Depression is ruining my life.

Try checking clocks for the time everytime you think you're in trouble - whether in a dream or out of it. First step only. Worked for me, don't know how well it'll work for others.

MechaSlinky wrote:

I got what she was trying to say about "should", but being someone who loves words I refuse to believe there are any words that absolutely must never be used. It's not the word, it's the intention. It didn't help that the intention behind the "should" that launched the lecture was purely positive and optimistic. I don't remember exactly what I said. Something like, "This weekend I should jump back into that project I never finished."

Basically, you bristled at the fact she claimed you shouldn't ever say should.

Telling a person not to use "should" is completely different than teaching them ways to do it effectively. Your language (lecture) indicated she was doing #1 on this list.

I'm so glad to hear that a number of folks are feeling better!

I'm doing pretty good, too. The new medication seems to be pretty well-suited, though I do have some general fatigue here and there. Much better than what I was on before. I think I finally hit the spot my therapist has been trying to get me to for years - where I could just be me, and live my life as it is, without being anxious about the past or the future. She was delighted to hear it. It does mean that I've changed (or maybe I've just finally caught up to who I am, as opposed to whom I tried or wanted to be), and it has been noticed.

Thanks for the encouragement and support from this community. Everyone's awesome here!

For nightmares you could try listening to something in the background like a audiobook that can take your mind to some other place. Also telling yourself it is only a dream just before going to sleep might be enough to take control of the dream.

Baron Of Hell wrote:

For nightmares you could try listening to something in the background like a audiobook that can take your mind to some other place. Also telling yourself it is only a dream just before going to sleep might be enough to take control of the dream.

That's what checking the time is for. Dreams work in weird ways. Your mind tries to tell you it's real as best it can, but it's happening inside your own head. One of the ways in which you can pierce the veil is to try to ask yourself questions about your supposed reality you can't possibly know the answer to. Time is one of those things. The human mind doesn't have a reliable chronological function, so time goes wonky in dreams. Clockfaces are indistinct, or switch to wildly different times within impossibly short or long periods.

The Internet is another thing. You will not be able to look up stuff on the Internet inside your dream that you don't already know. Pages appear blank, or you look up confident that you read something and now know the answer, but when you try to review it with precision, you find that you didn't actually read anything.

Taking control of a nightmare is a secondary goal. It's not always good to preempt one. The nightmare is you trying to resolve something within yourself. Knowing it's a dream can take the bite off, but it's sometimes useful to let it run its course anyway, to gain insight or to intervene when it might be most effective, rather than to bury the entire thing unresolved.

Of course, sometimes it's also good to just change the channel and pretend you're The Flash for a few hours.

Those would be great, except when I have this particular dream, I'm back in the middle of the fire. No control, no input, just watching it happen all over again.

trichy wrote:

Those would be great, except when I have this particular dream, I'm back in the middle of the fire. No control, no input, just watching it happen all over again.

You can't control a dream when you don't know you're dreaming. Even when you do know, it can be... tricky. If you can't learn lucid dreaming directly within the nightmare, you could learn it apart from the nightmare, and then use skills you're learned once you're in it. This is a more challenging solution, so a simpler one might be better, if you have options.

Once again, I have not had, to my knowledge, PTSD. The problem may be entirely beyond solution from simply having the insight that you're dreaming. I'm just spitballing something that worked for my own nightmares.

This is my brain, most of the time:

IMAGE(http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/3-08-2014/HPhkjB.gif)

Birthday brain weasels. /stabs

I got my annual review and the only mark against me was my negativity and was told to be more positive. Thanks jackass, why not tell the fat people to be less fat. Seems about as usefull.

I have made an effort to get back into mindful meditation and I have to say it's proper weasel sedative.

I've been using the headspace introductory course but will definitely be subscribing for the full thing, especially as I can claim the cost against health coverage.

Surprising wisdom from Miley Cyrus:
IMAGE(https://31.media.tumblr.com/e4efedbb6600bea2855ec065c3b741e3/tumblr_n15az5IK9t1so2evoo1_500.gif)

I'll go on record as saying I think she's underestimated.

It's a shame she's also incredibly tacky.

muraii wrote:

I'll go on record as saying I think she's underestimated.

She's an actress; the problem is that nowadays, work/life balance is frakked up. We don't know when celebrities are working.

But yeah, I agree with her 100%. That's why I get so pissed when you hear about people getting in trouble for disability fraud. The stories usually include someone who was diagnosed with depression who was found smiling in a photo. See? That person's only pretending to be depressed! (Because it couldn't be possible that she was pretending to be normal for the camera.)

sometimesdee wrote:
muraii wrote:

I'll go on record as saying I think she's underestimated.

She's an actress; the problem is that nowadays, work/life balance is frakked up. We don't know when celebrities are working.

But yeah, I agree with her 100%. That's why I get so pissed when you hear about people getting in trouble for disability fraud. The stories usually include someone who was diagnosed with depression who was found smiling in a photo. See? That person's only pretending to be depressed! (Because it couldn't be possible that she was pretending to be normal for the camera.)

Or happened to have a good day.

Maq wrote:

I have made an effort to get back into mindful meditation and I have to say it's proper weasel sedative.

I've been using the headspace introductory course but will definitely be subscribing for the full thing, especially as I can claim the cost against health coverage.

There are also many good books on meditation. I really like Radical Acceptance. But more than just about anything I've done except spinning wool, I've found that mindfulness really depends on practice over time to see benefits. It lets me detach more easily when the unproductive thoughts and processes hook me.

When I had to take a leave of absence because of my depression my boss literally said to me: "You never seem sad, I've seen you smiling". Clueless much?

Atras wrote:

When I had to take a leave of absence because of my depression my boss literally said to me: "You never seem sad, I've seen you smiling". Clueless much?

Part of that is the idealized media image of what "depression" is, and part of that is that some of us are really good at hiding it.

Atras wrote:

When I had to take a leave of absence because of my depression my boss literally said to me: "You never seem sad, I've seen you smiling". Clueless much?

Okay, so I have someone considering a leave of absence due to depression who is coming to talk with me later this week. What could your boss have said to make it easier for you? Aside from plainly giving the information she needs about the leave/HR process and working out options with her, do you have any advice for ways I can make this a more positive conversation for her?

DiscoDriveby wrote:
Atras wrote:

When I had to take a leave of absence because of my depression my boss literally said to me: "You never seem sad, I've seen you smiling". Clueless much?

Okay, so I have someone considering a leave of absence due to depression who is coming to talk with me later this week. What could your boss have said to make it easier for you? Aside from plainly giving the information she needs about the leave/HR process and working out options with her, do you have any advice for ways I can make this a more positive conversation for her?

If you're willing to welcome her back when she's ready, let her know that. Don't press for details that aren't necessary for the actual process of her going on leave. Wish her a speedy recovery. Basically, treat it as if she were going on leave for a physical illness.

sometimesdee wrote:
DiscoDriveby wrote:

Okay, so I have someone considering a leave of absence due to depression who is coming to talk with me later this week. What could your boss have said to make it easier for you? Aside from plainly giving the information she needs about the leave/HR process and working out options with her, do you have any advice for ways I can make this a more positive conversation for her?

. Basically, treat it as if she were going on leave for a physical illness.

Because she is.

With me, I was completely unable to concentrate, which for a software developer is sort of impossible to work around. This led to my work suffering, but I was so mired in a swirl of self-loathing and bitter apathy that I didn't see it until my boss got involved. As my supervisor, some notice before "you are in trouble" would have been nice, especially given my track record of being pretty damn good at what I do. Instead I get told that I should have just cheered up and sucked it up; be a man. When I had a doctor providing me the cover I needed to recover, an acceptance that this is a real problem and not just a guy pouting would have gone a long way. Brushing it off is never going to be helpful. Dee said it best. I was rushed back to work thanks to financial needs and insurance company shortages (doctor and therapist both wrote letters decrying the decision), but the damage was done. My boss had lost any respect for me, and me for him. It was not long before I left that job, and I have been much better since then.

Atras wrote:
sometimesdee wrote:
DiscoDriveby wrote:

Okay, so I have someone considering a leave of absence due to depression who is coming to talk with me later this week. What could your boss have said to make it easier for you? Aside from plainly giving the information she needs about the leave/HR process and working out options with her, do you have any advice for ways I can make this a more positive conversation for her?

. Basically, treat it as if she were going on leave for a physical illness.

Because she is.

With me, I was completely unable to concentrate, which for a software developer is sort of impossible to work around. This led to my work suffering, but I was so mired in a swirl of self-loathing and bitter apathy that I didn't see it until my boss got involved. As my supervisor, some notice before "you are in trouble" would have been nice, especially given my track record of being pretty damn good at what I do. Instead I get told that I should have just cheered up and sucked it up; be a man. When I had a doctor providing me the cover I needed to recover, an acceptance that this is a real problem and not just a guy pouting would have gone a long way. Brushing it off is never going to be helpful. Dee said it best. I was rushed back to work thanks to financial needs and insurance company shortages (doctor and therapist both wrote letters decrying the decision), but the damage was done. My boss had lost any respect for me, and me for him. It was not long before I left that job, and I have been much better since then.

Thanks! That's helpful. In this case it is one of my grad students (they're funded and they work as teachers in our department, so it is essentially a work leave). Luckily there is a lot of support in our department and recognition of this as a serious issue, so she'll have no problem there. I was just thinking that at work I tend to deal with these things so matter-of-factly and I was worried that doing more than communicating her options and the facts might make her uncomfortable. Considering your comments I'll at least say something encouraging about the support available.

The word "depression" is so underdetermining as a lingual model of behavior. An imprecise term. I don't see that changing, but people conflate "clinical" depression (I use quotes because it needn't be clinically diagnosed to be a real phenomenon) with "Something went wrong today and I'm not happy about for a little while."

There's also the sense that it's a binary experience. Either I have depression or I don't. Except it's not that clear, and this thread is evidence. Do I have depression, and is it a matter of an intrinsic chemical imbalance or is there some stress throwing off the physiological processing of emotional stimuli? Or both? Or something else? I am not well schooled nor do I know anything about the DSM IV or V, so please excuse if I've ignorantly mischaracterized the issue, but I think those are the rough domains for inquiry. We use a shorthand for triage, e.g., "Have you been feeling down for more than two weeks?", to try to separate the ephemeral from the longer-term, and that's what I see and infer from a lot of the help in this thread.

The greater misfortune is that this is but one example of imprecise language and rough estimation begetting unintended ignorance. To the extent the popular culture relies on media representations of phenomena, it relies on those media's reliance on exaggeration to make a point. Actresses tend to be very thin to account for scale distortion in movies and TV. Comic artists draw bulky strong persons or lithe stealthers. Caricature is a prominent tool for visual storytelling, and has been for longer than any of us has been alive, and it's no different in representations of depression.

This is meandering and not quite novel, so thanks for humoring my wandering point. I think it's getting better, though, right? I mean, a generation or two ago I imagine depression being absent from the list of accepted reasons for a leave of absence. But maybe I'm just ill-informed.

DiscoDriveby ... bless you ! They are lucky to have you as a boss !

DiscoDriveby wrote:

Okay, so I have someone considering a leave of absence due to depression who is coming to talk with me later this week. What could your boss have said to make it easier for you? Aside from plainly giving the information she needs about the leave/HR process and working out options with her, do you have any advice for ways I can make this a more positive conversation for her?

I would also be clear about how far the reason for her absence will be kept confidential, who has to be informed and who won't etc.

Atras wrote:
sometimesdee wrote:
DiscoDriveby wrote:

Okay, so I have someone considering a leave of absence due to depression who is coming to talk with me later this week. What could your boss have said to make it easier for you? Aside from plainly giving the information she needs about the leave/HR process and working out options with her, do you have any advice for ways I can make this a more positive conversation for her?

. Basically, treat it as if she were going on leave for a physical illness.

Because she is.

Yeah, I need to be more careful with that. It's too easy to fall into the trap of considering mental health to be a separate thing, since that concept is so very much institutionalized (health insurance, anyone?)

DiscoDriveby wrote:

Luckily there is a lot of support in our department and recognition of this as a serious issue

I wish this was the norm, seriously, and...

pinkdino99 wrote:

DiscoDriveby ... bless you ! They are lucky to have you as a boss !

+1 to this. On behalf of every 'sick day' I had to lie about the reason for having, I am so in awe of this. My last period of extended leave I had with my last employer had to be 'masked' as a respiratory infection. Thankfully my Doctor was on board with the deception/situation within that workplace and gave me his full support.

It could use more recognition, for sure. Back in the day, I disappeared from my Pediatrics rotation for two weeks, which is a complete no-no given that interns had neither vacation nor sick leaves by tradition. My resident monitor said nothing negative. My group mates said nothing but positive stuff. They were all very supportive. "Take as much time as you need," was all anyone ever said. In retrospect, they were all MDs, and probably had the DSM criteria on hand.

This is a real thing. A strong show of support helps a lot, IMO.

For the few jobs I've had my policy has been to tell my line manager straight away, tell them how an episode will affect my work (lack of concentration, terrible memory, inability to cope with stress) and what I suggest we do to work around it (regularly check in on priorities to make sure stuff isn't getting missed).

It works well for me in as much as I'm not making it my employer's responsibility to figure out how to handle it, and it means they also know that I know what I'm doing when it comes to managing it. I give them the parameters of what to expect so they can know how to work around it like with any other illness. My boss knows when I'm having an episode that I'm working about 50% capacity and can't context-switch well so we work with it.

For someone coming back after being off with depression they'll need to know they're not in any trouble because of it - because they'll assume they are. They need to know that you're aware that they'll be easing back into things and you're expecting them to take it slowly - because they'll set themselves up to fail quite easily. They'll probably need short-term achievable goals and positive feedback - because their weasels will be telling them they can't do this and they need to be armed with proof to get their confidence back.

Mermaidpirate wrote:
DiscoDriveby wrote:

Okay, so I have someone considering a leave of absence due to depression who is coming to talk with me later this week. What could your boss have said to make it easier for you? Aside from plainly giving the information she needs about the leave/HR process and working out options with her, do you have any advice for ways I can make this a more positive conversation for her?

I would also be clear about how far the reason for her absence will be kept confidential, who has to be informed and who won't etc.

Also this. You should also ask her, however, if she's comfortable with anyone knowing. I've found it invaluable not to hide my condition from my colleagues. I laugh about it as often as possible so they know it's okay to laugh too.

Example: We were discussing some good company social activities and I mentioned we should try Artemis Bridge Simulator. Everyone looked it up and thought it was a great idea. One colleague said "See? We should make you the morale officer". To which I replied "Yes. Great idea. Make the Clinical Depressive the morale officer. I thought you had a masters degree".