Home Theater catch-all

4K Blu-ray players are finally here. I'm in the "physical media is dead" camp, but I actually do need a new Blu-ray/SACD transport device. Might as well future proof my system.

mr_n00b wrote:

4K Blu-ray players are finally here. I'm in the "physical media is dead" camp, but I actually do need a new Blu-ray/SACD transport device. Might as well future proof my system.

Wow, $399... it's like they think this is the 90s. I'll pass until it reaches a sensible price point.

I mean, if I recall when Blu-Ray (and HD-DVD!) first came out a decade ago, players were hovering right around $999. The PS3 was a bargain at launch ($599) solely for its Blu-Ray playback.

Until the bandwidth is there to serve completely uncompressed audio/video, I think there will always going to be a need for physical media. I've told my friends, as they have transitioned to Netflix and buying video digitally, I'll be at the store picking up the used and bargain Blu-Rays for a couple of bucks instead

Yeah, and not only the bandwidth part, but gaming already requires an internet connection for almost everything. My normal "internet is hosed on friday night and I cant play the game I want to" standby is watching a movie.

And since this is the US and broadband is mostly sh*t that happens a little too often. I'll keep my movies on disc.

What is the current health of home video sales? The gotcha headlines seem to indicate the sky is falling on physical sales, but anecdotally I know a lot of people who continue to supplement their streaming content with large amounts of Blu-ray purchases.

mr_n00b wrote:

What is the current health of home video sales? The gotcha headlines seem to indicate the sky is falling on physical sales, but anecdotally I know a lot of people who continue to supplement their streaming content with large amounts of Blu-ray purchases.

I wouldn't be surprised if sales are declining, but remaining strong amongst a dedicated audience.

Blu-ray isn't just better video, it's also significantly better sound. And it becomes more noticeable as you upgrade your sound system. So I doubt I'll ever give up on discs, but I'm not going to buy a UHD player until they drop to $99 (unless a console launches with UHD blu-ray support).

Just watched Mad Max on Blu-ray last night... I don't think my sub ever stopped moving. Great flick if you've got a decent sub and want to share your house.

Hey folks, figured this would be better than anywhere else.

Back in 2013, I picked up an Onkyo 5.1 HTIAB setup, and just started having some issues last night. All my devices are hooked up to the receiver with HDMI, the receiver has a single HDMI output running to the TV, and I'm only using a 2.1 speaker set up at the moment while we're still living in a world of boxes after recently moving.

Problem: 30 seconds after power cycling the receiver, audio drops out completely

I tried a couple of different apps on my Apple TV, and continued having the audio issue regardless of app.
I switched over to my Xbox ONE, and continued experiencing the same thing.
I re-enabled my TV's speakers, and could get sound via pass-through, but it would be intermittent and choppy.
I connected the Apple TV directly to my TV, using my TV speakers, and continued having intermittent and choppy sound.

So I'm kind of at a loss for where to go from here. Should I just shrug my shoulders and grab another HTIAB setup? Start down the path to a good receiver followed by a good set of speakers? Ditch everything and swap to a soundbar?

I started looking at replacement receivers, and everything that looks about right from a component upgrade standpoint would require a powered sub, which I don't have right now - meaning my 2.1 setup would be going down to a 2.0 setup until I get better speakers. So, of course, this has me thinking about soundbars instead.

Sounds like one of the various Onkyo HDMI block failures.

My dad's Onkyo HTIAB did the exact same thing. Kept getting picture, but no audio.

Hooking something up to the receiver without HDMI, through optical or RCA, and it would play sound fine.

Supposedly Onkyo has fixed this issue in their newer models, but I'm not sure I believe them. It seems like every time they say that, about two years into the lifespan of the new model lineup people start complaining of HDMI failures again.

As far as your path, you're saying the sub you have now is not self powered, but hooked up to the receiver with standard speaker cabling?

I'm not 100% sure what to tell you to do without knowing exactly how the current sub is wired.

To be clear you're having audio problems even when you connect directly to the tv? The receiver may be part of the issue, but it sounds like there's something else going on. First thing I'd try is swapping out cables and try the direct connection again. If that resolves the choppy audio problem, then you can add the receiver back into the connection chain and see if you're still having issues.

Thin_J wrote:

As far as your path, you're saying the sub you have now is not self powered, but hooked up to the receiver with standard speaker cabling?

I'm not 100% sure what to tell you to do without knowing exactly how the current sub is wired.

I'll have to double check, but I was fairly certain the sub that came in the HTIAB setup was not powered.

Chairman_Mao wrote:

To be clear you're having audio problems even when you connect directly to the tv? The receiver may be part of the issue, but it sounds like there's something else going on. First thing I'd try is swapping out cables and try the direct connection again. If that resolves the choppy audio problem, then you can add the receiver back into the connection chain and see if you're still having issues.

Yeah - this is the part that was troubling me too. I'll grab some of my other HDMI cables and start testing some stuff out over the weekend. At least when connected to the TV, it was "choppy", while the receiver was completely silent.

Sounds like I've got a weekend of troubleshooting ahead of me.

Chairman_Mao wrote:

To be clear you're having audio problems even when you connect directly to the tv? The receiver may be part of the issue, but it sounds like there's something else going on. First thing I'd try is swapping out cables and try the direct connection again. If that resolves the choppy audio problem, then you can add the receiver back into the connection chain and see if you're still having issues.

Reading your reply made me go back, and I glossed over:

I connected the Apple TV directly to my TV, using my TV speakers, and continued having intermittent and choppy sound.

this part when I initially read the post. This definitely implies you have something else going on that almost definitely doesn't have anything to do with the receiver.

If you were using the cable already plugged into the TV to test when you hooked the Apple TV directly up to it, then definitely try Mao's suggestion and swap that cable out and see if that clears it up.

You will know if the sub is not powered if it has no line level inputs and/or no power switch. But even if it's not powered, you should still be able to use it with any amp as it should have speaker level inputs and outputs, allowing you to connect speaker wire from the amp to the sub inputs and then from the sub outputs to the speakers.

So after further testing and tweaking, I think I've got two separate issues.

One being the Onkyo HDMI audio failure, and the second being something with the audio processor on my TV for it's speakers. When audio hits a certain dB (anything over "normal" talking), it chops out.

As for my existing sub, it's unpowered.

I think, at this point, I'm just going to "upgrade" to a decent 5.1 soundbar and a (remote controllable) HDMI switcher. Any thoughts on either of these? Wirecutter recommended the soundbar as their current "best budget soundbar", and I'm not really in a place to drop $700+ on something right now. I already checked the Harmony database and that switcher is supported, and with a remote IR reciever, I can hide it out of the way completely.

I'll leave a formal theater buildout until we're in our own house and I can run wires without upsetting anyone, including my wife. And, thankfully, it's not an issue with any single device, so I can keep playing Xbox with a headset in the interim.

It seems really weird that you'd develop both issues at the same time like that. What all did you try when you went troubleshooting?

McIrish wrote:

So after further testing and tweaking, I think I've got two separate issues.

One being the Onkyo HDMI audio failure, and the second being something with the audio processor on my TV for it's speakers. When audio hits a certain dB (anything over "normal" talking), it chops out.

As for my existing sub, it's unpowered.

I think, at this point, I'm just going to "upgrade" to a decent 5.1 soundbar and a (remote controllable) HDMI switcher. Any thoughts on either of these? Wirecutter recommended the soundbar as their current "best budget soundbar", and I'm not really in a place to drop $700+ on something right now. I already checked the Harmony database and that switcher is supported, and with a remote IR reciever, I can hide it out of the way completely.

I'll leave a formal theater buildout until we're in our own house and I can run wires without upsetting anyone, including my wife. And, thankfully, it's not an issue with any single device, so I can keep playing Xbox with a headset in the interim.

The sound bar should have multiple inputs, so no need for the HDMI switcher. Note that the rear speakers are not wireless and have to connect to the subwoofer, which probably means locating the sub somewhere behind your seating position. Otherwise it's probably fine to carry you over until you buy a place.

I've been thinking about one of those Vizio units. My wife hated when I had surround wire all over our old apartment and at our house has never let me fully set up the old system.

But I think tucking a sub behind the couch, with the rears on either side would show a lot less clutter.

Anybody else have those and like it? Reviews at Amazon, Target, Best Buy all seem pretty good.

Thin_J wrote:

It seems really weird that you'd develop both issues at the same time like that. What all did you try when you went troubleshooting?

Well, we just moved a few months ago, and have been using the AV receiver exclusively since we got it 4 years ago. Honestly, if the TV's audio had crapped out years ago, we would never have noticed.

For troubleshooting the TV, I tried our Apple TV and Xbox ONE connected directly to the TV, using three different HDMI cables. Both devices with all three cables had the same audio chopping issue, when plugged into either HDMI port.

For troubleshooting the receiver, same deal - multiple devices with multiple HDMI cables, and I could only get audio to come through its speakers for about 30 seconds after power cycling the unit. Audio coming out of the TV speakers continued to have the audio chopping issue.

This specific soundbar only has 1 HDMI in, 1 HDMI out, and 1 TOSLINK in. From what I've been seeing on soundbars, this seems normal - use the TV as your source switcher, and then HDMI out/TOSLINK out from the TV to push audio to the soundbar. Hence the need for a switcher to hook up my current set of 4 devices. I'm just seeing this as a $400 solution, and upgrade from my current state, versus throwing $1k+ into it right now.

Stele wrote:

I've been thinking about one of those Vizio units. My wife hated when I had surround wire all over our old apartment and at our house has never let me fully set up the old system.

But I think tucking a sub behind the couch, with the rears on either side would show a lot less clutter.

Anybody else have those and like it? Reviews at Amazon, Target, Best Buy all seem pretty good.

Honestly, the big selling point on this for me is that the sub talks to the soundbar over bluetooth, and drives the rear speakers. In our new place, we have a row of bookcases behind the couch, and would be the perfect place to "hide" the remote sub and rear speakers with that soundbar.

Ah, guess I thought my dad's sound bar was the norm with multiple HDMI inputs. Sounds like you're all set!

To to wire rear/surround speakers cleanly, we ran 12 gauge in wall-rated speaker wire from a wall plate behind our receiver down through the crawl space, and up the opposite wall above our kitchen cupboards. It's not ideal as the surrounds ended up pretty far away, but it works well enough and keeps the wires completely out of sight.

I'd love to run wires through walls/ceiling/flooring, but we're in a relatively new-construction apartment building. Wireless will have to suffice for now.

When I was last looking at them (maybe 10 years ago?) the Onkyo HTIBs were one of the best choices, because they used all standardized components, and fairly good ones, at least for the speakers. If they held to that principle, it's quite possible you might be able to just replace the receiver, likely with almost any standalone unit you can buy.

Denon has been one of my favorite brands for many years. Their sound quality is excellent, and what won me away from the Onkyo receivers was that they run so much cooler. Later on, that also turned into 'runs more reliably' as well, probably for the exact same reason (heat kills electronics), but cooler/cheaper to run was what sold me.

You may, in other words, be able to buy a reasonable Denon receiver, and be all fixed. Don't forget the used market; receivers depreciate fairly quickly, but stay useful for many years.

Malor do you have any recommendations for stores or marketplaces where I can find a used receiver online?

I started researching what I need to upgrade to 4K+HDR and quickly discovered that my old budget Sony receiver would need to be replaced (along with my old 1080p Vizio, obviously).

T-Prime wrote:

Malor do you have any recommendations for stores or marketplaces where I can find a used receiver online?

I started researching what I need to upgrade to 4K+HDR and quickly discovered that my old budget Sony receiver would need to be replaced (along with my old 1080p Vizio, obviously).

fwiw i got mine from Amazon used in 2013, no problems with it.

When my second Denon receiver died 2 months out of warranty (first one lasted a bit over a year out of warranty -- I suspect that the humidity here in Hawaii isn't great for electronics), I decided that I'd back away from worrying about brands and just get something from Costco, where I can return it forever (not all items, but AV Receivers still have lifetime returns).

I was waiting on a Pioneer to show back up in stock, but eventually just went with a Sony and I've been surprised at how happy I am with it. I expected to notice differences in sound quality between Sony and a highly regarded brand like Denon, but I can't. Realistically, that probably just means I'm not one of those people who can hear the differences, but that's fine with me.

billt721 wrote:

Realistically, that probably just means I'm not one of those people who can hear the differences, but that's fine with me.

Yeah this is only a win. It means you buy the features you need/want at the lowest possible price you can find and you're good to go.

So I'm in the market for a new HT receiver and am hoping you more-knowledgable-than-me folks can give me some ideas on what to check out. My current receiver is a Marantz SR-7200. It's getting a bit long in the tooth, aside from not having any HDMI capability it's doing some weird stuff with the center channel and I've pretty much been using it in 2-channel mode for a while now.

I'm hoping to find something in the $500-$600 range. Something that I need to consider is a phono preamp. I am okay with either built into the receiver or picking up an external unit, but I'd like to keep them combined in that price range I mentioned. I'm okay picking up a previous year model to get more bang for my buck.

I would like 4K passthrough since I bought a Visio last year that can do that resolution. Other than that I just have a PS3, an XBox 360, and a FireTV connected to it (Plans to pick up a PS4 eventually, though I haven't been playing games much lately so it's not high on the priority list yet.)

So with all that, whatcha got?

Edit: Something else I'm trying to work out, I currently have a Mohu Leaf antenna receiving OTA television, run into a TiVo unit. Planning to get rid of the Tivo, but I don't know how to handle the coax from the antenna without it. Do newer receiver have a coax in that can handle this? My recollection of televisions (this is years old at this point) is that they don't output 5.1 sound, only stereo, so running the antenna straight into the television with HDMI coming out to the receiver isn't a great idea. Is this still the case? Do modern HT receivers have coax input for OTA antennas?

fleabagmatt wrote:

So I'm in the market for a new HT receiver and am hoping you more-knowledgable-than-me folks can give me some ideas on what to check out. My current receiver is a Marantz SR-7200. It's getting a bit long in the tooth, aside from not having any HDMI capability it's doing some weird stuff with the center channel and I've pretty much been using it in 2-channel mode for a while now.

I'm hoping to find something in the $500-$600 range. Something that I need to consider is a phono preamp. I am okay with either built into the receiver or picking up an external unit, but I'd like to keep them combined in that price range I mentioned. I'm okay picking up a previous year model to get more bang for my buck.

I would like 4K passthrough since I bought a Visio last year that can do that resolution. Other than that I just have a PS3, an XBox 360, and a FireTV connected to it (Plans to pick up a PS4 eventually, though I haven't been playing games much lately so it's not high on the priority list yet.)

So with all that, whatcha got?

Edit: Something else I'm trying to work out, I currently have a Mohu Leaf antenna receiving OTA television, run into a TiVo unit. Planning to get rid of the Tivo, but I don't know how to handle the coax from the antenna without it. Do newer receiver have a coax in that can handle this? My recollection of televisions (this is years old at this point) is that they don't output 5.1 sound, only stereo, so running the antenna straight into the television with HDMI coming out to the receiver isn't a great idea. Is this still the case? Do modern HT receivers have coax input for OTA antennas?

Which Vizio do you have? I'm pretty sure most of not all can pass through 5.1 Dolby or DTS. I doubt any receiver would have an OTA coax connection because it would also need to have a tuner built in.

I believe it's this model: M75-C1

Bought it at Costco last winter, but I don't see it listed there now, so I'm just assuming. Price is about what I paid for it.

If I can just plug the antenna into the TV and then run a digital audio cable from the TV to the HT receiver and get 5.1 sound, that is perfect.

fleabagmatt wrote:

If I can just plug the antenna into the TV and then run a digital audio cable from the TV to the HT receiver and get 5.1 sound, that is perfect.

Most of them do it without another cable, just ARC (audio return channel) over the HDMI connection.

From the Rtings review of your TV:

ARC : Yes (HDMI 1)

So as long as you run the receiver's HDMI output to HDMI 1 on the TV, and the receiver supports ARC, you'll get 5.1 from any source the TV's getting that supports it.

Thin_J wrote:
fleabagmatt wrote:

If I can just plug the antenna into the TV and then run a digital audio cable from the TV to the HT receiver and get 5.1 sound, that is perfect.

Most of them do it without another cable, just ARC (audio return channel) over the HDMI connection.

From the Rtings review of your TV:

ARC : Yes (HDMI 1)

So as long as you run the receiver's HDMI output to HDMI 1 on the TV, and the receiver supports ARC, you'll get 5.1 from any source the TV's getting that supports it.

Yep. I would add, though, you might want to give Vizio's tech support a call to confirm. I've heard stories that while it can pass 5.1 from an optical in over ARC, that some TVs might not do it from a coax in. I doubt this would be the case, but doesn't hurt to check.