PhysTraining: Running & Lifting

[size=18]Running[/size]

So I'm not sure if I have mentioned it before here but I've been in the process of training for a marathon next March/April. The training was started about three or so months ago. It's been chugging along quite well. I have also decided to do some sprint racing and maybe a mini-marathon* this summer (some 5ks and if I can find them some 1 milers) and hopefully will do well. I timed myself on the 1 mile and ran it in 6min31 seconds. Definitively not a competitive speed but I plan on having that down to ~6min5seconds by the end of the summer. My 5k time is a joke right now, roughly ~22 1/2mins. Although now that I am not just training for distance I think that will be shaved down by several minutes.

My running schedule during the week is usually (with some variations occasionally):

3 days running a bare minimum of 3-6 miles
2 days running sprints 1-3 miles

[size=18]Lifting[/size]

I started this only recently, ~1 month ago. I have seen growth in muscle mass and can lift a higher poundage than previously. Not much else needed to say about this because the main focus of my physical training is for running and not getting bulky.

[size=18]Eating[/size]

I gave up sweets (not too big a deal since I never really ate them anyways) and all unhealthy foods. I also decided to drink very infrequently (last night was a splurge) since alcohol will put a damper on my physical training.

There is only one problem with adding the lifting on top of the running regime. And that is that I have to eat an insane amount of protein and carbs. Why I consider this a problem is because I need to eat a lot of food and it's annoying. Even if I don't feel hungry I force myself to eat a good amount. On an average day this is my eating schedule

Throughout the Whole Day
~10+ glasses of water
Vitamins: 1 Multivitamin, 1 Vitamin C, 1 Zinc

Breakfast 8:00am
Bowl of Cereal
1-2 pieces of Bread/Toast

Morning Snack 10:00am
An apple/orange usually. It varies though. Sometimes carrots or another vegetable.
1-2 glasses of milk

Lunch 12:00pm
Chicken Breast or Tuna
1-2 pieces of bread and/or some pasta
2 or 3 servings of a vegetable
Several pieces of Turkey

Afternoon Snack 3:30pm
An apple/orange usually. It varies though. Sometimes carrots or another vegetable.
1-2 glasses of milk

Supper 6:00pm
Tuna or more Chicken Breast
Some more bread or pasta
Some more vegetables/fruits

Nightly Snacks
Periodically through the rest of the night I will eat stuff when/if I feel hungry. It may be anything from cereal to more chicken or jello or whatnot.

[size=18]Finally the Point of Posting this Tripe[/size]

I was wondering if anyone that does this kind of stuff have any pointers that they have discovered through their own training since I'm quite new at this whole training stuff? I know I could have just asked this one question instead of posting all that other stuff but I like to talk and there isn't much for me to do this morning since everyone is either studying or are otherwise engaged. Plus I like to talk.

[size=9]*mini-marathon is 13 miles[/size]

Oh ya, I also do a lot (I mean a lot) of sittups to strengthen the abdominal and chest muscles every night. And also do quite a few pushups to add onto the other stuff I do.

What specific resistance training exercises are you doing?

Here''s the program I''m going to be following this summer.

crossfit.com

One of the guys in my class this last spring was doing this program, and it seems to really work for that all around fitness.

Edit: Just suplement more running to get that extra endurance. The guy was training for adventure races, so that''s what he was doing.

"Dr._J" wrote:

What specific resistance training exercises are you doing?

Well I do sets of shoulder presses, bench presses, curls, a couple different tricep exercises, and maybe a couple more. Is that what you mean by resistance training?

I lose wait through massive bowel movements.

I will tell you now, from experience and from others tales, stop doing bench presses, now. It will only hurt you in the long wrong. It is a very unnatural movement that could very possibly blow a shoulder out (believe me, I know). Stick with pushups (I do a variation called the Hindu pushup, thanks to someone here on GWJ for pointing Combat Conditioning out to me.) http://www.mattfurey.com/

Your running program is the only one that I can speak to with any kind of authority, and looks pretty smart to me. It''s very important that you not run every day. Some guys get into running and get totally gung-ho and run daily, and break themselves.

Another thing you may wish to consider is interval running. Go for a good distance (judging from the distances you''re running now, I would say 2-3 miles) alternating sprinting and a light jog. Interval runs have always done wonders for my run time.

Is that a serious link Cartoonin?

Holy crap, I just clicked it myself. I highly recommend the ''Sexual Kung Fu'' link on the left hand side. Hysterical.

Another thing you may wish to consider is interval running. Go for a good distance (judging from the distances you''re running now, I would say 2-3 miles) alternating sprinting and a light jog. Interval runs have always done wonders for my run time.

Sounds like I may start doing that, thanks for the tip. I read about this less than a week ago in some journal or article or something, so I''m glad that you mentioned it.

Speaking of all this, I need to get into shape myself. I''m not too bad, but I have a slight gut, no real stamina, and would like to have some tone muscles, etc. I''m 5''10 (or so..heh) 180lbs. Does anyone have any information on how I should best go about this? I''m not expecting you to give me a personal trainer''s lsit of stuff to do, just some places to research would be fine, or even book reccomendations.

"Dr.Ghastly" wrote:

Speaking of all this, I need to get into shape myself. I''m not too bad, but I have a slight gut, no real stamina, and would like to have some tone muscles, etc. I''m 5''10 (or so..heh) 180lbs. Does anyone have any information on how I should best go about this? I''m not expecting you to give me a personal trainer''s lsit of stuff to do, just some places to research would be fine, or even book reccomendations.

I hear swimming is a great way to get into shape. I would like to swim more often, but my schedule is pretty filled up with running.

Swimming is supposed to be the single best form of exercise. Works all major muscle groups and does none of the joint damage that running does. I wouldn''t know from experience, though, I swim like a rock.

I''m not much of a runner but I used to swim quite a bit and am currently trying to get back into it. You may want to look into doing some cross-training as I ran and biked quite a bit during my in-shape years as a swimmer. At the least, swimming will help your endurance and establishing a decent breathing pattern while providing a break for your joints from impact running. My sister who has run a few mini-marathons but never a full-blown marathon, has started swimming again (I''m not sure out of necessity or what) although she hated the sport as a child. I don''t think she lifted much, muscle mass isn''t as important in distance running.

Ghastly, oh yeah, the link is real, I forget who on here pointed it out to me. The people who have been serious about following his different body weight exercise programs have gotten really good results. As soon as I get my knee operated on this coming friday, I will be doing most of the exercises in the book I ordered off of there, Combat Conditioning. He lets you know you will not be ""cut up"" like a body builder, but you will stronger than you ever have and have ""functional strength"".

Yeah Im not much for running. I would liek my knees to not get damaged anymore then they are. if anything I''d take up biking. I''ll look into the link you sent Cartoonin. Seems interesting.

I''ve been doing pushups since 1996 and Aikido (mostly) since 2000. I don''t do either to excel, just to maintain. I.e. my goal is to never fall below 40 pushups at once, or 3 Aikido classes per week. I am not an example of stellar fitness, and eat whatever I want, which often includes burgers and ice-cream. I am 6""1-6""2, around 184lbs, seem to be maintaining this ratio thus far.

I''ve tried taking up jogging more times than I can remember. I think it is very useful and when I do miss my regular routine I go have a 1 mile jog to ""sort of"" compensate. Thats ''cause I''m a terrible runner and can''t do more than 1 mile at a time.

If you have access to an eliptical runner, they are easier on your body than running, lower impact, but you still burn the same calories as if you were running.

I know Sexual Kung-Fu.

I never doubted that.

Sorry for the late reply to your question Taco. Damn Guild Wars.... so addictive. Yes, those are the kinds of exercises I mean by resistance training. You may want to consider adding some exercises for your legs to help build muscle strength and endurance. Squats and lunges are excellent compound exercises for hitting both the quadriceps and hamstrings at the same time. I would recommend for you Taco to set your point of failure when doing these exercises to around 12 reps. You indicated that you are more interested in toning up and increasing strength, not bulking up and adding lean mass. Lower reps with heavy poundage will stimulate muscle growth, while less weight more reps helps with toning and strengthing.

Your diet that you are following is excellent in my opinion. There has been much research done on the frequency of eating and the old myth of eating only three meals a day is quickly dying out. When you eat small meals frequently it helps keep the levels of insulin and glucagon from spking up and down. One thing I would recommend for you Taco is the possiblity of adding a protein supplement to your diet. I use to be aganinst using anything like this, but lately I have hit a pleateau in my training and have not been able to make any gains in strength. Upon analyzing my diet, I found that I was not getting any near the amount of complete protein that I should be. Normally, in a healthy diet a person should get .8 grams of protein for every 1 kg of weight they weigh every day. Individuals who are involved in heavy exercise training should get 1 g of protein for every 1kg of body weight they weight . I have been drinking protein shakes now for about 2 weeks and I am beginning to see results. Increased strength and energy being two of the things major results so far. Ultimately, protein shakes are more cost effective (that was the biggest reason I starting taking them), then trying to get huge amounts protein from meats and eggs. There are only so many eggs you can eat in one day. Last thing I would suggest you do Taco is to keep a journal and record what you are eating, what exercises you are doing, and how far/fast you are running for each day. At the end of the month take a look back and see if any new foods/exercises you introduced into your regime helped or hindered you. You can then adjust your program around that.

Dr. Ghastly, the most important when it comes to trying to start an exercise program is to choose activities you enjoy doing. If you hate running, then you will be less motivated to run and stick with the program. Biking is a great cardio vascular activity and will really help improve your stamina, energy and will help shed some pounds when coupled with a good diet.

*Steps of soapbox* Now if you''ll excuse me, I''m going back to Guild Wars

You may want to consider adding some exercises for your legs to help build muscle strength and endurance.

I would do that, but considering how much I run I am afraid I will pull or strain a muscle in my legs. After a 5 1/2 mile run in a bit over 36 minutes I just don''t feel good about doing leg exercises.

Last thing I would suggest you do Taco is to keep a journal and record what you are eating, what exercises you are doing, and how far/fast you are running for each day. At the end of the month take a look back and see if any new foods/exercises you introduced into your regime helped or hindered you. You can then adjust your program around that.

That sounds like an excellent idea. I may start implementing it this week. Thanks!

Chalk up another Combat Conditioning person. I use it as my primary workout for training for MMA-style sparring. That coupled with other body-weight exercises (handstands, pushups, reverse pushups, etc.) are the only ""resistance"" exercises I do. It''s worth at least looking into, ignoring all the other mumbo-jumbo on the site.

This Combat Conditioning guy has been running those low-rent-look, all-text ads in BlackBelt magazine practically forever. I don''t trust those cheesy ads.

I practice Taekwondo, and it''s an unbelievable workout in terms on intensity. I found that I can''t do much weightlifting at a gym anymore, because then I don''t have energy left when I come to dojang. Additionally, I never have enough time to recover from lifing and to let the muscle grow. I do miss my favorite leg excercises with machines and weight rack, though.

So I just gave up on it. All I do outside of dojang is some threadmill jogging, pullups and pushups, and a Pilates and abs classes twice a week during the lunch if my works allows me. Depending upon the fatigue level, I can do 40 to 50 knuckle pushups on a bare floor nonstop, and I need to increase it to 70 within two months.

"Fiddler" wrote:

I''m not much of a runner but I used to swim quite a bit and am currently trying to get back into it. You may want to look into doing some cross-training as I ran and biked quite a bit during my in-shape years as a swimmer. At the least, swimming will help your endurance and establishing a decent breathing pattern while providing a break for your joints from impact running. My sister who has run a few mini-marathons but never a full-blown marathon, has started swimming again (I''m not sure out of necessity or what) although she hated the sport as a child. I don''t think she lifted much, muscle mass isn''t as important in distance running.

I spend a fair amount of my summer up by Lake Erie, so swimming is a pretty good option for me. I swim... okay... but having swum with competitive swimmers, I recognize that my form could be a whole lot better. Is it worth it to get lessons to become a better swimmer?

I''m all about saving a buck, so unless you want to become competitive, I''d say no.

Hey Taco nice work.

As a experienced endurance athlete, I''d say you''re overtraining the running. What''s your realistic expectations on marathon/half marathon time? Forget sprints for distance running. You''re just not there yet. You need to focus on the slow increase in milage on your ONE long, slow run a week. No more than 10% milage increase (total) per week. Check this link:

http://www.halhigdon.com/marathon/Ma...

Higdon''s program is what my training partner uses, I uses Jeff Galloway''s.

I''d guess that you are still in your 20''s? 30''s? That make a huge difference in how much you can train. I''m in my 40''s and from expereience I can say you will learn to take it easy.

Remember- have fun. I used to train until I puked, and really, it dosen''t do that much more for you. You most effectively burn fat at 65-85% of your maximum heart rate. I''ll say it again take it easy- beginner''s always overtrain.

Okay, forget weight training for your legs. Forget it. You are a novice runner and your legs won''t be able to take the stress. While Runner''s World and other mags say its helpful, and it is, that''s for experienced runners in the off season. Worry about strengh for the legs after your second or third 4 hour marathon.

I cross train 3 day a week and run 3 days a week, so I''m really neither fish nor fowl; I lift too much weight to be a effective runner, and I run too much to be a effective weight lifter. But I like my level of fitness and how I look, and that''s utimately what its about. Ego and vanity

I''d not worry too much about bench press, unless you''re lifting 300+. You can blow out a shoulder, the weight nuts at my gym do it all the time, but if you are smart, it''s the fundamental chest building exercise. Use a smith machine and sane weights.

READ AND STUDY COMPLETE RUNNING PROGRAMS IF YOU ARE SERIOUS.

Good job, and good luck!

EDIT: As to food, I''d say match up carbs and protien in every meal. When I was seriously weight training, I''d eat a chicken breast and a can of tuna every 2 hours along with whole roled oats. That''s pycho. But you do want frequent, balanced, small meals. Eat smart, you know what''s good for you. This month''s Runner''s World has a whole section of diet and being totally fit. Pick it up.

I''ve been looking for some information on a good workout routine for myself as well. Unfortunately, I''m very short on space and cash, so I''m pretty limited. I don''t have a garage or a lot of floor space for eq. I play 2-4 games of hockey per week and 1-2 kung fu classes. Those are a pretty good workout themselves obviously, but my endurance hasn''t improved very much, just strength and balance.
typically on a day I don''t already have kung fu or hockey I do knuckle pushups until my arm strength gives out and 60 situps. I haven''t bought a weight set because, honestly, I don''t even know what sorts of things to do with them.
Any help would be much appreciated.

Taco: don''t forget to vary your fruit intake. Banans and grapes are also excellent for athletes. Bananas have lots of potassium which improves reaction time. Grapes are really good for something, too.

Taco: don''t forget to vary your fruit intake. Banans and grapes are also excellent for athletes. Bananas have lots of potassium which improves reaction time. Grapes are really good for something, too.

Memory? Heh...

Bananas have lots of potassium which improves reaction time.

Had one at lunch.