Preview of Neverwinter From Cryptic and PWE

fangblackbone wrote:

As far as Champions, it would be so awesome to get a revamp where the combat and the content are as tight as Neverwinter. Hopefully we wouldn't have to sacrifice the pick-what-you-want abilities. I would play that game in a heartbeat and for a long time.

I bought a Lifetime subscription to Champions before it came out simply because of my habit of constantly going back to City of Heroes/Villains. Then I bought the biggest baddest edition of Champions they offered. All told, I think I spent about $400 on that game. I've played it for maybe 3 months intermittently. I still have it installed, and I still go to the login screen and buy things with my free Zen, but I don't even play with these new things. And now that they implemented ridiculous vehicular combat using flying tanks... I fear that it will not even last long in that state on my machine.

But I agree with you - if they made the combat and content tighter and more structured, I think I'd go back to it. As it is, it's a giant sandbox for comic book nerds. Which on its own would be great - but it's not even good at being a giant sandbox. I would propose that Cryptic just creates a separate server with no quests, all PVP and randomly spawning super enemies. Then it might be fun to play.

I'm really glad Neverwinter doesn't appear to be falling in with Champions' mistakes. It really does seem like Cryptic has learned a lot in the years since Champions' release.

I'm really glad Neverwinter doesn't appear to be falling in with Champions' mistakes. It really does seem like Cryptic has learned a lot in the years since Champions' release.

I agree with this. It seems they really have learned from CO and STO. Because the second beta event build of Neverwinter seems more polished/finished than either CO or STO at launch.

I would propose that Cryptic just creates a separate server with no quests, all PVP and randomly spawning super enemies. Then it might be fun to play.

You know, they could do this and they would more than likely trounce Darkfall, and Mortal Online. (and perhaps even Archeage)

I've had a couple of days now to settle back after the beta weekend...and I realized that I enjoyed it.

For what it is, which is an action-style MMO, it gets the job done. I killed hundreds of monsters, levelled up a bunch of times, and painlessly grouped up with other players to...kill more monsters.

There's not a whiff of role-playing and the game is only vaguely reminiscent of D&D in any way, shape, or form. However, as a free-to-play romp where I can kill stuff with other folks and then kill stuff solo, it meets the minimum requirements for fun.

With those positives out of the way (and some may not consider them positives), Neverwinter has a long way to go before I'd consider it a really good use of my gaming time. Firstly, it ain't D&D, even if it has half-orcs and elves. Since I like D&D and am currently _really enjoying_ grouping up with folks in DDO here, I can't imagine why I'd really invest time in Neverwinter. The game, as far as I can tell has _no_ puzzles, _no_ skill challenges, _no_ role-playing encounters, and to get through any of the meager dialogue trees, I can just spam the '1' key with no repercussions.

DDO, on the other hand, has really wonky graphics, a terribly-optimized server architecture that causes the game to freeze and rubberband for minutes on end...and it has _puzzles_ to be solved! And traps that can kill you. And part of a quest chain that allows me to "bluff" my way out of paying an NPC for information. And water breathing, and feather fall...and summoning monsters. _That's_ D&D. Neverwinter Online is not.

Even as an action MMO, the game has a long way to go. There's almost no customization so far either within the class structure or cosmetically. Healing potions can be spammed essentially (every eight seconds as an insta-cast) and heal a lot more HP than a cleric can. There appears to be a single quest chain that runs throughout the game, and there's a single solitary starter zone, which means you'll be playing the same exact tutorial quests every single time you start a character.

Instead, you're meant to augment that meager quest total by running player-made content which will, of course, be of totally variable quality.

So, while the game was enjoyable for me- for what it was- the truth is that "what it was" was not much.

Spron wrote:

With those positives out of the way (and some may not consider them positives), Neverwinter has a long way to go before I'd consider it a really good use of my gaming time. Firstly, it ain't D&D, even if it has half-orcs and elves. Since I like D&D and am currently _really enjoying_ grouping up with folks in DDO here, I can't imagine why I'd really invest time in Neverwinter. The game, as far as I can tell has _no_ puzzles, _no_ skill challenges, _no_ role-playing encounters, and to get through any of the meager dialogue trees, I can just spam the '1' key with no repercussions.

[quot=Spron]DDO, on the other hand, has really wonky graphics, a terribly-optimized server architecture that causes the game to freeze and rubberband for minutes on end...and it has _puzzles_ to be solved! And traps that can kill you. And part of a quest chain that allows me to "bluff" my way out of paying an NPC for information. And water breathing, and feather fall...and summoning monsters. _That's_ D&D. Neverwinter Online is not.[/quote]

I agree with you on these facts 100%. However, it's important to remember that Neverwinter is based on D&D 4.0 rules, and DDO is based on D&D 3.x rules. The differences inherent in the video games are just as evident as the differences inherent in the pen and paper games. 4.0 is far less about roleplaying and puzzles, and far more action-oriented. But! I also think that Neverwinter could easily adapt the game to fit some more puzzle- and trap-themed gameplay. In fact, in my first Foundry game, I'm going to try to put absolutely no enemies at all in the map, but still make it deadly as hell. It'll be a rogue's wet dream, so maybe a big badass boss at the end, just to squish solo rogues.

Dagnabit! You stole my idea for my first Foundry project dubbed "(someone's) Prison of Horrors". It is going to be like Poe's the Pit and the Pendulum and riddled with traps and puzzles but no monsters. But I do have a unique story/premise and a twist at the very end.

But I do like the arcana, religion, dungeoneering and thievery skill/kit collectibles in the dungeons. Hopefully Cryptic or we can expand upon that.

Many of the dungeons have doors that are locked until conditions are met. (monsters killed, keys found) So I am sure we can expand upon this so that the trap centric dungeons aren't only for rogues or require a rogue.

I'm a little confused on the healing potions as well. I understand why they exist from a playability and marketing standpoint, but they also seem to undermine the combat. With as many camps as there are, and little penalty for death, they seem to mettle with any challenge.

cyrax wrote:

I'm a little confused on the healing potions as well. I understand why they exist from a playability and marketing standpoint, but they also seem to undermine the combat. With as many camps as there are, and little penalty for death, they seem to mettle with any challenge.

Supposedly the difficulty gets ramped up substantially after level 30. I suspect this is in counter to the addition of Feats and Paragon Paths that become available to players at that level. Also, the multi-player content is supposedly incredibly difficult. One Guardian Fighter in beta said that he took 750k damage in an hour within one of the instances. But in general, Cryptics MO for MMOs is to make single-player content easy enough to grind through quickly to get players to the endgame stuff. It's a shame that "endgame stuff" didn't exist in Champions or even STO until recently, but it looks like Cryptic is saving the best for Neverwinter.

Great to hear that. Although, I'd love to see a difficult option for missions. Dragon Nest, the only other MMO I feel that's done combat well, allowed for many difficulties in their instances.

cyrax wrote:

Great to hear that. Although, I'd love to see a difficult option for missions. Dragon Nest, the only other MMO I feel that's done combat well, allowed for many difficulties in their instances.

DDO did a really good job of this. When you completed a difficulty, it would unlock higher difficulties, which would usually result in a drastic increase in either level of the enemies or number of the enemies. And the traps increased in difficulty as well, thanks to D&D's scaling Encounter system. I would like to see Neverwinter do this as well.

namikaze wrote:

I agree with you on these facts 100%. However, it's important to remember that Neverwinter is based on D&D 4.0 rules, and DDO is based on D&D 3.x rules. The differences inherent in the video games are just as evident as the differences inherent in the pen and paper games. 4.0 is far less about roleplaying and puzzles, and far more action-oriented. But! I also think that Neverwinter could easily adapt the game to fit some more puzzle- and trap-themed gameplay. In fact, in my first Foundry game, I'm going to try to put absolutely no enemies at all in the map, but still make it deadly as hell. It'll be a rogue's wet dream, so maybe a big badass boss at the end, just to squish solo rogues. :P

And I imagine I'll be right there enjoying the module too...since for the grand total price of "free" the game is well worth it. I did, after all, enjoy the beta. While I can't see myself investing a lot of time in the game as it currently stands, it's absolutely worth levelling up a character.

I remember back when 4e came out that folks were saying it was the first edition of D&D that would translate into computer-ese well. It seems that they were right.

Logitech key give away.

Rainsmercy wrote:

Logitech key give away.

FYI everyone: the key is good only for Beta Weekend 3. The contest is good for the whole shebang though.

Great weapon fighter available for beta this weekend plus the level cap is increased to 50.

Woah! I just got an Email that I won a Founder's Pack! There was a contest on Facebook where if you clicked to get a key you got entered to win 1 of 5 packs. I never win crap like this so that's pretty awesome

I had the Guardian pack so dropped $60 on the game already. Kind of a bummer but not upset over it. I'm definitely excited over the spider mount, that thing is too cool!

Awesome! Congrats! if i were a definate in i'd offer to buy the guardian pack but i'm not sold yet.

DeThroned wrote:

Woah! I just got an Email that I won a Founder's Pack! There was a contest on Facebook where if you clicked to get a key you got entered to win 1 of 5 packs. I never win crap like this so that's pretty awesome

I had the Guardian pack so dropped $60 on the game already. Kind of a bummer but not upset over it. I'm definitely excited over the spider mount, that thing is too cool!

Badass! Congratulations!

So can't get the patch to download, after multiple tries and only getting 16mb downloaded of the almost 1gb, with nothing else running on the internet, just playing solitaire, no luck. Guess I'm not beta testing this weekend.

Rainsmercy wrote:

So can't get the patch to download, after multiple tries and only getting 16mb downloaded of the almost 1gb, with nothing else running on the internet, just playing solitaire, no luck. Guess I'm not beta testing this weekend.

i wouldnt worry too much i was crashing out every 5min when i finally did get it downloaded.

Finally got the patch after multiple tries, but now while in Neverwinter proper, I start going somewhere and after awhile it snaps me back to that same place and won't let me do anything else.

Rainsmercy wrote:

Finally got the patch after multiple tries, but now while in Neverwinter proper, I start going somewhere and after awhile it snaps me back to that same place and won't let me do anything else.

That may have been a result of the Crash the Server event that was going on when you made your post. The event was to try to get as many people onto the server at once to create a TON of load. Then the resulting data is going to hopefully help the devs out with load balancing. Also, as a reward for logging on during the event, you get a pirate hat when the game goes live. Woohoo, hats!

I was playing the cleric for the first time when they kicked everyone for server maintenance. Hoping I can get back in before I fall asleep, having been up since 10:30 PM last night

Yah, I have been having that happen since the previous weekend. At this point it is not playale for me. It happened again tonight and I can't interact with quest items or go into areas for quests.

I had my first experience with the game this weekend, mostly on Friday night (my time), and despite my apprehensions everything went very smoothly. Installing, patching, log-in and gameplay - no hitches, delays or bugs at all.
Playing a Tiefling Trickster Rogue, and while I enjoyed what I got to experience so far (got her to about level 7 or 8), the game seems VERY easy, almost too much to be able to hold my attention if it continues this way. There was virtually no challenge even on boss fights, I don't think I ever even reached the halfway point in health. Maybe it's just the particular class, or the fact that it's the early stages of the game, can anyone with more experience in the game attest to that?

Tamron wrote:

I had my first experience with the game this weekend, mostly on Friday night (my time), and despite my apprehensions everything went very smoothly. Installing, patching, log-in and gameplay - no hitches, delays or bugs at all.
Playing a Tiefling Trickster Rogue, and while I enjoyed what I got to experience so far (got her to about level 7 or 8), the game seems VERY easy, almost too much to be able to hold my attention if it continues this way. There was virtually no challenge even on boss fights, I don't think I ever even reached the halfway point in health. Maybe it's just the particular class, or the fact that it's the early stages of the game, can anyone with more experience in the game attest to that?

Once you get into the group-heavy content around level 30, the game ramps up the difficulty quite fast. All of the content intended for groups is very difficult. That's kind of Cryptic's style though: they want to make the game so that everyone can play and get to max level solo, but the group content is definitely always substantially harder. Also, it's worth noting that the enemies in many instances upgrade when you're in a group, even as low as level 5. A friend and I were playing through the early game stuff, and the enemies seemed to have more health and hit harder. It's still not hard, but it might require a little more coordination.

It is beautiful. The settings are awesome looking.

The character style is very similar to LOTRO. That part, I don't like. Something about it makes me think of clay, home made, stop motion figures. It's really rounded. Not sure if that makes sense.

It was too easy.
It felt a lot like LOTRO (as a guy who plays mostly solo).
I'm worried that it won't captivate me.

Player made content is interesting. I'd like to see some expose on that, how it works and how to leverage it.

Somehow the free to play thing in Fantasy settings doesn't work for me. It's just follow quest icon, left click a whole lot. Since it's so instance based, maybe finding some roleplayers will work out.

Right now my free to play time has to go to MWO. I know it's not an RPG, but swapping weapons and loadouts in MWO is more fun that the wrote MMO gear in Neverwinter, where you can't buy anything or use anything from the merchants. Everything is so level capped and soulbound that you're really just playing a moderated version of the same character all the way through. This is probably compounded by the seeming lack of freedom in the skill trees. I might have missed the opportunity to customize, but leveling was all auto, and just went based on your class specialization.

I hope MWO's model proves profitable, and it can be adapted to other FTPMMOs. I've never been so compelled to pay as in that game; while also feeling capable and well rewarded while playing for free.

Played a bit, ran a rogue with my other half as a cleric. Aggro is very odd, at least below level 10. I teleport behind my target, stab, leap into the air, kick him in the head, backflip out of range while leaving a decoy to draw fire. Then she fires off _one_ minor damage+healing if you attack that target spell, and instantly gets all the aggro from all the mobs in the combat. Entire packs would break off from me, half dead, and rush her.

Other than that, minor cosmetic oddities stood out. All the quest NPCs seemed to be staring above and to our right, as if addressing someone else.

Wasn't bad, but we aren't planning on picking it up, will have to see how it rolls out.

Played this a bit at PAX East and it was pretty fun. They had level 30 characters playing solo in a short mission. I started with a great-sword warrior, but the game crashed on me :O at the end boss. They moved me to a different station and I played through again, but as a sorcerer/wizard, which felt a bit more tactical. Overall I had fun with it, and got a t-shirt that's too small (the perils of playing on the last day of the con).