Windows 8

Can anyone explain the new Reading List app to me? I tried it the other day on a Surface, thinking it would save pages/articles for offline viewing (specifically and ironically, the Ars Technica OSX review). Instead it just opened the page into Metro IE, and since the subway isn't known for its wifi service, it doesn't load any cache and gave me a connection error.

I tried to install my win 8 x64 dvd an it stalled for a long time and then flashed windows has encountered and error and must restart. I hope it isn't a problem with my win 8 dvd.

Anyways, I figured it would be better to grab a new hdd and install it fresh on that rather than risk ruining my current xp install. So I am waiting for the new 2gb drive to come from amazon today or tomorrow.

Anyone else experience problems like this?

fangblackbone wrote:

I tried to install my win 8 x64 dvd an it stalled for a long time and then flashed windows has encountered and error and must restart. I hope it isn't a problem with my win 8 dvd.

Anyways, I figured it would be better to grab a new hdd and install it fresh on that rather than risk ruining my current xp install. So I am waiting for the new 2gb drive to come from amazon today or tomorrow.

Anyone else experience problems like this?

A 2GB drive is going cause a whole host of other problems

If the DVD has an issue you can always download Windows 8 and try installing it that way.

I just put my WMC code into Win 8.1 Pro, now I have an overlay on the bottom right of my desktop saying "Windows 8.1 Pro with Media Center Build 9600". Didn't happen on the laptop, but I put the WMC code in during Win 8 times before the 8.1 update.

Weird. Guess I get to search out a solution for that one.

Chairman_Mao wrote:
fangblackbone wrote:

I tried to install my win 8 x64 dvd an it stalled for a long time and then flashed windows has encountered and error and must restart. I hope it isn't a problem with my win 8 dvd.

Anyways, I figured it would be better to grab a new hdd and install it fresh on that rather than risk ruining my current xp install. So I am waiting for the new 2gb drive to come from amazon today or tomorrow.

Anyone else experience problems like this?

A 2GB drive is going cause a whole host of other problems

If the DVD has an issue you can always download Windows 8 and try installing it that way.

I actually installed straight to a Win 8.1 Image that I got by following a trick from Thurrott's site. See the comments for how to change the image to get it to clean install, otherwise, it will require an 8.1 key to get the install to work, as the 8.0 keys fail. Once you do the file trick, it doesn't ask for the key until post install, then accepts the 8.0 key.

Probably too late but I saw this article and remember some posts about it.

Updating to 8.1 without a MS account.

http://venturebeat.com/2014/01/20/ouch-hp-is-now-promoting-pcs-running-windows-7-because-windows-8-isnt-doing-so-hot/

I keep meaning to either post or fav this thread and keep forgetting. So tagged or whatever we say now.

I just saw an article about a week ago that said that Windows 8 isn't even selling as well as Vista.

2000 was actually good. Don't lump it in with ME.

Win2K was really, really good, for the time. It was the first OS from Microsoft that you could (mostly) trust. NT was pretty good before that, but if you put much real load on it, it would fall over... it didn't make a very good server. Linux was far better, to the point that it embarrassed them, and they got their crap together in Win2K.

Of all the OSes they've ever shipped, that was probably the one most focused on actual customer benefit, as opposed to marketing buzzwords or monopoly abuse.

You'd think MS would notice the pattern at some point.
Me & 2000 Boo! (edit)
XP Yay!
Vista Boo!
7 Yay!
8 Boo!

It's an ironic position. The better they make their latest OS, the worse the prospects of the next OS because if you have a product that works well, why would you give it up unless you had to do so?

That's part of why they want to go to software as a service, where you pay a yearly fee, and they can maintain it forever.

That said, the reputation hit from doing OSes that suck is probably worse, overall. PC sales are absolutely plunging; I think they were down about 11% last year. The combination of Intel peaking out and Microsoft sucking has made it a very unattractive space.... a new machine is barely faster than an old one, and if it comes with 8, it's a major step backward for many people.

If Windows 9 sucks too, they could be in real trouble.

I switched over to W8 last night thanks to keys being so damn cheap online. Either someone hacked something or stole something because there's a ton of codes floating around the Net.

garion333 wrote:

I switched over to W8 last night thanks to keys being so damn cheap online. Either someone hacked something or stole something because there's a ton of codes floating around the Net.

Link? How was the upgrade from Win 7? I have so much stuff I just don't want to do a fresh install.

Win7 to Win8 upgrades have worked fine for me, although I've only done a couple. Win2008 to Win2012 to Win2012 R2 have worked smashingly well. I've done several domain controllers and hyper-v servers as well. I think it's safe to say that Microsoft has upgrades down now.

All of my systems are Windows 8 now. Other than the moronic decision to push the 8.1 upgrade to the Store I've loved the Windows 8 improvements when combined with Start8. I even have a couple of systems I haven't installed Start8 on with the refresh of 8.1. It helps make the 2012 servers I support not as jarring when I'm on their desktop.

EvilDead wrote:
garion333 wrote:

I switched over to W8 last night thanks to keys being so damn cheap online. Either someone hacked something or stole something because there's a ton of codes floating around the Net.

Link? How was the upgrade from Win 7? I have so much stuff I just don't want to do a fresh install.

Reddit has W8 key threads almost all the time. They were going for as cheap as $8 a week or so ago.

I got mine off of ebay for ~$40. I'm good with that.

As far as the upgrade I basically got it up and running last night and it took longer than I expected. In fact, without babysitting the computer it took me most of the evening to get it up and running and then patched (something like 80 security patches and everything). Nothing went wrong, it just took longer than I ever expected.

Since I didn't buy an 8.1 key, which I didn't realize was different, I now get to download 8.1 tonight. Yay.

Malor wrote:

That's part of why they want to go to software as a service, where you pay a yearly fee, and they can maintain it forever.

That said, the reputation hit from doing OSes that suck is probably worse, overall. PC sales are absolutely plunging; I think they were down about 11% last year. The combination of Intel peaking out and Microsoft sucking has made it a very unattractive space.... a new machine is barely faster than an old one, and if it comes with 8, it's a major step backward for many people.

If Windows 9 sucks too, they could be in real trouble.

Lets examine this statement (FUD). Currently the Windows division at Microsoft accounts for a decent size chunk of Microsoft's overall revenue, but its still 3rd place behind Servers and Tools and Microsoft Business Division. Additionally revenue has largely been flat for the last 3 years despite as you state PC sales plunging and Windows 8 sucking (odd how that happened). Right now 65% of the total revenue in the Windows Division comes from OEM sales of Windows 7 and 8 in PC's and Laptops sold around the world. So despite your dire news AND the $900M write off on the Surface RT revenue is still fairly stable. So we would need to see an even greater disaster than Windows 8 and the PC market for this division to start actually impacting overall revenue at Microsoft.

BUT.. oh boy.. nasty buts coming.. Microsoft doesn't have to rely on a single division for growth.. In fact they are ensuring the life of the company by doing exactly what they keep trying to do.. innovate and experiment. In that you will have misses..but you might eventually get a hit and suddenly your existing business lines that fade over time get replaced by new business lines. Nothing wrong with that.. in fact that is the sign of a healthy company.

Hopefully everyone else reading this recognizes your posts for the FUD that they are... oh and their Saas lines (Office 365 and Azure) are doing very well growth wise.

All of my systems are Windows 8 now. Other than the moronic decision to push the 8.1 upgrade to the Store I've loved the Windows 8 improvements when combined with Start8. I even have a couple of systems I haven't installed Start8 on with the refresh of 8.1. It helps make the 2012 servers I support not as jarring when I'm on their desktop.

In itself Windows 8 is perfectly fine.. and in fact a nice upgrade from Windows 7. Microsoft just made a misstep when they believed the market wanted a unified Tablet and Desktop OS.. While we sorta do (I love the Surface Pro) most consumers really just want an iPad or an Android Tablet and then a "regular" laptop/desktop. The real failure is that Microsoft just really has no hope of getting back into the tablet space... The ship has sailed. So while I applaud them for trying to be innovative in the OS space.. what they really need is more flexibility rather than a one size fits all model. I hope they keep the Surface Pro concept around (even if its through OEM partners) since I can't go back now that I have it.

garion333 wrote:

Since I didn't buy an 8.1 key, which I didn't realize was different, I now get to download 8.1 tonight. Yay.

You can apparently download the 8.1 ISO with your 8 key. That would be better in the future, fewer updates and no need to separately install 8.1. 8.1 is more like an OS upgrade than a service pack. It's about a 4 GB download and afterwards you'll have a c:\windows.old directory.

LiquidMantis wrote:
garion333 wrote:

Since I didn't buy an 8.1 key, which I didn't realize was different, I now get to download 8.1 tonight. Yay.

You can apparently download the 8.1 ISO with your 8 key. That would be better in the future, fewer updates and no need to separately install 8.1. 8.1 is more like an OS upgrade than a service pack. It's about a 4 GB download and afterwards you'll have a c:windows.old directory.

The 8.1 ISO's won't install with a straight 8 key...without going into the files and changing a file. It's not hard to do, but basically it just delays the requirement for the key until after the OS is installed. Otherwise, it won't allow the install.

(I did it that way)

MannishBoy wrote:
LiquidMantis wrote:
garion333 wrote:

Since I didn't buy an 8.1 key, which I didn't realize was different, I now get to download 8.1 tonight. Yay.

You can apparently download the 8.1 ISO with your 8 key. That would be better in the future, fewer updates and no need to separately install 8.1. 8.1 is more like an OS upgrade than a service pack. It's about a 4 GB download and afterwards you'll have a c:windows.old directory.

The 8.1 ISO's won't install with a straight 8 key...without going into the files and changing a file. It's not hard to do, but basically it just delays the requirement for the key until after the OS is installed. Otherwise, it won't allow the install.

Yeah, when I attempted to download 8.1 that way it wouldn't let me as my key was for Windows 8. I have no problem getting a free update to 8.1 (I'm used to downloading service packs after the fact), but the W8 install took longer than any other upgrade I've ever done and was a bit bummed I get to deal with more updates tonight.

garion333 wrote:
MannishBoy wrote:
LiquidMantis wrote:
garion333 wrote:

Since I didn't buy an 8.1 key, which I didn't realize was different, I now get to download 8.1 tonight. Yay.

You can apparently download the 8.1 ISO with your 8 key. That would be better in the future, fewer updates and no need to separately install 8.1. 8.1 is more like an OS upgrade than a service pack. It's about a 4 GB download and afterwards you'll have a c:windows.old directory.

The 8.1 ISO's won't install with a straight 8 key...without going into the files and changing a file. It's not hard to do, but basically it just delays the requirement for the key until after the OS is installed. Otherwise, it won't allow the install.

Yeah, when I attempted to download 8.1 that way it wouldn't let me as my key was for Windows 8. I have no problem getting a free update to 8.1 (I'm used to downloading service packs after the fact), but the W8 install took longer than any other upgrade I've ever done and was a bit bummed I get to deal with more updates tonight.

All you have to do to get the 8.1 ISO to work is to create a bootable USB install drive (you can use the MS software to make one for the Win 7 iso. Works the same). Then do the following:

If you create a bootable thumbdrive, you can create a new file in the sources folder called ei.cfg with the following in it:

[EditionID]
Professional
[Channel]
Retail
[VL]
0

This will make it ask for a key after installation instead of before, and it accepts windows 8 keys.

That looks way more simple than I was expecting.

garion333 wrote:

That looks way more simple than I was expecting.

Yeah, it's kind of like the Win 7 "clean install with upgrade media" stuff where all you have to do is flip a registry bit after install to get it to take the upgrade key.

Here's the full page on how to download the ISO.

garion333 wrote:

That looks way more simple than I was expecting.

Yeah, it's kind of like the Win 7 "clean install with upgrade media" stuff where all you have to do is flip a registry bit after install to get it to take the upgrade key.

Here's the full page on how to download the ISO.

garion333 wrote:

That looks way more simple than I was expecting.

If you have any questions, give Dan or I a shout.

MannishBoy wrote:
If you create a bootable thumbdrive, you can create a new file in the sources folder called ei.cfg with the following in it:

[EditionID]
Professional
[Channel]
Retail
[VL]
0

This will make it ask for a key after installation instead of before, and it accepts windows 8 keys.

Man, I need to do this on my thumb drive. It's much easier for me to add the product key once the machine is on my network and I can grab it off the file shares and paste it. It's annoying as hell to have to either have another machine at hand or write down and then type the key in.

Actually I don't even think that the metro interface is a decent tablet or phone UI. And while I was a bit confused trying to find stuff in windows 8, (I ended up using the search box for everything so kudos to MS for making everything available there) in windows 8.1 I had a much easier time figuring out where everything is. (right click the "start button")

So the metro interface is a big flop for me because it seems somebody thought it would be a great idea to pattern a UI after a scrapbook/collage. Well everybody loves scrapbooks and they become very personal so why not? Well why not is that scrapbooks are made to be viewed sequentially or haphazardly. "Let's go look at baby pictures. Here is 1 week old and 2 weeks old and then 1 month old and two months old, so cute." Or "lets open this one marked 1997 and start towards the middle to see what we find."

Scrapbooks absolutely break down when you are searching for some things out of order or you open the book initially and want to find something very specific. So much effort is wasted flipping through extra pages back and forth trying to find something. "I want to see the picture of me blowing out the candles on my fourth birthday." "Now lets show my dad and 2 uncles singing at my wedding." "Now go back to the petting zoo when I was 2 and a half." Even going between several items in the same area requires back and forth and scouring each page because you don't know where it is located on the page if you find the right one.

Now I will admit that a lot of people's desktops in prior OSes do in fact look like jumbled messes or scrapbooks/collages. The difference here is you started with a blank and personalized you collage desktop over time. The metro UI basically starts you off with a collage filled with stuff they want you to look at and you have to unravel nearly completely to build it back up over time the way you are comfortable with. That is why the desktop button is so important. With one click you bypass the busy collage MS has built for you and can start up your own. MS may have been better served if they had implemented a hotkey or button in the corner that let you wipe the metro preset collage.

fang, good points all, but I feel most of what you're saying is more true of a PC than for mobile devices. Metro feels much different on a phone (or tablet, I presume) than it does on a PC. Much less fiddly, imho.