George Zimmerman Arrested

Not really victim blaming. Of course the person at fault is Zimmerman, but if you know this dude is a complete and utter dirtbag (and it is simply mystifying to me how anyone who hasn't been ensconced in a North Korean reeducation camp could NOT be aware of his many, significant character flaws) and still decide to date him, you really do need to take some responsibility for the outcome.

Paleocon wrote:

Okay. CNN just posted the picture of the girlfriend that made that 911 call and she is actually a looker.

This goes back to the question above regarding how in the hell does an unemployed, 300+ pound, holster sniffing deadbeat who is $9million in debt with a history of beating up on women, assaulting law officers, and hunting down and killing teenagers able to find a girlfriend that doesn't look like Honey Boo Boo's mom?

If I live to 10000, I will never understand women.

Fame, notoriety, confidence, and his ability to emotionally control, financially control, or psychologically manipulate his significant other are all possible reasons. He could be one of the cyclic types that goes off on abusive rampages but is all sweet and romantic the next day to make up for it. He could have any number of qualities she finds attractive that aren't apparent to people who only know him from the media. She could come from an abusive home with plenty of emotional and psychological hang-ups and/or issues that cause her to be more susceptible to his type.

It's easy to make judgments from the sidelines, especially as a successful, strong-willed, independent human. If you were a woman you would dump that guy the second he did some dumb stuff like that, but then again you wouldn't even date him in the first place. It's not a, "women and their crazy taste in men," problem, it's an abusive relationship problem. Her looks are likewise not relevant. Scorn for or scoffing at the victim is not appropriate.

I would rather keep the talk about Zimmerman.

Paleocon wrote:

Okay. CNN just posted the picture of the girlfriend that made that 911 call and she is actually a looker.

This goes back to the question above regarding how in the hell does an unemployed, 300+ pound, holster sniffing deadbeat who is $9million in debt with a history of beating up on women, assaulting law officers, and hunting down and killing teenagers able to find a girlfriend that doesn't look like Honey Boo Boo's mom?

If I live to 10000, I will never understand women.

Oh for f*ck's sake.

Yeah, because pretty people aren't allowed to fall in love with uggo's, amirite?

For someone as smart as you Paleo, you occasionally say some really dumb crap around these parts.

Paleocon wrote:

Not really victim blaming. Of course the person at fault is Zimmerman, but if you know this dude is a complete and utter dirtbag (and it is simply mystifying to me how anyone who hasn't been ensconced in a North Korean reeducation camp could NOT be aware of his many, significant character flaws) and still decide to date him, you really do need to take some responsibility for the outcome.

Dude, at first you assumed she was some hideous creature who was only with Zimmerman because she had some kind of mental problem like low self-esteem & depression.

Now that you've decided she is ZOMG SMOKIN HAWT, she must be yet another stupid woman who dates a-holes.

Or, you know, she thought he was innocent like so many others have. Or, you know, he hasn't done anything crazy until that day.

Victim blaming.

Jonman wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

Okay. CNN just posted the picture of the girlfriend that made that 911 call and she is actually a looker.

This goes back to the question above regarding how in the hell does an unemployed, 300+ pound, holster sniffing deadbeat who is $9million in debt with a history of beating up on women, assaulting law officers, and hunting down and killing teenagers able to find a girlfriend that doesn't look like Honey Boo Boo's mom?

If I live to 10000, I will never understand women.

Oh for f*ck's sake.

Yeah, because pretty people aren't allowed to fall in love with uggo's, amirite?

For someone as smart as you Paleo, you occasionally say some really dumb crap around these parts.

Okay. I am trying to apply the gender neutral filter on this and am just not seeing where you are coming from on this.

Should a guy voluntarily decide to go out with a known psychotic woman whose former boyfriend and ex husband both had restraining orders out on her, who was a deadbeat and $9 million in debt, and had just beaten a murder rap in which she had stalked another woman down and shot her dead in the streets, I would be saying precisely the same thing: That anyone so deliberately ignorant must at least take some responsibility for their contribution to this outcome. I might give a very limited amount of allowance if she were hot as hell, but if she looked like she was beaten half the death with the ugly stick, even that goes down the crapper.

There is at least *some* explanation for why folks might fall victim to someone like Jeff Dahlmer (e.g.: he is charming, they had no idea he was a serial killer...), but the idea that anyone could find anything attractive in Zimmerman is a mystery to me. Even eliminating the physical, he is by all public accounts a pretty repulsive human being.

Robear wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

So I'll admit I chuckled at the Biden comment, but also I recognize picking on Biden is as fair as picking on Quayle. He's one of the reasons I'm convinced presidents pick the most loathsome and/or idiot vice presidents they can as an insurance policy. Try to assassinate me and just realize who'll you be putting in office instead.

Remember, VPs are brought in to shore up a regional weakness or exploit an opportunity in a region (unless you're stupid enough to select the head of your selection committee, in which case you get the veep you deserve). Biden is from Scranton PA, and is well-known there and in surrounding states, like Ohio. He's also older and white, which means he was good for Florida as well.

Biden is also incredibly well-respected in the Senate (helpful when brokering deals) and is in the running for the least corruptible person elected to the Senate in my lifetime. His net worth is significantly less than most (if not all) other long-term Senators and it's not like he hasn't had options.

He runs his mouth and looks publicly foolish on occasion (how much of that is calculated? Because when he wants to, he can run circles around people--hello, debate punching bag Paul Ryan) but there is no possible way an informed person could call Biden "loathsome and/or [an] idiot". None. None ways.

Paleocon wrote:
Jonman wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

Okay. CNN just posted the picture of the girlfriend that made that 911 call and she is actually a looker.

This goes back to the question above regarding how in the hell does an unemployed, 300+ pound, holster sniffing deadbeat who is $9million in debt with a history of beating up on women, assaulting law officers, and hunting down and killing teenagers able to find a girlfriend that doesn't look like Honey Boo Boo's mom?

If I live to 10000, I will never understand women.

Oh for f*ck's sake.

Yeah, because pretty people aren't allowed to fall in love with uggo's, amirite?

For someone as smart as you Paleo, you occasionally say some really dumb crap around these parts.

Okay. I am trying to apply the gender neutral filter on this and am just not seeing where you are coming from on this.

Should a guy voluntarily decide to go out with a known psychotic woman whose former boyfriend and ex husband both had restraining orders out on her, who was a deadbeat and $9 million in debt, and had just beaten a murder rap in which she had stalked another woman down and shot her dead in the streets, I would be saying precisely the same thing: That anyone so deliberately ignorant must at least take some responsibility for their contribution to this outcome. I might give a very limited amount of allowance if she were hot as hell, but if she looked like she was beaten half the death with the ugly stick, even that goes down the crapper.

There is at least *some* explanation for why folks might fall victim to someone like Jeff Dahlmer (e.g.: he is charming, they had no idea he was a serial killer...), but the idea that anyone could find anything attractive in Zimmerman is a mystery to me. Even eliminating the physical, he is by all public accounts a pretty repulsive human being.

Nothing to do with gender, and everything to do with assuming that ugly people would want to be with Zimmerman, whereas hotties wouldn't.

Because you could understand how an ugly person would want to be with Zimmerman, but you can't wrap your head around how an attractive person would.

It's fat-shaming in disguise, and it's sh*tty.

Paleocon wrote:

There is at least *some* explanation for why folks might fall victim to someone like Jeff Dahlmer (e.g.: he is charming, they had no idea he was a serial killer...), but the idea that anyone could find anything attractive in Zimmerman is a mystery to me. Even eliminating the physical, he is by all public accounts a pretty repulsive human being.

She dated him in high school and had fond memories of him, and they were friends afterwards. Apparently, it took her just a week or two to discover her mistake, but then she decided to see whether she could help him sort things out.

Nothing really unusual about that kind of story, at least not where battered women are concerned. It's just sad.

Robear wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

There is at least *some* explanation for why folks might fall victim to someone like Jeff Dahlmer (e.g.: he is charming, they had no idea he was a serial killer...), but the idea that anyone could find anything attractive in Zimmerman is a mystery to me. Even eliminating the physical, he is by all public accounts a pretty repulsive human being.

She dated him in high school and had fond memories of him, and they were friends afterwards. Apparently, it took her just a week or two to discover her mistake, but then she decided to see whether she could help him sort things out.

Nothing really unusual about that kind of story, at least not where battered women are concerned. It's just sad.

Now that I buy. Even still, it is hard to have a whole lot of sympathy for someone who works so deliberately to block out the facts.

Ed Ropple wrote:
Robear wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

So I'll admit I chuckled at the Biden comment, but also I recognize picking on Biden is as fair as picking on Quayle. He's one of the reasons I'm convinced presidents pick the most loathsome and/or idiot vice presidents they can as an insurance policy. Try to assassinate me and just realize who'll you be putting in office instead.

Remember, VPs are brought in to shore up a regional weakness or exploit an opportunity in a region (unless you're stupid enough to select the head of your selection committee, in which case you get the veep you deserve). Biden is from Scranton PA, and is well-known there and in surrounding states, like Ohio. He's also older and white, which means he was good for Florida as well.

Biden is also incredibly well-respected in the Senate (helpful when brokering deals) and is in the running for the least corruptible person elected to the Senate in my lifetime. His net worth is significantly less than most (if not all) other long-term Senators and it's not like he hasn't had options.

He runs his mouth and looks publicly foolish on occasion (how much of that is calculated? Because when he wants to, he can run circles around people--hello, debate punching bag Paul Ryan) but there is no possible way an informed person could call Biden "loathsome and/or [an] idiot". None. None ways.

Ok, you caught me being cheeky. But c'mon it's easy to take a few jovial potshots at Biden for his gaffes. And for the record I don't think he's a total idiot, but then again I also don't think Cheney was evil incarnate which is pretty much the stance of most of my fellow Northwesterners.

Getting back to Zimmerman, my point wasn't whether the girl was good looking or not. It was that I couldn't understand how Zimmerman could get anyone to have sex with him, and yes I'm including sex workers in that mix.

I kind of see Bloo's point about keeping the spotlight on him as a posterboy of gun reform, but to me it still feels like the media simply following a case for sensationalist value only. At any rate, they should have a decent case against him for aggravated assault which could put him away for 5 years and at the very least take away his legal access to firearms permanently.

To be fire, it does happen. In fact, this came across my local news just two days ago.

http://www.kirotv.com/ap/ap/washingt...

jdzappa wrote:

I kind of see Bloo's point about keeping the spotlight on him as a posterboy of gun reform, but to me it still feels like the media simply following a case for sensationalist value only. At any rate, they should have a decent case against him for aggravated assault which could put him away for 5 years and at the very least take away his legal access to firearms permanently.

Yeah, to be clear - I don't think the media is following him (for the most part) out of some sort of commitment to showing this as a reflection of irresponsible gun use. They just want their ratings.

So which is scarier?

1) News channels putting their own popularity and ratings above their journalistic integrity and duties as a watchdog for the people.

2) The fact that nonsense like this seems to be an effective ratings booster.

3) George Zimmerman.

If he is within 20 feet of me, George Zimmerman wins.

Otherwise 1 is just a reaction to 2... so 2-1-3.

What this whole business says to me is that the picture emerging of Zimmerman now really sheds a hell of a lot of light on what most likely transpired the night that he shot and killed Trayvon Martin. Given what we know now, which is more likely?

1) George Zimmerman was a concerned, civic minded individual who got ambushed and suckerpunched by a stone cold killer thug he was observing but trying to keep distance from.

or

2) George Zimmerman hunted down a teenager he classified as "likely undesirable", was looking for a confrontation, likely initiated one at least verbally, and upon entering into this confrontation and realizing that he was outmatched physically, drew his weapon and killed the teenager.

I am going with #2.

Paleocon wrote:

Not really victim blaming. Of course the person at fault is Zimmerman, but if you know this dude is a complete and utter dirtbag (and it is simply mystifying to me how anyone who hasn't been ensconced in a North Korean reeducation camp could NOT be aware of his many, significant character flaws) and still decide to date him, you really do need to take some responsibility for the outcome.

I hope I'm not super-piling on. I've been assured that you're strong, but PM me or something if it starts getting too much.

My take on that topic breaks down into two broad ideas:
1) What any one woman does is not indicative of an entire group of people whose main identifying similarity is plumbing. Drawing that similarity is the same as people looking at Zimmerman, rolling their eyes at you and saying, "Men..." Both are dismissive and irrational, IMO.

2) Being an attractive man or woman does not mean that a person is free from personal flaws and troubles. IMO, extremely attractive people could actually have problems growing up like the rest of us because their looks distort everyone's behavior and they are more likely to thus have certain personality issues. Whatever cause she may have had for being involved with Zimmerman is, to me, a source of pity and sympathy, not callous dismissal. Everyone's got baggage.

Sorry, but any sympathy he may have been warranted went right out the window the moment he executed a child while thinking he was some super badass American hero.

Paleocon wrote:

Okay. CNN just posted the picture of the girlfriend that made that 911 call and she is actually a looker.

This goes back to the question above regarding how in the hell does an unemployed, 300+ pound, holster sniffing deadbeat who is $9million in debt with a history of beating up on women, assaulting law officers, and hunting down and killing teenagers able to find a girlfriend that doesn't look like Honey Boo Boo's mom?

If I live to 10000, I will never understand women.

Because a woman's looks aren't her single defining character trait.

Fair enough.

My point above was that no person in their right mind would or should knowingly allow a violent loser with a demonstrable history of the crap he has been known to do into their lives -- let alone into an intimate part of their lives. And the fact that she appears to have other options makes the decision to do so even more mystifying.

But what the hell do I know? Folks do dumbass sh1t.

If the legit answer is that she isn't in her right mind, that explains a lot.

I am as unsurprised by that as I was unsurprised that he has been involved in altercations involving violence and/or guns since being acquitted in the Trayvon case.

I know nothing about the facts of the case however I assume that the judge and legal system did the best they could.

I am torn because while I think the man is terrible I am also pretty sure he is in a personal hell even if he isn't behind bars.

It is only a matter of time before he beats up the wrong person's daughter and gets some of that self-help justice for which he is so fond.

Paleocon wrote:

It is only a matter of time before he beats up the wrong person's daughter and gets some of that self-help justice for which he is so fond.

Yeah, unfortunately his Hell is not so personal.

Typical battered woman reaction. Nothing can be done if your main witness and victim says nothing happen and the police pressured her.

Because his name is known nation-wide, I wonder if she had received any harassment from Zimmerman supporters as well.

Mystic Violet wrote:

Because his name is known nation-wide, I wonder if she had received any harassment from Zimmerman supporters as well.


Zimmerman supporters

George Zimmerman makes art, then makes a joke about the Trayvon Martin shooting.

Cuz why not.

http://gawker.com/george-zimmerman-i...

In the item's description, Zimmerman explains the impetus behind the impromptu art sale:

Everyone has been asking what I have been doing with myself. I found a creative, way to express myself, my emotions and the symbols that represent my experiences. My art work allows me to reflect, providing a therapeutic outlet and allows me to remain indoors I hope you enjoy owning this piece as much as I enjoyed creating it. Your friend, George Zimmerman

The current bid for this masterpiece is now $34 shy of $100K...

OG_slinger wrote:

The current bid for this masterpiece is now $34 shy of $100K...

I don't believe that.