[Discussion] Violence by or at Police

Keep in mind that the city is run by democrats (of various strains, be they old-line union paternalists, avowed socialists, racial justice organizers, or newer school progressives). The state legislature is ruled by a coalition of those (paternalists on top), pitted against a "business friendly" (i.e., financial conservative, not "family values" or nationalist) Republican.

That said, a lot of these changes in the CPD and its suprastructure (change of training, change of strategy, increase in patrol officers, new accountability structures) are things that Mayor Emanuel pitched when he first ran for office in 2010. He then de-prioritized those promises and focused on income streams (especially fines and fees that are functionally regressive taxes) and budget concerns, while pushing tech and financial startups and courting HQ relocations.

Chicago, and especially the CPD-crime aspect of Chicago, has had a hard time under Rahm, and throwing CPD leadership under the bus certainly hasn't helped. There's real talk right now about a separately funded accountability board, and even a chance that it'll be elected positions.

Rahm's a dick, and doesn't really hide it. Sometimes he brags about it. But when he thinks something's important, it tends to get done. I'm hoping this recent stuff shows that he finally thinks this is important.

As in most civil cases—and take note that we're talking about lawsuits in most cases, except in those rare instances where the government goes after a cop for criminal action—the case ends with a settlement and usually no admission of guilt. That settlement is between the municipality and the victim's family, and is usually the best financial deal the muni is going to get.

The muni gets sued in part because the officer represents the muni, in part because they have more money to pay out, and in part because the police unions general mandate that the municipality indemnifies its officers (represents them in court and covers the costs).

I bet that indemnification agreement is null if the officer is found guilty of a crime, though.

Hijacking this for a second, because I've read in papers and seen TV headlines saying Chicago has "erupted" and other such explosive language in some recent protests. It matches the narrative of Chicago being a war zone, but it's really not true. Yes, we've had protests, and those protests have done things like blocking a highway during rush hour, but most of the city has kept on chugging like always—even in poor and black neighborhoods.

And I want to caution people against believing those narratives of war zones and "eruption" in cities. Chicago's a favorite target, and we've got some real problems here, but I live in a solidly southside neighborhood, and everyone still pretty much wakes up and goes to work and school in the morning, without looking especially jumpy or throwing any bricks through windows.

My question was more of a rhetorical one considering that we're consistently asking the same type of questions about policing in every city.

At a certain point we have to admit that it's insane that someone can get two or three months of training--large chunks of which are dedicated to shooting and how to use force--and then be given a job where they are literally given the state-sanctioned power to kill someone and otherwise f*ck their lives up.

I just know from living in Cincinnati, a city that had its police force monitored by the Department of Justice for most of the 2000s because they tended to shoot unarmed black people, that reforming the police is a long process that requires buy-in and backing from everyone: the politicians, the police, and, most importantly, the community. I think Cincinnati burned through two or three police chiefs before one was found that was amenable to bucking the rank and file members and committing to change.

And I think that the Chicago PD, like the PD of any large city, is going to deserve to be thrown under the bus to a certain degree. I mean they can't be that great of police force when they literally have a black site where they disappear suspects.

I hope Rahm can improve the CPD. But I also hope that Illinois (and every state) improves and expands the minimum training requirements for police officers to emphasize de-escalation and conflict resolution skills over shooting and thumping heads.

I know state legislatures can't pass a law that fixes hundreds of years of socialization.

But state legislatures can pass laws that change how police are trained (and for how long) and that will have an impact on the problem.

It certainly won't solve things overnight. But it will at least make sure that the officers making traffic stops have more training and skills to fall back on than simply shooting someone.

The city is now saying that the person shot is in critical condition, but not dead.

Also, it looks like the governor has declared a state of emergency.

I have no idea. I'm inclined to think the second announcement is more accurate, but either or both of them could be mistaken.

This is surreal. The large financial institution that I work for in Charlotte has just told all its employees to work from home due to the violent protests...

I mean, that's how this started in the first place, with police and the family having incompatible versions of what happened...

I don't think that it's been mentioned here yet, but one factor that is going to play into all of this is that this July, the state legislature passed a law making body cam videos not public records. The law takes effect this October 1st.

McRory's an ass. I really hold Cooper can give him the boot.

Do they not realize this opens a massive gap where the family can say what they believe happened, and being the sole witnesses to the video who are not vested in the police department, and massively shape the narrative of this?

True, but it creates a pretty massive opportunity to make the police look even more like it's got something to hide. They might not, with this situation, I don't know for certain, but it completely opens them to credibility attacks.

I mean, in the other direction, if they chose to keep the video from even the family, they might as well be admitting guilt because then it also looks like they're trying to hide the evidence.

Guess this really is just a lose-lose situation for the PD there.

I am quite comfortable in saying that, if there is video footage of a police shooting incident and they choose not to release it, I take that as an admission of guilt.

As the Dept of Homeland Security and the NSA say, if you haven't done anything wrong, you don't have anything to hide.

Well, racism didn't exist until Obama took office. I should know. I worked in real estate.

There is zero chance she will spend any time in jail. She might be fired but she will get another police job someplace else.

Full agreement, this conversation is happening way too much and we should fix the problems so that this institutional bias is gone.

...oh, you meant something different.

(Meanwhile, this guy is the guy who thought religious persecution was such a big deal that it needed state laws added to Indiana's books... so it only counts when it (doesn't actually) affect you for Pence.)

I expected it. I've noticed a trend where it's POC and women getting thrown under the Big Blue Bus.