JRPG Catch-All

I don't think I saw any gameplay in there but the Shining Series has traditionally been a SRPG franchise, has that changed at all?

Edit: Nevermind I see you mentioned it before the video posted. Well I'll still keep an eye on it.

I'm sorry for dominating this thread with Secret of Mana talk. I've had two sick days and a lot of time to grind play. I'm coming in towards the end and have a few thoughts.

The first is, if this were $30 instead of $40 and didn't crash like Windows ME I think the price would be easier for folks to swallow. Part of this comes about from playing the opening to I Am Setsuna, and holy cow do those locations look detailed and gorgeous. So does Secret of Mana, but given that it is based off of tile art it's less noticeable (also: in some instances it simply doesn't look as good). But I think the lengths they went to get the aesthetic right are under-appreciated. When I look at the screenshot thumbnails in my trophy list, it looks like it could be from the SNES game.

The second is that I considered what it would be like if I took the game back in time to 10 year-old me, let them play it, and then discussed all the negative things about it that I've said and what others have said (and now that I've almost beaten it, may as well read what folks like Jeremy Parish have written). 10 year-old me, while hardly of discerning taste, would likely think I'm crazy. First, 10 year-old me has no context for presentation so would have no clue these cut-scenes could easily have been made better than they are now. But when it comes to the free movement as opposed to the 8-direction movement and 4-direction attack of the SNES game, that alone would be enough to kick the experience up several notches. The voicework, the translation, the music... it would have been precisely what I wanted a remake to be, and would have excited me for the future of gaming.

Now, this is a very hokey, sappy, and irrational lens through which to perceive it, but it does make me wonder what we as adults really want out of a recreation of something we loved as children. My friend Steve and I are probably going to make our next podcast on this very topic, referencing things like the remakes of FF1 and FFIV, though there's also Bionic Commando: ReArmed and Metroid Zero Mission to consider, as well as the differences between AM2R and Samus Returns.

The thing is, if I were to ask myself if I wanted to sit down and replay the game on SNES or PS4 -- and this is key to my original question of "why does this exist?" -- I think I'd choose PS4. It might not be the massive improvement I would have wanted, it might be $10 too many, it might need a patch really really badly, but at the end of the day the game just feels better to play than the SNES version.

Self-imposed grinding aside, I'm actually pretty happy with this remake. Sure, it's not the ideal, but it's as faithful to the original as possible. Even though the game uses a modern engine, they made sure it still feels like you remember the original feeling to play. If I hadn't replayed the game (in part) recently on SNES Classic, I wouldn't have known much of the difference. I can point out all the obvious ways in which this feels cheap, but there are hundreds or thousands of subtle ways in which it must have been a true labor of the heart.

Speaking of grinding, for those that are idiots like me and want to try for that Platinum, here's a few things I've learned. The first is you don't need to have all weapons leveled-up to 9, but have Watts upgrade them to that form. If you're unfamiliar with how you get some of these final orbs, well, a bunch of them are apparently rare drops in the final level. Hurray!

Even so, if you're gonna be lame like me and grind stuff out, then here's my recommendation:

Spoiler:

Grind Primm's magic at the Wind Temple
So remember how I said it's easier to grind at Temples? Well, I tried the Water Temple and it didn't work. It still halved the experience gained per spell. It seems the Wind Temple, where you get Sylphid/Djinn, is the exception. This is actually beneficial, as Poipoi's grandfather is the swiftest heal and save in the game. So just have her go back and forth casting spells of low-MP cost on Randi and Poipoi and talk to grandpop once you've run out of MP.

Grind Poipoi's Magic at Kakkara Desert
The nice thing about the Spider Legs is that they don't attack you unless you attack them, and once Sprite's magic reaches a high enough level it one-hit kills those things every time. Even better is once you get Luna on your team and he can use Magic Absorb. Note that even if the enemy has no MP, Luna will still gain experience with a casting of Magic Absorb. Just... make sure you use your final magic point on someone that will restore you pool of magic. I've found this to be the best place to level his spells up.

Grind weapons between Gaia's Navel and the Water Palace
You just one-shot kill everything. Just go from the water palace to gaia's navel, enter the cave towards the dwarfs, exit back out, and head right back to the water palace.

Personally, I stopped grinding after I got everyone's magic to level 7, and won't grind until after the second-to-last location. I'm looking up some of these trophy guides and it looks like you don't need to grind magic up to level eight either, but I probably will as enemies are getting high evasion and are strong against physical attacks, making Poipoi's offensive spells crucial.

Regardless, having a lot of fun, will have more fun on following playthroughs when I don't care about trophies.

How's that remaster of Radiant Historia?

Secret of Mana getting a patch in early March first on PS4, later on Vita and PC.

ccesarano wrote:

Secret of Mana getting a patch in early March first on PS4, later on Vita and PC.

Added a guide display for the switch button on the Ring Command screen
Added an icon for the character currently using a ring on the Ring Command screen
Added an item effect display for Item Rings and the Ring Command screen

I'd love to know the decisions that went into this design, but since that'll never happen it's nice to see them fix these issues.

The decision was "keep it as close to the original game as possible".

Honestly I don't get why they needed to add an icon for the character currently using the ring. The ring itself changes color according to that character. Maybe it's more obvious on PS4 because the controller's light thing changes color to match that character when you're controlling them. So Randi is blue, Primm is pink, and Poipoi is green.

If I understand Jeremy Parish's review correctly they put the ring in the center of the screen at all times in the remake instead of centering it around the character who opened it. So it's not clear which character ring is currently open, at least on the Vita version.

Ah, I can see that. I didn't think of that difference. I guess they figured the color of the ring selector would give it away (and for me it's largely been enough to tell who I'm controlling).

Chrono Trigger is on Steam

It seems to be a shoddy port of the mobile version.

beanman101283 wrote:

It seems to be a shoddy port of the mobile version.

I'm shocked, shocked, to read this.

beanman101283 wrote:

Chrono Trigger is on Steam

It seems to be a shoddy port of the mobile version.

Oddly enough, they pushed out an update to the mobile versions calling it CHRONO TRIGGER (Upgrade Ver.)...

What's shoddy about the mobile version? I have it but never played it. I was planning on doing so after I finish Secret of Mana.

Get the NDS version, or a SNES Virtual Console version.

Blind_Evil wrote:

What's shoddy about the mobile version? I have it but never played it. I was planning on doing so after I finish Secret of Mana.

I’ll let Jason do most of the talking. Basically because it looks like no actual work was done to make it look and play nice on a pc. UI issues, fonts, and a touch interface that doesn’t do anything.

https://kotaku.com/oh-no-chrono-trig...

So, uh, does anyone else get jumped to page 495 whenever they click "new" on their recent activity in this page?

Also: been playing I Am Setsuna. Someone needs to explain Flux's a bit to me, or reshare that video. Are they permanent after a time?

I appreciate your responses, but they don't really answer my question. I've played the DS and SNES versions, and those systems don't come with me everywhere like my phone. And the PC version review doesn't address my question of what's wrong with the mobile version specifically.

I guess beanman said the PC port was shoddy, rather than the mobile version. I read it as the mobile version being shoddy.

Blind_Evil wrote:

I appreciate your responses, but they don't really answer my question. I've played the DS and SNES versions, and those systems don't come with me everywhere like my phone. And the PC version review doesn't address my question of what's wrong with the mobile version specifically.

The mobile version? Nothing is wrong with it. The font choice is still bad but nothing is wrong with it.

Vrikk wrote:

a SNES Virtual Console version.

Which isn't going to be an option in a month

I'm sure this has been covered in the past, but: if I want to play Chrono Trigger on a larger screen, is there any issue with the "PS1 classics" version on my PS3? (The PS1 port is how I originally played the game, years ago.)

Too bad they didn't include Chrono Trigger on the SNES Classic machine (which actually seems to have half-decent supply, I occasionally see one or two in the wild) instead of, say, Secret Of Mana, which they just ported to contemporary machines. (But I suppose a subjective ranking of what should be on the list is a big can of worms, huh?)

The PS Classics version I believe still contains the load time issues with transitioning to the menus. Thanks Sony and TOSE!

If you still have a Wii or Wii U kicking around there's always the Virtual Console version. Just be aware that you have until the 28th (I think) to add Wii Shop funds.

Best option remains ROMS and an emulator of the original SNES version, unless you've got a DS

Well, I might have made a mistake looking to see how far I am in I Am Setsuna. I was curious what my overall progress was and I'm apparently roughly halfway through.

Man, you level up slowly in this game if that's the case.

I recall a lot of people being disappointed by it? Thinking it's okay but not great? I dunno, I'm enjoying it quite a bit. I'd agree it's not great, but maybe it helps I was never expecting something mind-blowing. About the only thing I had expected was for Setsuna herself to be a bit more... negative in attitude? I dunno why, but the trailers led me to believe she was a melancholy person. That she's the most super-duper kindest girl that ever girled is a bit of a disappointment, as it basically makes the story Final Fantasy X but with snow instead of Pacific Islander. Speaking of, I can also see the complaints about the world being all snow all the time. While having different colored dungeons wouldn't make much difference in how they play out, it would certainly at least feel like you were seeing the world.

Nevertheless, I find myself having a decent time. If Lost Sphear improves on I Am Setsuna in any way – and judging by the demo it might – then I'd say it's worth the extra $10 just for that. I may snag it as a game for March, truth told.

I find it interesting that the game doesn't actually give you cash. I never feel flush with it, but by being encouraged to use Momentum and Techs to get better rewards in battle I can stock up on materials to sell and thus be decently covered. Interesting system, but it, too, can still turn into a grind as I never feel like I have enough status healing items and due to the nature of the economy I'm not eager to spend all I got.

shoptroll wrote:

The PS Classics version I believe still contains the load time issues with transitioning to the menus. Thanks Sony and TOSE!

If you still have a Wii or Wii U kicking around there's always the Virtual Console version. Just be aware that you have until the 28th (I think) to add Wii Shop funds.

Are they closing down the Virtual Consoles...?

EDIT: Oh sh*t, March 29th. I never thought they would. Guess I should log into both my systems and ensure that my games are downloaded to the hard drives. Can you back up VC games?

Maybe I should finally look into hacking the consoles to get around all this mess...

Let's see how badly S-E can mess this up:

(Source)

ccesarano wrote:

Well, I might have made a mistake looking to see how far I am in I Am Setsuna. I was curious what my overall progress was and I'm apparently roughly halfway through.

I think HLTB has it at around 20-30 hours last I looked. It's not long, but it is within the range of how long games back then actually were.

I recall a lot of people being disappointed by it? Thinking it's okay but not great?

The marketing/hype from S-E was trying really hard to ride the Chrono Trigger coattails. That's not an act you want to be compared against with your debut.

Vrikk wrote:

Can you back up VC games?

I believe so. Move the games onto a SD card (firmware 4.0 added a feature to boot them from the card too) and then copy the card to a PC.

I REALLY hope they get Valkyrie Profile right. I’ve wanted to play it for a while and even owned it on PSP for a long time but I just find the PSP uncomfortable to play for long periods of time and the original is prohibitively expensive. I’ll prepare for some disappointment but with my fingers crossed nonetheless.

I think what's odd to me is that, if it's 20 hours long, then 1) I haven't noticed how long I have been playing and 2) it certainly takes its time in comparison to those older games, because by halfway through Final Fantasy IV (also 20 or so hours) you've gotten to the underworld already.

It feels like there's significantly fewer locations in this instance.

shoptroll wrote:

Let's see how badly S-E can mess this up:

(Source)

Oh hey, that's one of the games Garion gifted me when he sent me his PSP! Hrm... motivation to check it out is getting stronger...

VP Lenneth was still in the shrinkwrap, if I remember correctly. Might be best to leave it that way and sell as a collector's item later on!

shoptroll wrote:

Let's see how badly S-E can mess this up:

I'll pee myself if we get a really good port. I loved this game (both on PS1 and PSP). I don't know how contemporary audiences will feel about the very lenghty cutscenes, though; and they definitely need to (at minimum) include the quality of life improvements in the USA PS1 version.

Or, you know, they can just throw a ROM and bundled emulator on mobile devices and make me cry.

Tooting my own horn to let any interested folks know that my buddy Steve and I talked the Secret of Mana and other remakes on our podcast. Feel free to provide feedback. Maybe we can finally figure out a better set-up than one mic in a room off to the side in his house.

ccesarano wrote:

Tooting my own horn to let any interested folks know that my buddy Steve and I talked the Secret of Mana and other remakes on our podcast. Feel free to provide feedback. Maybe we can finally figure out a better set-up than one mic in a room off to the side in his house.

Nice! Downloaded and gonna listen to that one.