Sony's got bad credit?

shoptroll wrote:
m0nk3yboy wrote:

Spec independent 'platform' (BYO -tech)

I still think, in light of the 360's RROD debacle, that MS would be better served by creating a spec for OEMs to follow to sell XBox branded hardware and just bail out of the hardware side of things. The 360's strengths are the software, controller, and Live, not the hardware.

If Valve ends up going that way (which is likely since Big Picture is definitely designed with something like Alienware's set-top boxes in mind) I wouldn't be surprised if MS follows suit.

'Windows 360/720' install disks FTW. Run it on a MacMini, dual boot, setup, or the PC equivalent (which I know will be miles better, but think of us poor Mac People, Gabe does) and you might just be onto a winner.

I'd stop short at agreeing on a generic OEM. Spec machine though. I brought back memories of the Mac Clones and how poorly they faired. Unless, of course, the market has learnt from that instance and MicroSoft agrees 'not' to produce hardware in parallel.

To bring it back to the OP, maybe the OS could be a way for SONY to keep itself profitable, and retain the Playstation IP, Brand Loyalty. Boot up into your Playstation partition and away you go (just keep your DRM to yourself). Unless Big Picture has tied up all patents for such a move...

m0nk3yboy wrote:

To bring it back to the OP, maybe the OS could be a way for SONY to keep itself profitable, and retain the Playstation IP, Brand Loyalty. Boot up into your Playstation partition and away you go (just keep your DRM to yourself).

Isn't that partially what they're trying to do with Playstation Suite for mobile devices?

“The earnings from these products are now expected to decline more rapidly than expected as the growing use of smartphones increasingly cannibalizes the market for compact digital cameras and portable game consoles.”

This more than anything is the root issue. Sony, Sharp, Panasonic, etc. had a large and vested interest in entertainment going on big and bigger screens, dedicated and specialized devices. Go watch this week's South Park.

Sony is suffering from the same problems that plagued Blockbuster.

For the past decade now Sony has been either chasing or ignoring Apple, more than anything. They did not realize a market for MP3s over CDs, because they had a major CD business to keep in track. Then they open their own store too late. Early concepts of the PSP would have been more of a smartphone with immense gaming and media capability, with a Sony Store. It never happened. Sony electronics has been pushing the livingroom and the high cost laptop while the rest of the industry is pushing tablets, mini PCs, and smartphones.

It is funny, because you can draw many parallels between the Japanese home electronics businesses and the American auto industry.

shoptroll wrote:
m0nk3yboy wrote:

To bring it back to the OP, maybe the OS could be a way for SONY to keep itself profitable, and retain the Playstation IP, Brand Loyalty. Boot up into your Playstation partition and away you go (just keep your DRM to yourself).

Isn't that partially what they're trying to do with Playstation Suite for mobile devices?

Not sure. To be honest I've been a bit selective this generation, kicking in with just the 360. Last gen I had them all, but I felt this generation, with the exception of a few titles on Wii and PS3, just felt like 'more of the same'. I guess because the 360 was new in terms of a lot of it's franchises, it still felt fresh to me.

I have dropped following the other two platforms, simply from the standpoint of avoiding temptation and furthering the pile.

For that reason, I think exploring possibilities like the one you mention are interesting, and I'd genuinely like to hear more discussion about what people feel SONY is doing in it's 'gaming space' to recapture some of it's cache with Gamers. PSX had such great cred, they went a bit off target with the 2, then seemed to lose their way with the 3 with some over complicated architecture and the bluray vs HDD battle (from my limited vantage point, at a very long arms length).

shoptroll wrote:
m0nk3yboy wrote:

Spec independent 'platform' (BYO -tech)

I still think, in light of the 360's RROD debacle, that MS would be better served by creating a spec for OEMs to follow to sell XBox branded hardware and just bail out of the hardware side of things. The 360's strengths are the software, controller, and Live, not the hardware.

If Valve ends up going that way (which is likely since Big Picture is definitely designed with something like Alienware's set-top boxes in mind) I wouldn't be surprised if MS follows suit.

I get we have selectively long memories.. but given that MS has sorted out the initial design issues can we clear them of this "label"?

TheGameguru wrote:

I get we have selectively long memories.. but given that MS has sorted out the initial design issues can we clear them of this "label"?

I'm just saying that if they shuffled the manufacturing to their OEM partners, they wouldn't have taken nearly as much fault with that incident. I know the newer models are significantly improved, but it's still something that shouldn't have happened in the first place. Ditto with Apple's antenna design in the iPhone 4 if you want another example.

m0nk3yboy wrote:

For that reason, I think exploring possibilities like the one you mention are interesting, and I'd genuinely like to hear more discussion about what people feel SONY is doing in it's 'gaming space' to recapture some of it's cache with Gamers. PSX had such great cred, they went a bit off target with the 2, then seemed to lose their way with the 3 with some over complicated architecture and the bluray vs HDD battle (from my limited vantage point, at a very long arms length).

How did Sony go "a bit off target" with the PlayStation 2? It was a bigger seller than the PSOne and was pretty widely regarded as the best of the four consoles last generation on the strength of its library alone.

shoptroll wrote:
TheGameguru wrote:

I get we have selectively long memories.. but given that MS has sorted out the initial design issues can we clear them of this "label"?

I'm just saying that if they shuffled the manufacturing to their OEM partners, they wouldn't have taken nearly as much fault with that incident. I know the newer models are significantly improved, but it's still something that shouldn't have happened in the first place. Ditto with Apple's antenna design in the iPhone 4 if you want another example.

In general OEM's aren't really interested in the Razer/razerblade market...why sell a console at loss if you aren't the one making money off the software license and ecosystem?

ClockworkHouse wrote:
m0nk3yboy wrote:

For that reason, I think exploring possibilities like the one you mention are interesting, and I'd genuinely like to hear more discussion about what people feel SONY is doing in it's 'gaming space' to recapture some of it's cache with Gamers. PSX had such great cred, they went a bit off target with the 2, then seemed to lose their way with the 3 with some over complicated architecture and the bluray vs HDD battle (from my limited vantage point, at a very long arms length).

How did Sony go "a bit off target" with the PlayStation 2? It was a bigger seller than the PSOne and was pretty widely regarded as the best of the four consoles last generation on the strength of its library alone.

Definitely agree, big they had a 'bit of a stumble' with developers with the 'new architecture' being 'so new' and the Dev tools met with some resistance. I recall that being perceived as a bit of a miss-step by developers early in the console's cycle, and some developers bemoaned the amount of effort to dig into the metal of the system. But as you say, they went on to 'win' that round (although I prefer to think of my Dreamcast more nostalgically ).

For the record, I still play my PS2, and I've even bought games for that system as recently as mid way through this year. (Damn you Minarchist).

Living in non-UK Europe, I am always a bit surprised how the English speaking countries seem to be very adamant how deeply Sony is doomed.
People still tend to refer to the "Playstation" and the "Nintendo" here in Germany when talking about videogames - at least in my circles and that may be a flawed perspective since I am not in touch with the younger folks anymore.

However, Sony seems to be doing fine and to be more specific, not much worse than Microsoft in terms of hardware business.
http://gamasutra.com/view/news/18179...

Clearly there is a difference between money earned, units shipped and units sold, but it doesn't seem that either of the big three are dropping the business anytime soon.

The PS3 was recently certified in China, so it could be coming this way officially at some point. Potentially a huge market for them if they can get in before Microsoft and embrace f2p games.

KingGorilla wrote:
“The earnings from these products are now expected to decline more rapidly than expected as the growing use of smartphones increasingly cannibalizes the market for compact digital cameras and portable game consoles.”

This more than anything is the root issue. Sony, Sharp, Panasonic, etc. had a large and vested interest in entertainment going on big and bigger screens, dedicated and specialized devices. Go watch this week's South Park.

Sony is suffering from the same problems that plagued Blockbuster.

For the past decade now Sony has been either chasing or ignoring Apple, more than anything. They did not realize a market for MP3s over CDs, because they had a major CD business to keep in track. Then they open their own store too late. Early concepts of the PSP would have been more of a smartphone with immense gaming and media capability, with a Sony Store. It never happened. Sony electronics has been pushing the livingroom and the high cost laptop while the rest of the industry is pushing tablets, mini PCs, and smartphones.

It is funny, because you can draw many parallels between the Japanese home electronics businesses and the American auto industry.

I think Sony's penchant for proprietary media and interfaces is another aspect of that "living room media hub" strategy that is a big problem when it comes to adoption of their devices. I have a Sony TV, and there are at least three data ports on it that are only compatible with other Sony devices. Their strategy in the recent past seems to have revolved around providing a high-end living room media device, and packing it full of proprietary systems that require you to purchase other devices also made by Sony. However in order to get there you need a level of brand loyalty that they haven't been able to count on in since the days of CRT TVs (and I think most companies can't count on anymore). Most people who are interested in multi-function capability would look at that TV and wonder why the heck they can't plug in their existing digital devices and move on over other more standardized platform. I got it dirt cheap and am barely interested in the connectivity aspects of the TV so I don't really care about that. However in that scenario, their strategy is still a failure, as I'm still not going to buy a digital camcorder or phone based on whether or not I can transfer the media to my TV.

Malor wrote:
You can stay in business making hardware, but only media is going to make a killing.

Media companies have a much higher margin (almost pure profit, once the good is created),

You apparently have a different definition of "making a killing", what I left of your quote is what I, and I think most others, mean by that phrase. While, "making a killing" also has the connotation of a great big pile of money, I was looking at it from the business's perspective.
Someone said it above, but Sony projected the decrease in demand incorrectly, and new and shiny hw can only remain new and shiny for so long before it becomes a commodity. So hardware business is characterized by boom and neutral if you're doing it right, boom and bust if you don't pay attention, and bust and bust if you really screw up.

MS making an XBox spec? Well, that will require some major creativity and a reason to do so, but there is precedent in Microsoft Surface tablets and the requirements for the arm-based Windows RT tablets(is that still the name?). "Here is how you make something that doesn't suck, now go forth and sell lots so we can sell licenses to our OS!"

I'm sure Sony is all over that...

Sony PS4 development financed by 100s of 1000s of secured charge cards to improve credit rating! You heard it here first!

tboon wrote:

Sony PS4 development financed by 100s of 1000s of secured charge cards to improve credit rating! You heard it here first!

Maybe that's their problem. Not thinking outside the box. If only they'd do something like go to Consumer Credit Counseling they might figure this out. Maybe a life coach.

GordonG wrote:

Nice post!