Dealing with Divorce Catch-All

You just need to really be firm with her that she SHOULD NOT communicate with you unless it is an emergency about your son when he is with her. Just tell her you won't text or talk to her unless it is an emergency and stick to it. If she wants to ask about money for school or whatever have her email you (so you have a record) or keep it to hand offs.

You have to stick to this though. Don't answer back and tell her to stop because now she knows it is bugging you and she took up your time.

Wink, I think you’re on point. I know my ex can go weeks without sending a text or anything and then when I ask to be reimbursed for half of the boys’ school fees, gel start bombarding me with mails criticizing my parenting etc. It’s just retaliation because he knows he’s in the wrong. At least that’s what I keep telling myself.

haha PTXSD is right on. This divorce stuff really should have its own disorder named after it. So terrible.

Wink, I think you're at least partly right. To me it seems like she's trying to get herself into my life as much as possible, where she can then take as much control as possible. It's always about control. You don't need to shut up! Everything helps here.

m0nk3yboy, that's essentially what the mediator said on Friday. We need a more effective way of communicating, and this is one way to get at it. I said in the meeting that I would only do it if it's done individually, but I'm really afraid the person we go to will start insisting pretty quickly that we all need to be in the same room for any of this to work. I know my ex would be all about that as well. I just can't do that. I really can't. I need to make sure from the start that this person understands that.

karmajay, you're totally right. I've said it so many times to her over the years, and it just keeps not happening. Eventually I just stopped responding to those kind of texts, but then when I email about something else, I end up getting replies that have nothing to do with what I wrote and are just "you are ignoring me, why haven't you responded to my texts?" and so I have to respond somehow before anything else can move forward. It's so frustrating.

When the person you're trying to interact with is irrational, you can't use rational arguments with them, and you can't use emotional arguments either when they care for nothing but themselves. It's all such a waste of time. Unfortunately this is what I'm dealing with. It's why I don't think a "coparenting coach" will have any effect at all, and will essentially be a waste of time and money. But hey, maybe I'm just being really cynical thanks to years of dealing with this stuff and it'll work in the end.

d4m0 wrote:

m0nk3yboy, that's essentially what the mediator said on Friday. We need a more effective way of communicating, and this is one way to get at it. I said in the meeting that I would only do it if it's done individually, but I'm really afraid the person we go to will start insisting pretty quickly that we all need to be in the same room for any of this to work. I know my ex would be all about that as well. I just can't do that. I really can't. I need to make sure from the start that this person understands that.

I feel like this third party coparenting coach will quickly realize that putting you both in the same room will only escalate conflict. Have some faith

Dakuna wrote:

I feel like this third party coparenting coach will quickly realize that putting you both in the same room will only escalate conflict. Have some faith :)

Hopefully! Heh, faith. Over the last many years unfortunately it's been pounded out of me. We'll see how it goes.

d4m0, have you looked into apps that are designed for separated families in contested family law cases? A judge in one of my cases recently ordered the parents to purchase and install My Family Wizard (I think that's what it was called). I believe it saves voice calls, messages etc so a third party such as a judge can access and review the logs as part of case management and making parenting orders. It's not cheap though (over $100).

Something like that, which puts people on notice that they will be held accountable for their actions and behaviour, could serve as a means of moderating everyone's behaviour.

That sounds incredibly sane, Bfgp.

Bfgp, I had no idea such a thing even existed! That is very interesting. I will look into that, because it would be nice to have everything in one place, instead of having to search through gmail and my phone for old texts. Calls don't really happen any more, but just in case they do, it would be nice to have them.

Quick update: three conflict resolution people/therapists have been contacted and only one got back to us. She charges $200 per hour and doesn't take insurance, so that one is pretty much out. I've basically accepted that the only way the agreement is going to be actually updated is if we stand in front of a judge and they order it. At least I'm not feeling so down about life at this point. Working past it, working past it.

Sometimes, just doing something about it makes you feel better, or realizing something, or accepting something.

d4m0 I'm really sorry it's this hard, dealing with someone that isn't rational is super tiresome, I can only imagine how much worse it is when you have a vested interest as important as your son.

d4m0 - I don't remember what the exact terms are for your child sharing. I understand always trying to be the better person, I usually do that in my day to day life also. BUT, here this is causing your current family so much stress etc etc.

Personally, I would just screenshot all communications with the other person and be forceful about only interacting in emergencies or extremely important child issues. Your kid is a teen now so besides those things you should cut out other communication. All these other things you are trying to do can only be successful when both parents are trying to have this type of relationship in GOOD FAITH.

After a certain age a kid can actually choose which parent they want to live with. Maybe it is time to spend this useless conflict resolution money toward changing the agreement so you have full custody. That means she would really be out of your life but if your kid still wants to spend time with her that is of course still fine.

Iirc the boy is now in his early teens, d4m0? That is more than old enough for the child's views to have a very significant impact on co-parenting arrangements if the previous parenting agreement were ever revisited by a judge.

As much as I support alternative dispute resolution, it only works when people adhere to the negotiated outcome. This rarely happens in family law and judges get exhausted by the sheer number of cases with blatant breaches of court orders that unless it manifests in physical harm or a substantial degree of psychological harm to a child then the judges will just shrug and ask everyone to move along. Still, in your first session I think it will become apparent whether it is likely to be successful or whether a court application is the only way forward.

That's right, he's 13, so I'd think a judge would take his wishes into account. I've read that it starts to get important to the court around age 14, so it's certainly at least close.

As of today it's barely even about sticking to the negotiated outcome - it's more just what each of us think should go into the updated court agreement. Besides the custody day changes (which we've already been doing for a couple months with little issue), and vacation time additions, and child support amount updates, the ex wants to add house rule kinds of things to it. Stuff like types of allowed video games, bed times, and set screen times.

I really don't think these things should be added to the court-approved divorce agreement. These things change over time often and they are fairly fluid. If I agree to put into the agreement that his bedtime is 10 pm and then I let him stay up until 10:30 some random night and the ex finds out somehow, I don't want to have it become A Thing. Or if he happens to play a particular first-person shooter game. It just seems crazy to me to put that kind of thing in there. A divorce agreement is for custody and child support, not for house rules. I don't want to go to the courthouse every six months to change his bedtime either.

My ex has said that she is willing to go all the way to a judge to have that stuff put in. There's little chance a judge will give it the time of day, but just the idea of it is stressful. Who knows what else a judge will check out while we're there too.

Got a phone call from my ex. My 4 year old daughter was sad and missing me so I spoke to her on the phone and she said she missed me and that she loves me.

Haven't been able to stop crying since. Was doing ok before but yeah, that just hurts a little. I miss my kids. Couple more days then I can see them again.

Had the weekend to myself and yeah, it's an interesting feeling not wanting to socialise, but at the same time feeling alone.

yeah... thats tough blacksabre. I can relate to the part about wanting to be alone but being lonely. Hang in there.

Well, it's a great sign your ex is putting the girl in touch with you when she seeks contact with her father, I mean, that is a win when you consider how bleak it must be for a child who doesn't understand why her parents must go separate ways and how common it is to encounter situations where parents deny each other contact with the child and don't promote contact.

Hang in there Blacksabre, it could be much worse, and look on the bright side, when you do see her again it'll be your opportunity to help reassure her that there will be many more times ahead together and encourage her to express her need for contact without the emotions/temper that I suspect may be affecting her ability to coherently express that desire to her mother.

I guess what I am trying to say is that encouraging regular contact as a normal narrative is desired rather than the child instigating contact in a temper tantrum/sulk but you are still very much in an early phase of separation and your child may need quite a few more years to mature enough to appreciate that it's not possible for her parents to get back together.

BlackSabre, my heart goes out to you. I went through the exact same thing when my son was five, in the months after my ex and I initially separated. It is so, so hard. I ended up actually pulling out a webcam and recording myself saying things to my son, and then sending the video to my ex to play for him. As far as I know she did show them to him.

I think Bfgp hit it on the nose with his last paragraph - encourage the regular contact as a normal thing that happens. In the very young years these kids need it. Good luck, and remember it does get easier.

I just wanted to resurrect this thread to lament the fact that sometimes there is no way to make everyone happy. Lately I've felt like I can't win, no matter what I do, and it sucks. I've got a wife, I've got a kid, I've got an ex-wife. Being in the middle of all of that is so unbelievably stressful and tiring. Someone always seems to be angry or annoyed with the situation, and most of the time, I'm damned if I do, damned if I don't. I'm saying that in the literal sense - I have tried multiple ways of doing something, only to have it fly back in my face every time, just in the last couple weeks. Everyone, divorce sucks. Sometimes I wish I was just living alone in a shack in the wilderness.

d4m0 wrote:

I just wanted to resurrect this thread to lament the fact that sometimes there is no way to make everyone happy. Lately I've felt like I can't win, no matter what I do, and it sucks. I've got a wife, I've got a kid, I've got an ex-wife. Being in the middle of all of that is so unbelievably stressful and tiring. Someone always seems to be angry or annoyed with the situation, and most of the time, I'm damned if I do, damned if I don't. I'm saying that in the literal sense - I have tried multiple ways of doing something, only to have it fly back in my face every time, just in the last couple weeks. Everyone, divorce sucks. Sometimes I wish I was just living alone in a shack in the wilderness.

I feel you... I mean, I can't truly relate because of all the things you've listed, I only have the (almost) ex-wife.

My girlfriend didn't work out, and the other people in my life are making me feel the same way you are though. Nothing I do is quite good enough, and none of what is going on in my life is completely satisfying.

Its feeling extra bad lately because my ex broke up with her bf and is really depressed about it. I've been having breakup dreams again, something I thought I'd never have again unless I lost someone else. Ugh.

Hang in there d4m0! For what it's worth, I think you have more positive things in your life to cling to than I do lately

d4m0, I've definitely experienced that stuck in the middle effect after I remarried. The effect has eased some for me in recent years, but the first couple especially I felt like everyone (my wife and my ex in particular) expected me to make decisions (big and small), while both expecting me to reflect their own contrary opinions about it. It feels like getting Monday-morning quarterbacked in some very frustrating ways. My wife and I have had numerous conversations in which I've had to say, "I appreciate what you're saying. I understand why you're saying it, and I agree with you. But I need you to respect that I understand some of these dynamics better and their long-term outcomes."

Usually that's enough to keep the ball from rolling off the cliff with us, but I empathize with how stressful it can be just trying to manage all that. It's very frustrating! Best advice I can give is to keep the discussion open and flowing between you and your wife. You don't always have to agree, but if she at least understands you're the one stuck making decisions and she understands the reasons you make them, the two of you will be okay. If it's bad enough that you think it's at risk of turning toxic, I really can't recommend couples counseling enough for this kind of thing. I went the solo counseling route last fall to deal with some things, which led to trying it as a couple and that has been quite beneficial. (I'm still in my head on a variety of stupid sh*t, but the stress of it is much eased. I've found that having a professional to call bullsh*t and guide towards certain pathways can be amazingly helpful!)

Dakuna, I'm really sorry to read things didn't work out with your GF. That sucks. It's a roller coaster, but at least there is always something waiting around the next turn.

Thanks guys, it really helps. I think my wife does understand the reasons I make the decisions I have to make sometimes, but she just really hates that it has to be that way. I really hate making people feel bad. Being in the middle of three people that all want things to be different and incompatible with each other is just sh*tty.

I was thinking about heading back to my therapist earlier today. Maybe I'll give him a call and see what he's got available. I think about every few months, really. Then a week goes by and I feel better about everything, things get smooth, and it's fine for another few months. Is that enough to see a therapist? Probably.

Dakuna, I'm sorry to hear things are going so rough lately for you. I remember you were pretty excited about that girlfriend you had a little while ago. You hang in there yourself. I don't know about the extra positive things I have! We did just get a house and move into it, but all it's done is drain our bank account and add a pile of things to work on during the weekends. We can't really enjoy it because it's the worst season of the year and we're just stuck indoors anyway. I guess they are our doors at least.

I don't really have anything I can add apart from, that sucks, mate. I hope it get's better soon. Only real thing I can say is don't try and please everyone. It just doesn't work. A massive part of life is understanding that you will upset people with the things you do. It's not fun, but it's inevitable. Just realise that there are times when other people will be in the same spot and you won't be happy about an outcome.

As long as you work through it the best you can and talk to the people around you, you should be ok and you'll get what you need. In a perfect world at least... which, you know, like that's a reality for everyone!

Guess I'm just saying don't beat yourself up. Be kind to yourself and understand that sh*tty things are going to happen and you can't fix everything.

Starting this post has been hard, because I have nothing bad to report. Ironic?

I'm single still, but finding a new balance. Playing a significant amount of games (mostly Fallout 4), focusing on work (putting in overtime, even) and just trying to get by financially.

I haven't gotten drunk alone in months. I just realized this while posting in the drunk thread today. I'm not really drinking during the week at all, and when I drink on the weekends, it's always with friends and mostly in moderation.

I started concerta this week for ADHD. I don't yet know if I like it, today is my third day only, on what I understand is a small dose (18 mg). I think it's helping, but I'm not sure I like how I feel on it. My doctor prescribed 15mg per day, but said I could double it if I wanted to. The pharmacy gave me 36mg tablets I've been cutting in half. Kinda weird way of getting things done, but whatever.

Rambly post, sorry about that, but I'm feeling good about things, but also a bit unsure and out of my depth. The best news is that I'm not dying inside from my failed marriage anymore, so I guess that's worth sharing.

Seriously, not dying on the inside is always good news worth sharing!

I honestly hope things keep going well and you get a really good chance to get used to it. Sounds like you've been dealing with this sh*t for a long time and you're used to dealing with all the bad stuff, so it's good that it's changing.

I can relate. I accepted 2017 as a really sh*t year, but it's now 2018. Time to take a step forward and leave all that in the past. I've learned my lessons, I've dealt (mostly) with the heart ache. It's now time to take the positive steps forward and look at ways to make life better. Don't for a second think it's going to be all roses and sunshine, but if you take those positive steps then for the most part, it should be a better year.

That's so great to hear Dakuna! It sounds like you're getting into a good stride and things are smoothing out a bit. I agree with BlackSabre, good news is always worth sharing. And Fallout 4 is a worthy place to put your time! You deserve it, man.

I feel bad because I haven't touched the gifted Doom I have yet... I will, I promise!

So... pretty unrelated, but do we have a death/grief/loss thread?

Dakuna wrote:

So... pretty unrelated, but do we have a death/grief/loss thread?

We've got some sadly specific ones, but I don't think there's a general one besides the F*** You Cancer one.

Stengah wrote:
Dakuna wrote:

So... pretty unrelated, but do we have a death/grief/loss thread?

We've got some sadly specific ones, but I don't think there's a general one besides the F*** You Cancer one.

Hmm. Thanks. Probably I should just be happy with the support I already get here!

Dakuna wrote:
Stengah wrote:
Dakuna wrote:

So... pretty unrelated, but do we have a death/grief/loss thread?

We've got some sadly specific ones, but I don't think there's a general one besides the F*** You Cancer one.

Hmm. Thanks. Probably I should just be happy with the support I already get here!

Hey, man, don't hesitate to start another thread. If it covers common ground with an existing one, they'll merge naturally, and if not, it'll be helpful for a separate set of folk.

Chumpy_McChump wrote:
Dakuna wrote:
Stengah wrote:
Dakuna wrote:

So... pretty unrelated, but do we have a death/grief/loss thread?

We've got some sadly specific ones, but I don't think there's a general one besides the F*** You Cancer one.

Hmm. Thanks. Probably I should just be happy with the support I already get here!

Hey, man, don't hesitate to start another thread. If it covers common ground with an existing one, they'll merge naturally, and if not, it'll be helpful for a separate set of folk.

I'll think on it. I appreciate the supportive comment.