Horizon Zero Dawn Catch-All

Yeah, it all depends on playstyle. I've seen any number of recommendations to make get the Re-use Traps skill ASAP, but I only got it at the end and never really needed it. I never brought a trap/potion, and almost always had full pouches of all of them.

I'm not against the idea that some of the skill items in HZD are just to pad out the skill tree, but Disarm Traps is extremely powerful and involves a complication of an already complicated weapon set. It doesn't seem like a pad-out. Pad-out skills would be Scavenger and Scavenger+. Precision and Precision+ are the same way. Both pad-out skills.

I'd have liked more actual melee moves in the melee part of the Brave Skill Tree. Nothing amazing, just basic stuff. Like a combo. Three of the 4 melee skills are pad-out skills so I'd have liked to see a basic combo (three light attacks ends in a Critical Hit), an extended combo (Heavy Hits stun larger machines and can be chained faster with light hits), and a Charge Attack (a melee supermove that insta-criticals what it hits). Throwing a basic sidestep in there wouldn't be amiss, either.

Its all playstyle dependant, I barely use any traps whats so ever in my game, I constantly have to sell them off.

So. Everyone and their parents appears to be uploading and showing vids taking down Thunderjaws or Rockbreakers or Fireclaws. I've posted a couple myself, here; so for something different, a mounted hunt against Glinthawks and Snapmaws, and a mounted forest battle against a Daemonic Scorcher.

I decided to finish up the base game tonight! Ran out of canisters halfway through the last fight had to resort to good old arrow sniping. Now to take a week or two off before continuing with the expansion. Game will definitely be in my top 5.

Thunderjaws are enormous. I have yet to take one on. What level do you recommend I give it a go or are they not as dangerous as they look. I guess half the secret is getting rid of their various weapons first.

Higgledy wrote:

Thunderjaws are enormous. I have yet to take one on. What level do you recommend I give it a go or are they not as dangerous as they look. I guess half the secret is getting rid of their various weapons first.

Hm. I'd recommend equipment, skills from the tree, and player skills rather than level because those are more likely to be a problem.

If you really just want to take one down, set up 15 Blast Wire traps, lure it over, then hide, then do it again. If you have good enough mods, it should get destroyed on the first pass, but even mediocre equipment will destroy it on the second pass.

If you want to actually fight it (not hunt it), then Long Dodge and Triple Shot are both useful. Concentration not so much since you're not really likely to miss it. You could miss its critical areas, but it's so big that missing those still usually hits the machine somewhere else.

You want a way to tear off its weapons (Tearblaster, Ropecaster, or Tear-modded Sharpshot Bow), a way to Freeze it (Freeze-modded War Bow, Freeze-modded Sling), and a way to deliver a lot of damage in a small window of actually firing (triple shot Sharpshot damage modded, or Blast Sling).

You'll also want to examine its terrain and practice taking on other machines on like terrain using like tactics. A Ravager is a pretty close machine type so you can practice with that. You want to be able to predict what it will do based on its stance, then calmly take cover behind a rock, duck (the "crouch and hide" button) or dodge out of the way precisely. Frantically dodging every which way all the time could possibly work, but it could just as well serve you up for dinner while eating up time you could be using to attack.

You can observe it in battle by either Corrupting machines near one and watching it kill them or observing it massacre a bunch of Carja or Oseram soldiers on patrol. That way, you know what it looks like when it's about to fire, charge, or whip its tail. Or you can just suicide yourself against one to see how it looks firsthand.

I think I destroyed my first Thunderjaw at level 17 en route to Meridian. I used Blast Wire traps to open, ripped off its disc launchers, froze it, then el-torro'd it to my side of the mesa so I can get its weapons without it breathing down my neck. Repeat for 2nd disc launcher. After the 2nd one, it had barely anything left so I killed it with Precision Arrows to the head.

Thunderjaws are great fun to hunt and fight, so enjoy and

Good hunting!

https://twitter.com/twitter/statuses...

Their weapons do a tremendous amount of damage when turned against them, so that's always been my priority with a Thunderjaw. If you can freeze them and then hit them with their own weapons, that may be enough to take them down right there.

I'm finally getting around to H:ZD, and even went on an epic quest to acquire the complete edition Tuesday night. It was shockingly difficult to find. I'm not terribly far in, I just reached Mother's Heart for the Proving, but learning that there were other communities that regard the Embrace as small-minded backwater hicks got me really, really, really excited. It's been a long time since I played in a setting where I have no genuine clue what might be out there.

Dumb mechanics question: First skill I picked was the slow-down slide shot, because that looked f*cking rad as hell--is it just tough to exploit on what I'm fighting now, or need I practice?

Thanks LarryC. It's nice to have a beast that feels like the Everest of robot dinosaur hunting.

I thought that Rockbreaker (underground mole thing) was a bigger challenge then Thunder Jaw or even last boss.

I'll keep an eye/ear out for it.

This game just gets better and better.

Rockbreakers can go the f*ck to Hell. I've now got two Corrupted Zones remaining and am about to do the last Cauldron, but those Rockbreakers basically ate up all my medicine pouch even after I found a way to cheese the fight. Turns out the secret was to follow a path where a Glinthawk attack is scripted, which gets the Rockbreaker attention. Sneak as best as I can, get on top of the highest rock point, equip Arrowbreaker or whatever armor to minimize ranged attacks, and then hope they also get the attention of the bot-o-diles and let them hash it out. I was fortunate that only one Rockbreaker fought me at a time while the other was distracted with Shellwalkers across the river, vastly increasing my odds of survival.

I imagine LarryC has an expert strategy for dealing with Rockbreakers but I attempted traps, enemy overrides, and basically it amounted to "cheese strategy until you luck into survival".

Having to deal with two Behemoths and no sign of any useful tall-grass anywhere and oh yeah unpredictable Goat-Bots = I'll do that corrupted zone last.

I've gotten all the Tallnecks which means I've uncovered all the map, which means soon enough I'll be able to just burn through the story. I feel like the most interesting stuff is probably in all the optional collectibles, but I'm sitting here wondering if I want to burn through this game as fast as I can to move it off the pile or take a bit of a break before I get angry at it and analyze it unfairly. It's not the game's fault I hit a sudden difficulty curve, though it is the game's fault that protection modifiers are so God damn rare that I can't boost my armor sufficiently. I'm also guessing at this point the game is designed with over-riding in mind because I haven't really been doing it and have largely been fine without. It's only with the sudden boosted difficulty of the (admittedly optional) Corrupted Zones that I suddenly feel the need to do it, and have just gotten myself a bow capable of shooting corruption arrows.

What also irritates me is that I've been wondering when I can get myself a better Ropecaster, only to find in a quick glimpse at a guide that you don't really get a better one unless you do those Hunting Lodge trial things. Which, quite frankly, is bullsh*t. I don't want to do that stuff. It wasn't fun to do because of how particular it was at the first one. I imagine it's supposed to teach advanced tricks and maybe some of them would have helped me out here, but cripes, I'm just not interested and now feel punished for not trying to clear all the icons, so to speak.

Granted, I imagine the main quest is probably easier and doesn't require all the fancy stuff, but the reward for doing optional content should be for everything to become easier, not to suddenly make everything possible at all.

I just beat my first rock-breaker yesterday and boy howdy it was a challenge. I figured out early to keep it on the surface but then it was still always right on top me. There were a bunch of splodey barrels around but I was barely able to use them use. Used up all my health potions.

Also, I finally got the Shadow War Bow! Now do some more hunting.

Only suggestion I have for the Rockbreakers is that only half of the rules from Tremors work. They can hear you if you run, but as their name might suggest, you're not safe standing on top of rocks.

Freezing it will make it take more damage, and tearing its claws off will prevent it from going back underground, but they're basically huge damage sponges. For the one in the side quest where you save the child king and his mother, I crept around, tossed bombs to make it surface, then just peppered it with more frost bombs and regular ones until it went down, and rolled like crazy if I saw dust coming up around me.

The way I ended up taking it down, after dying many times, I ended up blasting it with bunch of shock bombs until it got stunned, then just beat the hell out if it with my spear. This was before I had a blast sling.
I think for next time I will try shock followed by blast sling combo.

Wait until you face a Daemonic Rockbreaker in the DLC...

Evan E wrote:

Wait until you face a Daemonic Rockbreaker in the DLC...

This game has thoroughly convinced me I don't need the DLC.

I was wondering if there was a Tremors element going on with the Rockbreakers. In the one Corrupted Zone, it's tough, but you can get to rocks where they cannot physically hit you, but they'll keep popping out of the ground and vomiting boulders your direction. None of my tearblast arrows ever seemed to hit or do anything to the claws, and it was only when they were vomiting rocks I could get good hits on the front two claws.

I honestly enjoy going up against every type of foe in the game. Sawtooths are a pain since they only have one weak spot and it's a pain in the ass to hit, but with my upgraded gear I can easily light 'em on fire, grab 'em with the ropecaster, and while they're struggling with it shoot 'em in the weak spot. I can have a solid strategy without having to be a master of the mechanics against just about anything.

But those Rockbreakers? Honestly, maybe if you only had to deal with one at a time, but two at once? Forget about it.

ccesarano wrote:
Evan E wrote:

Wait until you face a Daemonic Rockbreaker in the DLC...

This game has thoroughly convinced me I don't need the DLC.

I'm actually pretty terrible at the combat - I abuse the hell out of the stealth, override, and "come toward the whistling where all the other dead robots are" mechanic - but I'm playing it on Normal and still enjoying the hell out of it. Rockbreakers are impervious to most of my usual methods, so with them I wind up just dodging like hell and shooting at their feet until they can't submerge any more, then tearing off armor and pummeling them with a high-damage bow & hard point arrows while continuing to dodge like a spastic jackrabbit. I actually was surprised how easily I got through the Daemonic Rockbreaker, although that has something to do with expectations. I maybe died twice as I scouted out the environment, then had one protracted fight that ended in victory.

Even as someone who's terrible at combat, this is easily one of my favorite games of all time, both the game itself and the DLC.

Rockbreakers are blind. They find you through your footsteps. So the secret to fighting them is to attack from or run to a location to lure them there, then sneak away and wait for them to look where you lured them. So long as you're in sneak mode and do not attack, they can only guess where you are. Don't run. That's very bad.

They have Blaze sacs on either side near the back. If you can blow them both, they'll have just enough health left that you can destroy them with a few shots while they're frozen. If you really want to finesse it, the exhaust port on their tails boosts damage a lot so you can probably one-shot them if you freeze them and shoot them there after removing their Blaze sacs.

The normally hidden features from the front become plain if you take the time to observe them from the side. The Blaze sacs are obvious as hell from that angle. But the exhaust port also become easy to see and target on Focus from the side or for a split second while they're diving under.

You can also throw rocks or shoot arrows to where you want them to go. So long as they can't see you, they'll lunge at wherever you direct. So it's pretty trivial to set up a massive set of bombs and tripcaster wires and then tell the Rockbreaker to go there by shooting at the ground.

TLDR: Walk without rhythm.

ccesarano wrote:

What also irritates me is that I've been wondering when I can get myself a better Ropecaster, only to find in a quick glimpse at a guide that you don't really get a better one unless you do those Hunting Lodge trial things. Which, quite frankly, is bullsh*t. I don't want to do that stuff. It wasn't fun to do because of how particular it was at the first one. I imagine it's supposed to teach advanced tricks and maybe some of them would have helped me out here, but cripes, I'm just not interested and now feel punished for not trying to clear all the icons, so to speak.

Better is relative. The Lodge Ropecaster is more powerful than the Shadow one, but unlike the other weapons, I keep a Carja Ropecaster around because both Shadow and Lodge Ropecasters are expensive on Wire and they're totally overkill for most machines. If you're hunting Chargers or Sawtooths, you're just burning Wire if you're using a Shadow or Lodge Ropecaster. Your prerogative, but I imagine the Carja outlanders will look at the extravagance with envy.

The best thing you can do to improve your Ropecaster is to put really good Tear+Handling mods into it. The difference between the Lodge and the Shadow one is a marginal improvement in handling. It fires very slightly faster. It's not that big of a deal. A Lodge one with blue mods will not match a Shadow one with high quality purple mods. It's more of a status symbol or bragging trophy.

EDIT: Er, obviously having a bunch of "sighted" hostile machines attacking you while you're sneaking around Rockbreaker territory is an incredibly bad problem. So don't do that. Deal with the other machines first, preferably where the Rockbreakers can't see or attack you.

EDIT2: Not all the machines have parts that are sensitive to the same ammo. The Blaze Sacs of the Fire Bellowback and the Rockbreaker are sensitive to damage, not Fire Element. The Rockbreaker's claws are sensitive to Damage, not Tear.

EDIT3: How to Lose The Rockbreaker. Once it sees you, it will probably lunge at you a few times. Dodge as per usual. Don't run around, especially if there's another one around. NEVER run. You can get a few pots shots in while you're dodging the lunges if you're feeling fancy, but it's not essential. But it'll also back up and try to throw rocks at you. This attack mode is when you can go into sneak mode and disappear. You don't need tall grass. Once it's moving away (look for the dust trails), go into sneak mode immediately and start moving. Any direction. Keep moving until it doesn't know where you are.

Bonus_Eruptus wrote:

Only suggestion I have for the Rockbreakers is that only half of the rules from Tremors work. They can hear you if you run, but as their name might suggest, you're not safe standing on top of rocks.

Freezing it will make it take more damage, and tearing its claws off will prevent it from going back underground, but they're basically huge damage sponges. For the one in the side quest where you save the child king and his mother, I crept around, tossed bombs to make it surface, then just peppered it with more frost bombs and regular ones until it went down, and rolled like crazy if I saw dust coming up around me.

I cheesed that one pretty hardcore. There's a perch on the right side of the cliffs where the Rockbreaker can't go and there's a wall to block its ranged attacks. I shot arrows into the ground to make it come up and then bombed it to hell. I almost felt sorry for it.

LarryC wrote:

If you really want to finesse it, the exhaust port on their tails boosts damage a lot so you can probably one-shot them if you freeze them and shoot them there after removing their Blaze sacs.

Seems to be a pattern with this game.

IMAGE(https://i.imgur.com/IMG2WZW.gif)

It's full of Hollywood phonies?

Wow, Polygon doesn't seem to care about spoilers in this writeup.

https://www.polygon.com/2017/12/6/16...

Also, only #8? Boooooo...

Agathos wrote:

Wow, Polygon doesn't seem to care about spoilers in this writeup.

https://www.polygon.com/2017/12/6/16...

Also, only #8? Boooooo...

I'm not particularly surprised. I've seen the Let's Plays and the vids from reviewers. They don't really get to tinker very much with the combat. As far as I can tell, most of them try to get through the game just with Hardpoint or Precision Arrows at most. So everything feels like a bullet sponge to them.

It can feel a little less amazing if you insist on playing the game that way.

Uploaded two easy hunting techniques - one for Longlegs and one for Snapmaws. Many of you will already be using this method, but it might be useful for others or might serve as an inspiration for new ways to hunt these machines.

Thanks for posting those LarryC. Crazy to think that Snapmaws can go down that quick and easy! Need to try that one out this weekend.

Spoiler:

I still need a Snapmaw Heart for purchasing the Shadow Ropecaster

LarryC wrote:

I'm not particularly surprised. I've seen the Let's Plays and the vids from reviewers. They don't really get to tinker very much with the combat. As far as I can tell, most of them try to get through the game just with Hardpoint or Precision Arrows at most. So everything feels like a bullet sponge to them.

It can feel a little less amazing if you insist on playing the game that way.

Reading this and then watching your videos has me wondering if I'm somewhere in the middle. I don't feel like enemies are bullet sponges even if they take a while. In fact, I've recently come to love the flame grenades more as they tend to do a lot of damage over time.

Still, watching your videos, I'm sitting here kind of flabbergasted at how much damage you deal. I was previously unaware that freezing enemies increases damage done to them, but over 1,000 damage in a single strike? And it didn't look like you knocked multiple, either.

As for me, I have three missions left of the game. In terms of story and such, I'd say it's not as bad as I thought, but on the whole I just... I dunno. I don't love this game. I like it, but I do not love it, and I'm trying to figure out how much of that is my fault rather than the game's.

From the developers:
IMAGE(https://i.redd.it/50e5ap7ed3401.jpg)

ccesarano wrote:

Still, watching your videos, I'm sitting here kind of flabbergasted at how much damage you deal. I was previously unaware that freezing enemies increases damage done to them, but over 1,000 damage in a single strike? And it didn't look like you knocked multiple, either.

As for me, I have three missions left of the game. In terms of story and such, I'd say it's not as bad as I thought, but on the whole I just... I dunno. I don't love this game. I like it, but I do not love it, and I'm trying to figure out how much of that is my fault rather than the game's.

Hm.

I don't like suggesting that you're the reason you're not enjoying this game as much as I do. I liked all the Infamous games a lot so I naturally gravitate towards action-adventure games like this. We all have our own preferences, I think, and that's great. I love the variety in the GOTY thread!

I liked the narrative of this game a lot. The reveal and the way they relate the story is inventive and fun. It's also got a heaping serving that crunchy nuance that makes me happy as a scifi fan. HADES isn't evil in the human sense (but still needs to be stopped), the Derangement is partly a reaction to human activity, Sylens had understandable motives, and so on.

But I loved the combat in this game. That's what elevates it for me. It's just so crunchy. I did triple-knock a DLC weapon. That is why I dealt 1500 damage in one blow. But don't feel bad about the DLC thing. It LOOKS impressive, but you can kill it about as fast by triple-knocking a damage-maxed Sharpshot Bow and firing twice. Shooting out the Cold Sac under a Snapmaw and then killing it with Precision Arrows is my favored tactic on foot, but it's not the only one I've used to kill Snapmaws.

For instance, I also use a triple-knocked Flame-maxed Hunter Bow. It takes setting them on fire twice or shooting them a bit while they're on fire, but this way is better when there are Glinthawks around so you're not switching weapons so much, and it doesn't require as much precision, which can be a problem when you're on a moving mount.

I've also used a combination of Blast Wire and Flame Wire. And yes, flame grenades as well. I've even used a Shadow Rattler (it kind of works, I guess). It depends on the terrain and what other machines are in the area. I did not show in the above vids that I specifically selected an isolated machine site for Snapmaws and I cleared out a bunch of other machines for the Longlegs. That's to simplify the hunt.

So aside from just the machines having a bunch of ways to take them down, each machine's strengths and weaknesses form a different context based on the surrounding terrain and when they're encountered together. When I'm fighting a Longlegs guarding a Behemoth convoy, I'll have a Ropecaster, Freeze Arrows, and Blast Bombs, which works differently from a Shock-heavy complement. Because that's what I'll be using against the Behemoth. In a Shell-Walker convoy, Freeze Bombs go through Shell-Walker Shields and freeze multiple-targets so I'll likely one-shot the guardian Longlegs once it's frozen with a tripleshot Precision Arrow volley once it freezes up.

The on-the-fly adjustments add even more cerebral food. What if you're outfitted for Trampler hunting and in the middle of one when a Behemoth convoy hits you from behind? Well, that's interesting!

Of course, you can just summon up the menu and call up your entire arsenal, but where's the fun in that?

SpacePPoliceman asked us if the slide-move was any good. I've never used it that much, so I tried using it in a bunch of different hunting contexts. Not bad with a Tearblaster hunting Tramplers at very close range.

So. Yeah. I love the combat. So much crunch. Not everyone dives into it like this. I remember when I was the only guy saying Mass Effect 2's combat was easy even on Insanity (and kind of a cakewalk at Hardcore).