? Or maybe stay home and play some video games?

IMAGE(https://i.imgur.com/wqWEGxP.jpg)

DAMN IT MORGANA!

I stayed home and played lots of Perso... er, *cough* Xenoblade Chronicles. Game club failure!

Stele wrote:

Oh yeah good point. PS4 remote play works on Vita or on a PC. I have done the PC thing quite often when I can't get the TV from my wife. Even though P5 is a beautiful game and deserves full 1080p, something is better than nothing.

Persona 3 you men persona portable on teh PSP?

Is it woth getting?

I meant playing P5 on Remote Play if you can't get TV time, like Royce mentioned above.

I don't have a Vita actually. Played P3 FES and P4 regular on PS3 with PSN download versions. I do have a PS TV thing but haven't bothered to track down P3P as again, that would require TV to play and it's tough to get TV time from the wife.

If PS3 had Vita remote play I'd probably be 20 hours in by now :).

My ps4 ans psvita simply dont want to connect... any ideas?

Started Persona 5 the other day and man, this game just oozes style from the flashy visuals to the jazzy tunes. I didn't get that far (went to school and got introduced to the principal) but already I'm getting overwhelmed by the idea of managing my time. Does any seasoned P5 players have any advice on that? Should I just try doing the palaces first?

Later in the game, It's a balance. By leveling up relationships with teammates, you can unlock powers, some of which can really help you in dungeons (palaces). But you have a time limit on finishing by a certain day. And you usually have to go in to a certain point and come back for later, so it takes multiple days to finish. So you don't want to wait too late.

I think the first palace actually teaches you this and forces you to do it on 3 separate visits. So yeah you might as well jump in and get started.

You'll get the hang of it. Just start playing.

It can definitely be overwhelming at first. Before going in, you should spend at least one day hanging out with Ryuji so you can get his Baton Pass ability (you’ll see!).

Also I posted some more in-depth hints at the very beginning of this thread, which might be helpful.

Finished the 2nd boss last night. I am still very confused about fusing my personas but they seem to be doing ok in battle.

The boss fight was typical for JPRGs - a boss with multiple stages, immunities you have to figure out, stronger attacks than everything else. Pretty much was I dislike about the genre, but the rest of the game is so fun!

farley3k wrote:

Finished the 2nd boss last night. I am still very confused about fusing my personas but they seem to be doing ok in battle.

The boss fight was typical for JPRGs - a boss with multiple stages, immunities you have to figure out, stronger attacks than everything else. Pretty much was I dislike about the genre, but the rest of the game is so fun!

Glad you're enjoying the bulk of the game! What do you find confusing about fusing personas? Maybe someone here could help.

LastSurprise wrote:

Glad you're enjoying the bulk of the game! What do you find confusing about fusing personas? Maybe someone here could help.

I think it is more should I use them or should I keep them? It seems like I should try to keep certain types - or ones with specific spells. So if I find that in a dungeon many monsters are weak to lightening I shouldn't fuse a persona with that skill and lose it.

But maybe I am overthinking it and I should just try to fuse lower level ones to higher because they will do more damage?

I will start this one on the weekend

Oh and one thing I really would like is a better map of where I can buy healing items. I just wander around looking in each vending machine which seems inefficient.

farley3k wrote:
LastSurprise wrote:

Glad you're enjoying the bulk of the game! What do you find confusing about fusing personas? Maybe someone here could help.

I think it is more should I use them or should I keep them? It seems like I should try to keep certain types - or ones with specific spells. So if I find that in a dungeon many monsters are weak to lightening I shouldn't fuse a persona with that skill and lose it.

But maybe I am overthinking it and I should just try to fuse lower level ones to higher because they will do more damage?

Your personas are largely disposable. Fusing them into higher level ones is almost always the way to go, especially if yours have already learned all their skills. Personas created through fusion will inherit skills from their sources, so you aren't losing everything you've acquired, and they immediately level-up based on your social links.

You can also recruit a persona from a dungeon an unlimited number of times, and you can even skip the negotiation part of it. So fuse away a persona, and the next time you encounter them, just recruit them again.

farley3k wrote:

I think it is more should I use them or should I keep them? It seems like I should try to keep certain types - or ones with specific spells. So if I find that in a dungeon many monsters are weak to lightening I shouldn't fuse a persona with that skill and lose it.

But maybe I am overthinking it and I should just try to fuse lower level ones to higher because they will do more damage?

You can buy them back from the registry in case you need a particular skill you set aside. It costs money so you should prefer negotiation, but it's nice to know it's there in a pinch. Always make sure your personas are registered before fusing them away.

brokenclavicle wrote:
ClockworkHouse wrote:
garion333 wrote:

I wish P5 was my first Persona, I probably would love it. Instead, I find it anachronistic, but not in a good way. Everything felt like a slog and while the game looked amazing it felt like I was playing a PS2 game, negatives and all.

That's interesting. That's not an opinion that I've heard much. Do you mind expanding on that a bit? What felt anachronistic?

I, too, am interested in this opinion being expounded upon. It's certainly not a common one, and so far my experience with the game doesn't match it. Always good to get different perspectives. :)

Sure, I don't think anything will be surprising in what I say.

The pacing is terrible, which has been the case for a long while. It's the same pacing that harkens back to game length being a selling point. That's generally the most anachronistic part. A Xenoblade game might be just as long as Persona 5, but it earns it by being gigantic. Persona 5 feels like it has more in common with DQVII than DQXI and I feel like a trimmed down or Director's Cut of P5 will do it some good just like the re-release of DQVII did.

I feel like in the time that passed since P3 and P4 were originally released the devs managed to learn very few lessons and instead made P3/4 again with a different cast, made dungeons less boring and added even better menus and camera angles. Otherwise, it's the exact same formula, only longer.

I think the Xenoblade series is a good comparison. My favorite game in the current series is hands down the original Xenoblade Chronicles on Wii as its the most complete package, warts and all. But I prefer the exploration in XCX and XC2 has its merits. All three games are similar, but also distinct. XC2 revamped the combat while XCX went truly open world. I'm engaged by each release as the new/different elements help keep things fresh and interesting.

Persona 3/4/5 are all kind of the same game, but with new story elements. It's not enough to keep me interested, apparently. With Falcom producing numerous games aping the Persona formula and the general abundance of school settings in JRPGs and especially anime, I'm a bit worn out on the whole concept.

So, part of my dissatisfaction in P5 is its design, the other part is my experience with other games and media.

The tldr on all this is that outside of visuals P5 could have released on PS2 right alongside P4.

There's nothing inherently wrong with repeating a formula that works. Dragon Quest has been doing so since time immemorial, and as much as I used to rag on the series for having such a boring combat system they keep that series fresh in other ways. It doesn't always work because if not enough *new* is added then the game will be remembered tepidly (DQVI).

SMT/Persona games shares a similar, though admittedly deeper, combat system than DQ but it's failed to innovate enough lately for me. I really liked the direction Atlus went with Catherine, but the Persona games feel stale to me. None of this means P5 isn't a good game, but it's not what I want to play anymore. Trim it down, don't rush the localization and I'll revisit the game. Until then I might just do the very thing Atlus was afraid of and YouTube my way through the final chapters.

Or I'll re-download it and try and finish it this time. Maybe. One day.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
farley3k wrote:
LastSurprise wrote:

Glad you're enjoying the bulk of the game! What do you find confusing about fusing personas? Maybe someone here could help.

I think it is more should I use them or should I keep them? It seems like I should try to keep certain types - or ones with specific spells. So if I find that in a dungeon many monsters are weak to lightening I shouldn't fuse a persona with that skill and lose it.

But maybe I am overthinking it and I should just try to fuse lower level ones to higher because they will do more damage?

Your personas are largely disposable. Fusing them into higher level ones is almost always the way to go, especially if yours have already learned all their skills. Personas created through fusion will inherit skills from their sources, so you aren't losing everything you've acquired, and they immediately level-up based on your social links.

You can also recruit a persona from a dungeon an unlimited number of times, and you can even skip the negotiation part of it. So fuse away a persona, and the next time you encounter them, just recruit them again.

You can also give the mobile game (Liberation Dx2) a go as that game is basically collecting and fusing demons then battling them. It's a good way to get some experience with the whole concept.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

Your personas are largely disposable. Fusing them into higher level ones is almost always the way to go, especially if yours have already learned all their skills. Personas created through fusion will inherit skills from their sources, so you aren't losing everything you've acquired, and they immediately level-up based on your social links.

Totally agree here, and I would also note that your persona's stats are extremely important to your damage output and your defense. Because your own personas level slowly, you'll tend to get better stats if you keep fusing.

Agathos wrote:

You can buy them back from the registry in case you need a particular skill you set aside. It costs money so you should prefer negotiation, but it's nice to know it's there in a pinch. Always make sure your personas are registered before fusing them away.

This is good advice too. Also, filling out the registry will give you discounts on summoning back personas as you hit certain milestones (like at 25% full, 50% full, etc.). A good registry will also help you acquire some high-level, end-game personas because you will need to fuse personas in very specific combinations. You'll see when you get there.

farley3k wrote:

Oh and one thing I really would like is a better map of where I can buy healing items. I just wander around looking in each vending machine which seems inefficient.

If you build up your relationship with the doctor, you can get almost anything you need from her.

Yeah....she kind of creeps me out....I have been avoiding her.

garion333 wrote:

The tldr on all this is that outside of visuals P5 could have released on PS2 right alongside P4.

Thanks for responding and expanding on your thoughts. I really appreciate it.

I can't say that I disagree with you. I think Persona 5 is a bit more refined and modern than your tl;dr gives it credit for, but it's definitely not a full-on evolution of the series in the same way that Persona 3 was. Ironically, I think that Persona 3 was ultimately so ahead of its time that Persona 5 has managed to fit in comfortably with contemporary releases.

But if you look at Persona 5 as a sequel eight or nine years in the making for a PS2 game, I can see where it's a bit disappointing. It hews closely to the previous games quite a bit, really only fundamentally altering the structure of the dungeons but otherwise only refining and smoothing out the edges of the rest. It's by far the most accessible entry in the franchise as a result, but it's not the most radical.

Which is honestly fine by me. I don't mind franchises that don't shift things up much but take a long time between releases. They come along infrequently enough that I don't get worn out on them but instead welcome the comfort and familiarity of them. Persona might iterate as much between releases as Pokémon or Call of Duty, but it feels less stale since there are longer gaps between them.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
garion333 wrote:

The tldr on all this is that outside of visuals P5 could have released on PS2 right alongside P4.

Thanks for responding and expanding on your thoughts. I really appreciate it.

I can't say that I disagree with you. I think Persona 5 is a bit more refined and modern than your tl;dr gives it credit for, but it's definitely not a full-on evolution of the series in the same way that Persona 3 was. Ironically, I think that Persona 3 was ultimately so ahead of its time that Persona 5 has managed to fit in comfortably with contemporary releases.

But if you look at Persona 5 as a sequel eight or nine years in the making for a PS2 game, I can see where it's a bit disappointing. It hews closely to the previous games quite a bit, really only fundamentally altering the structure of the dungeons but otherwise only refining and smoothing out the edges of the rest. It's by far the most accessible entry in the franchise as a result, but it's not the most radical.

Which is honestly fine by me. I don't mind franchises that don't shift things up much but take a long time between releases. They come along infrequently enough that I don't get worn out on them but instead welcome the comfort and familiarity of them. Persona might iterate as much between releases as Pokémon or Call of Duty, but it feels less stale since there are longer gaps between them.

You're most welcome. I began writing my reply about 24 hours ago, so sorry if it was disjointed at all!

I recall once seeing someone say that P3P is their favorite book cause it cuts out the running around. Due to the limitations of the PSP you had icons and lists to choose from in order to move between area in-town. I thought that was silly because you lost a bit of sense of place from not running around. Now, I feel like I want that for P5 as it'll cut back on the back and forth.

I completely understand why people love the game and whatnot, I'm played out atm. I don't think Persona needs a wholesale revolution in game design to be interesting again, but I hope the next game hews in that direction instead of simply polishing a diamond, again.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
farley3k wrote:
LastSurprise wrote:

Glad you're enjoying the bulk of the game! What do you find confusing about fusing personas? Maybe someone here could help.

I think it is more should I use them or should I keep them? It seems like I should try to keep certain types - or ones with specific spells. So if I find that in a dungeon many monsters are weak to lightening I shouldn't fuse a persona with that skill and lose it.

But maybe I am overthinking it and I should just try to fuse lower level ones to higher because they will do more damage?

Your personas are largely disposable. Fusing them into higher level ones is almost always the way to go, especially if yours have already learned all their skills. Personas created through fusion will inherit skills from their sources, so you aren't losing everything you've acquired, and they immediately level-up based on your social links.

You can also recruit a persona from a dungeon an unlimited number of times, and you can even skip the negotiation part of it. So fuse away a persona, and the next time you encounter them, just recruit them again.

This advice would work for Shin Megami Tensei IV too! You wouldn't have to change a single word, outside of persona = demon.

I'm gunna try to keep my playthrough in pace with this thread. I just got my fourth party character, but still haven't really gotten to a point where I am not completely on rails. Hopefully I can beat the first dungeon soon. I can only get in maybe 30 min to an hour per night but I'll try to make it work!

This is also my 2nd Persona game, since I played through #4 a couple years ago. The top thing I HATED about that game was the dungeon design, so I am delighted to see this new game is way way better than I ever thought they would make it. Granted I haven't even really explored the first dungeon yet, but the fact that every room doesn't look exactly the same is going to do wonders for my opinion of this game.

Welcome jamos5! Glad you can join us.

If you just got the fourth party member, then you'll be off the rails shortly. Hope you enjoy it, and let us know how you like the first dungeon! Personally, I love the dungeon design.