Wargame: Airland Battle, anyone heard of this?

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Saw this as an upcoming release and it reminded me of World in Conflict. Anyone heard of this game or have recommendations based on the beta?

There was some discussion in the Wargamer's Corner thread, mostly favorable.

I'm also getting a very strong world in conflict vibe from it too. I loved WIC and if this is anything like that, I may have to jump on board.

BlackSabre wrote:

I'm also getting a very strong world in conflict vibe from it too. I loved WIC and if this is anything like that, I may have to jump on board.

Very similar to Wargame: European Escalation, but with air assets. I've enjoyed my time with Wargame:EE, Much more strategic than micro-managy.

I pre-ordered and have been playing the beta. It is an improved version over EE. (The devs also produced the underrated R.U.S.E.) Early reports on the campaign are also favorable. It is essentially a great tactical RTS with deck building to compose your available forces. In EE you had to unlock command stars to get access to new units and add them to a deck. in ALB, they have removed the unlocking so everything is available and you just build your deck. They have done a lot of balancing the last several weeks and it is feeling pretty solid right now.

If anyone wants to play some multi or co-op, look me up on Steam.

Have they improved the UI? After RUSE, EE was a pretty big letdown in terms of UI, and I never really got beyond that.

They have cleaned up a few things, but the UI has not changed much from EE.

I watched a stream of this on twitch for a solid half hour, maybe 45 minutes, and never once really understood anything that was happening.

I got that he was capturing territories, somehow, but never understood even one other aspect of what was going on.

I'm a really big fan of the game (and its predecessor), though with the disclaimer that my experience is based mostly on the multiplayer beta - haven't had the time to try the new singleplayer campaign yet.

In a nutshell, Wargame: AB (and EE) take the Panzer General design philosophy and apply it to a Cold War-themed RTS. Both Wargame and PzG are beer-and-pretzels takes on wargaming concepts: putting the right troops, in the right place, at the right time, while paying attention to terrain, recon, flanking, combined arms, and logistics. It's just that the technology to create something like this didn't exist in 1994.

Hope it helps! If you'd like more detail, I wrote a preview of the game for my site; would it be against the rules to link it?

If anyone is playing, add me as a friend. Either Shoal or Shoal07, whatever the game decides to use as my friendname...

I also purchased it today, never played European Escalation, so I'm still trying to figure everything out. You can friend me up in game as Laarrs, if you want. Or don't, whatever man!

Laarrs wrote:

I also purchased it today, never played European Escalation, so I'm still trying to figure everything out. You can friend me up in game as Laarrs, if you want. Or don't, whatever man! ;)

Is it as inscrutable as watching someone else play might imply? How's the learning curve? I'd love to read some impressions from someone else who's going in kinda cold.

Thin_J wrote:
Laarrs wrote:

I also purchased it today, never played European Escalation, so I'm still trying to figure everything out. You can friend me up in game as Laarrs, if you want. Or don't, whatever man! ;)

Is it as inscrutable as watching someone else play might imply? How's the learning curve? I'd love to read some impressions from someone else who's going in kinda cold.

It's an RTS, but its focused far more on strategy and micro then it is on macro. So, not like starcraft. More rock paper scissors stuff, positioning, line of sight, etc.

How much do you know about basic military strategy? It's still a game, so if the answer is "not that much" that's ok. I'm at a disadvantage because it's military strategy circa 1981, so the battlefield is a completely different place then it is today, or even post-cold war doctrine, which I am more familiar with. Still, most of the world's military are using 1970s technology (F-16, F-18, F-15, M1A1, you get the idea).

I watched a few youtube videos and I am jumping into non-ranked multi (ranked is only 1v1). The campaign is still a little beyond my skill, but I'm learning. You get to customize your "deck" or use premade ones. Decks are the selections and amounts of units you can bring into battle as you get the points to do so. I am favoring a 101st airborne style with blackhawks delivering infantry to key locations, then backing them up with fighter (A10s, B117), Apache, and tank support as I get the points. Air Cav, basically, Vietnam style.

Thin_J wrote:

Is it as inscrutable as watching someone else play might imply? How's the learning curve? I'd love to read some impressions from someone else who's going in kinda cold.

I'm a long way from going in cold, but I can take a stab at this anyway...

I think this is one of those "minute to learn, lifetime to master" games. The basic controls are really simple - right-click to move/attack. So are the concepts: holding territory generates income at a specified rate; forests are good for concealing troops; infantry get a defensive bonus when garrisoned in buildings; that kinda thing. The real learning curve, as Shoal07 points out, relates to applying those concepts (and working out which unit to use in a given situation). Hope that helps!

Meanwhile, is anyone trying the campaigns? I've played the first campaign, which is really just an extension of the tutorial -- it's very short and seems almost impossible to lose. From there I've jumped straight into the Very Hard NATO campaign. So far (two in-game days in), so good. The Danish army (with some West German help) is holding its own against Pact forces moving north from Germany, and the Swedes managed to annihilate a Polish landing at Malmo, but let's see what happens when the main Soviet armoured force enters the fray...

Thin_J wrote:
Laarrs wrote:

I also purchased it today, never played European Escalation, so I'm still trying to figure everything out. You can friend me up in game as Laarrs, if you want. Or don't, whatever man! ;)

Is it as inscrutable as watching someone else play might imply? How's the learning curve? I'd love to read some impressions from someone else who's going in kinda cold.

Hasn't been difficult so far. Keep in mind, I've only played through 3 or 4 tutorial missions so far. It is easier then it looks on the videos. (I've watched a couple as well) I'm not good at most RTS games, as I'm not good at managing a whole bunch of units at the same time (especially if the units have special abilities to use as well), but with the distances and speed that units have to move around the map, it's much easier to keep on top of what's going on. You acquire more units by spending command points, which I believe you get by capturing different points on the map. I'm not sure if killing enemy units gives you command points. It took me a bit to figure it out, but in order to capture points, you have to have a command vehicle inside the area, and it has to remain stationary.

The other thing you have to worry about is keeping your vehicles supplied. They will run out of ammunition and fuel if they aren't kept supplied. You can resupply them by driving them back to a supply station, or by using supply trucks to ferry supplies out to your front lines.

To sum up, if you're hesitating because you think it'd be too confusing, don't worry about it. If I can wrap my head around it, anyone can.

Laarrs wrote:

I'm not sure if killing enemy units gives you command points. It took me a bit to figure it out, but in order to capture points, you have to have a command vehicle inside the area, and it has to remain stationary

Nope, the only thing that gives you command points is holding territory with a command vehicle. Killing enemy units only gives victory points.

PeterS wrote:
Laarrs wrote:

I'm not sure if killing enemy units gives you command points. It took me a bit to figure it out, but in order to capture points, you have to have a command vehicle inside the area, and it has to remain stationary

Nope, the only thing that gives you command points is holding territory with a command vehicle. Killing enemy units only gives victory points.

Thanks for clarifying.

The real secret is logistics. All the "good" weapons, like infantry Dragon missiles, or AA missiles, have very limited ammo. I couldn't believe my Chieftain AAs only had 6 ammo! Having logistics trucks (or Chinooks) move with your army makes a big difference. Infantry in a town, with dragons, and a logistics truck can hold out forever. That same team will die very quickly once their missiles run out. If you don't see the pattern, you'll think infantry just suck. The reality is they just need supply. Same with AA, helios, Artillery... anything with limited Ammo. Tanks are usually OK, unless they rely on missiles, then they need more support.

Logistics are also really cheap, most people just seem to forget to use them.

I'm mindelemental in-game, so feel free to add me.

After playing a bit more last night, I am impressed by how much richness the campaign can get out of some very simple mechanics. Rather than simply being a bunch of skirmishes, it encourages players to think about how to position battle groups for mutual support, and then on the tactical map, encourages playing with an eye on the strategic situation (eg if I buy time with a series of draws, grab a key sector, etc, that may allow me to set up a knockout blow as soon as I can rush a fresh brigade into the area). From a thematic perspective, it's also very cool that the campaign models considerations we've all read about or played out in dedicated operational-level games, such as the tradeoff between the competing demands of pushing an offensive and taking time to resupply one's troops, the potential for stubborn defenders to throw an attacker's plan off schedule, the tendency for small meeting engagements to mushroom once the high command commits more troops, etc.

This thread on the official forums has some excellent advice for the campaign. Someone on another forum prepared a good summary of that thread, which I've pasted below:

There are two types of battles: blitzes and meatgrinders. Blitzes are what most people try to do. The goal is to win, either by killing all the enemy CVs or reaching the point limit. However, you'll notice that this is best accomplished when the you have high initiative and the enemy battlegroup has low morale (thus lowering the victory score limit) or low initiative (thus fewer units, letting you attack their CV more easily). However, you usually have to set the stage first, either by using strategic aids such as airstrikes and naval bombardment, or attacking a battlegroup that's been exhausted by lots of battles. The more overkill you have, the better.

However, the other type of battle is a meatgrinder. As repeated battles between two battlegroups drag on, initiative drops and moral rises - which makes it much harder to win the next round. Sure, it's possible to eventually win, but you'll end up with an exhausted battlegroup that's vulnerable to an enemy counterattack. However, that's the point. The goal is not to "win", actually; the goal is to survive. You're tying up the enemy force and preparing it for a blitz from a fresh battlegroup. This is also greatly helped by the fact that captured sectors are persistent between consecutive battles -- use the meatgrinder battles to capture zones from which a fresh battlegroup has an excellent chance at rushing the enemies. Or, better yet, use command armor to neutralize their reinforcement zone (or bring in another battlegroup from that direction), and they'll start the next battle stuck in a single 1-point sector in the middle of the map with no way to call in supplies or airplanes.

I can testify that this works, BTW. Last night I destroyed a 7 morale brigade that had been ground down by steady fighting (it was down to 1 initiative and had lost its helicopters, planes, and most of its tanks) by bringing in a crappy-but-fresh reservist brigade with morale 2 but high initiative.

PWAlessi wrote:

Just bought a copy. I never played EE, but I really liked RUSE despite basically everyone else hating it.

People hate RUSE? Is a cool game. Screw them.

Very interesting. I'm looking forward to getting into this game.

I'm 4 in a row in multi. I like 3v3s, anything more and you tend to have a lot of disconnects (I think it's a little buggy atm). I always take a forward reinforcement base with my air assault infantry and lock it down. Then I usually call in some AA to protect it (the infantry protect it from tanks and anything else) and send the blackhawks off to cause some chaos, like trying to take out enemy command vehicles. There's so many that they can cause a lot of chaos before they die.

By taking a forward reinforcement base I deny the enemy one of their first usual captures and we can spawn more troops right next to their base. It seems to throw a lot of people off guard. Then, if they have artillery, they usually shoot at my infantry, which does almost nothing if they're in buildings, and that allows me to use a B-117 to take out their arty. The best thing for me is if they decide to launch a full out assault against my now hunkered in infantry, it's a Dragon bloodbath.

Usually I sit and wait, buying a few A10s and F16s until I've got enough points to call in a bunch of cheap Cobras and some Apaches. Then I go on the offensive.

In the last game I basically just hunted command vehicles with helios. It was fun, and we won by taking out all their command vehicles, not by points. On the plus side, all those migs they tend to buy to counter my helios become usless if they don't have any reinforcement sectors left.

Just bought a copy. I never played EE, but I really liked RUSE despite basically everyone else hating it.

Anyway, feel free to add me on Steam, my ID is in my sig. I will add all of you guys when the download is done and I fire it up.

My plan is to play some of the single player to get my feet wet and learn the basics, then jump into multiplayer. If any of you guys want to get on voice chat and group up for some comp stomps or to play some games vs. other people, that might be cool too.

[edit] I didn't realize that there is a different in game ID. I'm iPhoneAppz in game as well as on Steam.

I started playing the tutorials today. I finished 1 and 2, but the 3rd one glitches on me. I killed all of the enemies and destroyed all of their command posts, but the mission wouldn't end. I drove my recon truck all over the place looking for more units to destroy, but I couldn't find any. Has anyone else seen this problem?

Shoal07 wrote:

I'm 4 in a row in multi. I like 3v3s, anything more and you tend to have a lot of disconnects (I think it's a little buggy atm). I always take a forward reinforcement base with my air assault infantry and lock it down. Then I usually call in some AA to protect it (the infantry protect it from tanks and anything else) and send the blackhawks off to cause some chaos, like trying to take out enemy command vehicles. There's so many that they can cause a lot of chaos before they die.

By taking a forward reinforcement base I deny the enemy one of their first usual captures and we can spawn more troops right next to their base. It seems to throw a lot of people off guard. Then, if they have artillery, they usually shoot at my infantry, which does almost nothing if they're in buildings, and that allows me to use a B-117 to take out their arty. The best thing for me is if they decide to launch a full out assault against my now hunkered in infantry, it's a Dragon bloodbath.

Usually I sit and wait, buying a few A10s and F16s until I've got enough points to call in a bunch of cheap Cobras and some Apaches. Then I go on the offensive.

In the last game I basically just hunted command vehicles with helios. It was fun, and we won by taking out all their command vehicles, not by points. On the plus side, all those migs they tend to buy to counter my helios become usless if they don't have any reinforcement sectors left. :)

That's a great strategy and actually kind of mirrors US/Allied intentions if there were a Russian invasion in the 80's. US/Allied units were to take key forward locations and dig in allowing our helo units to hunt Soviet Command Units both airborne and ground to disrupt their Command and Control. Main fear was the use of chemical weapons by the Warsaw Pact to clear out strongholds. The Sovs also had a massive superiority in artillery and it was assumed that much of Germany was already pre-targeted and gridded out for fire missions. This was supposedly going to allow time enough for the US to ship additional heavy forces via the sea to Europe. This was the same concept we employed in the first Gulf War.

SpyNavy wrote:
Shoal07 wrote:

I'm 4 in a row in multi. I like 3v3s, anything more and you tend to have a lot of disconnects (I think it's a little buggy atm). I always take a forward reinforcement base with my air assault infantry and lock it down. Then I usually call in some AA to protect it (the infantry protect it from tanks and anything else) and send the blackhawks off to cause some chaos, like trying to take out enemy command vehicles. There's so many that they can cause a lot of chaos before they die.

By taking a forward reinforcement base I deny the enemy one of their first usual captures and we can spawn more troops right next to their base. It seems to throw a lot of people off guard. Then, if they have artillery, they usually shoot at my infantry, which does almost nothing if they're in buildings, and that allows me to use a B-117 to take out their arty. The best thing for me is if they decide to launch a full out assault against my now hunkered in infantry, it's a Dragon bloodbath.

Usually I sit and wait, buying a few A10s and F16s until I've got enough points to call in a bunch of cheap Cobras and some Apaches. Then I go on the offensive.

In the last game I basically just hunted command vehicles with helios. It was fun, and we won by taking out all their command vehicles, not by points. On the plus side, all those migs they tend to buy to counter my helios become usless if they don't have any reinforcement sectors left. :)

That's a great strategy and actually kind of mirrors US/Allied intentions if there were a Russian invasion in the 80's. US/Allied units were to take key forward locations and dig in allowing our helo units to hunt Soviet Command Units both airborne and ground to disrupt their Command and Control. Main fear was the use of chemical weapons by the Warsaw Pact to clear out strongholds. The Sovs also had a massive superiority in artillery and it was assumed that much of Germany was already pre-targeted and gridded out for fire missions. This was supposedly going to allow time enough for the US to ship additional heavy forces via the sea to Europe. This was the same concept we employed in the first Gulf War.

Yeah, if you like this kind of stuff, this game is your crack. I think Paleocon would love it.

For those still on the fence, here's the manual, it might be useful reading.

http://focus-files.com/Manual/WALB/W...

Soo tempted...

This reminds me of a modern version of TacOPs which I played a lot.

Greg wrote:

Soo tempted...

This reminds me of a modern version of TacOPs which I played a lot.

It's really good so far. And with the GMG 20% coupon, I got it for $32.

PWAlessi wrote:

It's really good so far. And with the GMG 20% coupon, I got it for $32.

I'm too much of a sucker for RTS games to not go for this.

*Except it doesn't seem to work? Where do I use the 20% off coupon at? There's a voucher box in the first checkout bit, but it won't take it, and then it never asks for the rest of the checkout process.

Thin_J wrote:
PWAlessi wrote:

It's really good so far. And with the GMG 20% coupon, I got it for $32.

I'm too much of a sucker for RTS games to not go for this.

*Except it doesn't seem to work? Where do I use the 20% off coupon at? There's a voucher box in the first checkout bit, but it won't take it, and then it never asks for the rest of the checkout process.

Yeah, I put it in there on that screen. It didn't register for me when I hit the apply button, but when I hit the 'continue to payment' or whatever button, the discount showed up on that screen.

If you get it, definitely add me to your friends list in game. I think that it would be really cool if we can get a 5 man team to do 5v5 or at least maybe 4 players to do 2v2 or something all on voice chat.

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