Giant Bomb Bomb-All

I got what he was saying initially, more people were saying good things about Uncharted than Dream Daddy and 5 of the 7 people that had played it didn't like it all. So while it may be a game of the year to her how does that make it a game of the year for GB?

But then when people spoke up and was like "I've been convinced" he just kept doubling down on it.

Sounded like they had not played Divinity Original Sin 2 - how can they even talk about a top 10 list then?!
Also a distinct lack of Nioh - apparently the one who wanted to fight for that game was not there?
Interesting how they rarely mentioned Horizon too, even though they gave it a glowing review at release.
But I guess it just shows what a quality overloaded year it has been.

Always like to listen to Giantbombs Game of the year podcasts, but zoned out quite a bit this year. They went on a bit too long going in circles in their various defenses of whatever game they wanted to win. And not just for the Best Game category.

Shadout wrote:

Always like to listen to Giantbombs Game of the year podcasts, but zoned out quite a bit this year. They went on a bit too long going in circles in their various defenses of whatever game they wanted to win. And not just for the Best Game category.

I agree, overall. I suspect some of that had to do with the recent additions, though of course the sheer amount of games had something to do with it as well.

Overall I'm disappointed a game I'm never going to enjoy myself, PUBG, won pretty much everything it was up for but I'm not surprised that it did so, given this is the Giant Bomb's GOTY.

bnpederson wrote:

Overall I'm disappointed a game I'm never going to enjoy myself, PUBG, won pretty much everything it was up for but I'm not surprised that it did so, given this is the Giant Bomb's GOTY.

Same, but that's not unusual. The GB, and frankly most game sites/podcast crews, tend to gravitate toward MP games, since they provide solid content, and they have a built in group of people to play with. Even semi-MP stuff like Mario Maker goes over well. Since I don't really enjoy MP games, and don't have a group of people to play with, I'm frequently on the outside looking in as the "game folks" gush about some game or other that I'll never really get to enjoy the same way.

Shadout wrote:

Sounded like they had not played Divinity Original Sin 2 - how can they even talk about a top 10 list then?!

I'm trying to think back, but they generally haven't been big fans of CRPGs at all in the time I've been listening to them. I could check previous lists, but that would take too long. I don't think they've even been a big fan of strategy games either for that matter, outside of XCOM:EU one year, and Brad's obsession with Star Craft 2 and DOTA 2 over the years.

Chaz wrote:

I'm frequently on the outside looking in as the "game folks" gush about some game or other that I'll never really get to enjoy the same way.

That's why I always appreciate Rorie's list and his input when he can give it. He seems much more in-line with my own tastes, especially the single-player element.

bnpederson wrote:
Chaz wrote:

I'm frequently on the outside looking in as the "game folks" gush about some game or other that I'll never really get to enjoy the same way.

That's why I always appreciate Rorie's list and his input when he can give it. He seems much more in-line with my own tastes, especially the single-player element.

Rorie is the secret best part of the site. I wish he had a bigger role.

EDIT: I don't see how people thought Abby was the best this year - she was easily the worst, but we all have our opinions. Maybe I simply got annoyed from hearing her saying "it's very fun" or "it's very good" for five days straight. It grated on me, especially in contrast to others who were able to make different arguments, AND BECAUSE HORIZON WAS SHAFTED EVEN THOUGH DREAM DADDY GOT IN THE TOP 10 ARRRRRRRRGH.

You may be confused because she didn't reiterate herself ad nauseam.

Abby explains her point once.
Abby gets talked over.
Abby doesn't beat her point to death because she's already said what she wanted.
Someone else gets their way.
Fin.

Maybe we listened to different podcasts? Because she definitely repeated herself over and over, and while she sometimes did get talked over, so did others, yet I also saw the rest of the group quiet down quite a few times for her to talk.

Again, this is to not bash on Abby. I like her a lot - from the very first Beastcast she was on, in fact. I just really thought she stood out in a bad way (mainly in the Best Game category). At least it wasn't Brad that got me annoyed this year around? Next year, who knows! Maybe Jan will become popular and make a stonewall for a Tencent phone game to get in at #10!

EDIT: Words for clarity.

Vrikk wrote:

I just really thought she stood out in a bad way this year around.

Say whaaa?

Maybe this is skirting P&C, but Abby is one of the many examples of a woman/POC that is trying to voice an opinion that gets a bit mansplained and dismissed outright due to just being outnumbered by not only a majority of men but those that are assumed to be experts and thereby invalidating her voicing her opinions. No one backs her up and so she retreats to the "I thought this was fun for me" statement because she has no other leg that she is allowed to stand on.

Abby with a full GB crew is definitely a different feel than Abby with just the Beast crew. At least that's the feel I'm getting from listening to the GOTY casts.

I don't think it's a P&C thing, and I hope people don't make it into that. I do not care if she is male or female. I simply think her being new to the industry was showing a little too much.

I thought Patrick was a little grating the same way when he joined, and I warmed up to him a lot after about six months. The difference is this is the only time I've disliked what Abby has brought to the podcast. I liked her from the start otherwise.

I see how I'm in the minority over her though, so let's just move on to something else. I don't want to repeat anything more than I already have.

Vrikk wrote:

I see how I'm in the minority over her though, so let's just move on to something else. I don't want to repeat anything more than I already have.

I feel similar to you, so don't feel alone. There were a few egregious statements she said that deserves criticism to be called out for. However, I don't think the GB regulars did a very good job explaining their own positions either. The only people over these videos that made interesting cases were Alex and Ben. Abby, Vinny, and Brad had a their moments. Jeff and Dan didn't say much. Jason said almost nothing. Not sure why this would go a P&C direction as Abby's picks almost always made it into the top three if not winning outright. Vinny also had her back in multiple occasions and the two of them said enough to bring Jeff around.

The difference I see is that Abby's picks didn't get considered until one of the other guys relented and agreed with them. But someone like Brad or Dan could keep a game in consideration all on their own.

Abby may've been more 'annoying' and seemed like she had to repeat herself...but it's because that was the only way she was getting her voice to be heard. Literally she had to say the same spiel about Dream Daddy 5+ times because each time either Ben or Dan or someone would dismiss it pretty outright and it absolutely wouldn't have made the list until Vinny agreed and then reiterated everything she said. THEN suddenly it was actually up for consideration.

She absolutely got plenty of things on the various categories but I feel like she was fighting harder for those things than just about anyone else and didn't have to resort to the childish bullsh*t like Jeff, Brad, or Dan exhibited.

ALSO, Ben is just as new as she is, yet everything he said was considered almost instantly and without question. Interesting.

Also, if the whole GOTY leaves you drained...you should totally watch some of their game streams stuff like Hitmas and the Rock band stuff. I found all of that to be way more enjoyable. Hitmas in particular was a special brand of insanity. And Abby fans will really like her Rockband performances.

I don't disagree with you, w00t, but keep in mind Ben isn't strictly new insofar as he was a GB intern, so he has a preexisting relationship with (at least) Jeff, Vinny, Brad and Alex.

Yeah, Abby fought tooth and nail and had reasons to get Dream Daddy in there at all, and Dan declares Zelda is the greatest game he's ever played, joining the august ranks of Mario Sunshine and Mario Party 3, and it's #2. I was rooting for Abby the whole time, even at the cost of my #4 or 5 GOTY.

Speaking of how Dan sucks, I'm listening to the Beastcast bonus, and Austin Walker remains incredibly gifted at turning Dan's tedious bullsh*t, ignorance, and lack of imagination into something of value. If I'm ever in a skid, I can only hope Walker is at the wheel.

I haven't listened to the entire final GOTY discussions yet (still over two and a half hours[!!] to go somehow), but from what I heard so far one of Dan's main arguments against Dream Daddy was that only Abby was really passionate about it, and the others had mixed feelings on it, and so a game like Uncharted that everyone who played it liked it should go higher. That came off as kinda hypocritical to me, since he benefited from the "one person's passion for a game beats everyone liking a different game" argument to get Stardew Valley onto the top ten list last year. I remember Jeff even saying last year that he prefers games that someone has a passion for. Alex did the same with Thumper, and I sort of expected Alex to point this out. Maybe he does later.

Apparently they forgot the legendary Austin Invisible Inc defense.

The bottom three spots have always been where the singular passion games go. It’s realky something they just need to acknowledge and accept. Jeff knows it creates a more interesting and diverse list that represents Giant Bomb.

Watching someone play Bloodborne again and I have to say I'm still not over the Bloodborne debacle of 2015. The game looks so amazing and the gameplay is so tight. Alas, GB just likes different games than me.

From the Day 3 podcast...
IMAGE(https://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/9/90838/2986637-abbyisright.png)

I thought Abby & Ben made a fantastic debut this year.

Both were eloquent and descriptive in backing their faves. Neither were pushy, willingly relenting their picks when they sensed they weren't going to make the cut.

Holy crap their whole communication style is so refreshing compared to the petulant, "We're not leaving this table until Destiny 2 gets the nod." shenanigans from some GB vets.

Really enjoyed the podcasts this season.

I just got through Day 2, and I have feelings about the Best Soundtrack section.

Spoiler:

As a Nier person, I was super psyched to have almost everyone absolutely losing their sh*t over Nier. I was kind of sad that Abby seemed to dislike it so much, but I can kind of understand. Nier's score works on two levels: the emotional and the technical. The rest of the crew did a good job covering it from the technical level, and I think that's ultimately what got her to agree to giving it the win. They didn't touch at all on the emotional, which is where I think Abby bounced hardest. She didn't finish the game, and it seemed like she bounced pretty hard off it. If you bounce on the emotional side, I can see that score not working as well for you, but it was surprising to hear her dismiss it as "just generic manipulative JRPG music."

I like the Cuphead soundtrack a bunch, but it's not even in the same league as Nier. Possibly that has something to do with basically hearing every piece on repeat while I bash my head against whatever level it is. Hearing any song 30 times in a row is gonna make me not want to go listen to it again.

The "Best World" discussion is... something.

I had like four moments where I felt like I'd heard roughly three very specifically different interpretations of what Best World even meant, and then right about the moment where I'd get to that mental point Jeff would say "SO WHAT IS THIS CATEGORY EVEN?" again and I could go Oh, ok, I'm not crazy then, this category is just an ill-defined meaningless mish mashy mess. Got it.

It's the first time I've ever skipped a category.

I think it's a fine category, and think Jeff is a little OCD which caused him to derail. The category didn't need to specifically be best world building, or best exploration, or best open world. Take all three elements into account. "Which world did you enjoy being in the most?" is a much less open ended question than "what was the best game of the year?"

Man Nier didn't get the love it deserved.

Chaz wrote:

I just got through Day 2, and I have feelings about the Best Soundtrack section.

Spoiler:

As a Nier person, I was super psyched to have almost everyone absolutely losing their sh*t over Nier. I was kind of sad that Abby seemed to dislike it so much, but I can kind of understand. Nier's score works on two levels: the emotional and the technical. The rest of the crew did a good job covering it from the technical level, and I think that's ultimately what got her to agree to giving it the win. They didn't touch at all on the emotional, which is where I think Abby bounced hardest. She didn't finish the game, and it seemed like she bounced pretty hard off it. If you bounce on the emotional side, I can see that score not working as well for you, but it was surprising to hear her dismiss it as "just generic manipulative JRPG music."

I like the Cuphead soundtrack a bunch, but it's not even in the same league as Nier. Possibly that has something to do with basically hearing every piece on repeat while I bash my head against whatever level it is. Hearing any song 30 times in a row is gonna make me not want to go listen to it again.

Yeah I disagreed so hard with her on the whole it's just "manipulative JRPG music thing"

She didn't connect with Nier, and only played 8 hours of it. That's not insignificant, but means she didn't even get to the parts where it starts subverting the things it was setting up in that opening section.

It was frustrating listening to Dan push back on Dream Daddy when his argument was basically "I didn't like playing this game, and don't really like the genre, so I stopped early, and it didn't do anything different, so it shouldn't be as high as you're saying it should be." Then it was more frustrating when she made very similar arguments against Nier.

I totally get that Nier is a long game, rough mechanically, has some questionable costume design choices (which she rightly called out), and is a time commitment. It asks a lot of the player. I have a lot of conflicted feelings when someone who bounced off it and someone who finished it and connected strongly with it get into an argument about the relative worth of the game.

I'm through Day 4 and so far the only conversation I found to be just bad was the aforementioned first thirty minute chunk of Best World that made me jump ship and skip to the next category.

I was expecting Dan to be a problem for a specific game or two when the Best Game list came up based on the discussions so far. Seeing people say he's being stubbornly obstinate about Dream Daddy does not surprise me in the slightest after hearing his few bits about it during the best character and best story discussions.

Can't say I'm looking forward to that, but these things are always quite the ride.

I've never really figured how how I feel about debating a game that's in a genre or style you either actively dislike or just don't care about at all, when you're trying to do one of these group lists. Like, I don't like MP shooters, haven't played PUBG, and probably won't because I know it's not for me. Everyone else in the group has and liked it a lot. Do I push back against it because it's a very specific genre that not everyone will care about? Or do I acknowledge that there's strong reasons to keep it on the list, but mostly sit out of the debate because I'm not in a good position to judge?

Unfortunately, Dan usually decides "I don't care about this style of game, so it's bad and shouldn't be on the list", and makes that argument constantly. We're talking about a guy who skips cut scenes and "doesn't like emotions and crap when I'm playing games." There's probably a less Dan game than Dream Daddy, but I can't really think of one.

boogle wrote:

Abby for best bomber of the GOTY casts.

Ben and Jan are runners up.

Dan is worst for his "but its a dating sim" line of argument that was insulting once, and infuriating the 20th time.

I'm listening to this now. I get absolutely nothing out of dating sims. From a "is this game for me or not" standpoint I'm probably in the same camp as Dan. They aren't at all.

I'm still sitting here wishing he'd just shut the f*ck up. He just has nothing of value to add to the conversation. He's acting like it's his personal top 10 and everyone else's input should have less value than his does.