Wheel of Time Final Volume Chapter 1 Released To the Web

Malor wrote:

Oh, this is the exact same reason why I stopped reading A Song of Ice and Fire, because Robinson is just milking the series for cash, he's not trying to finish it anymore, or even particularly stay on track.

I think you mean G. R. R. Martin?

As for Wheel of Time, I stopped after Book 10. A momentous event happened in Book 9 and I was excited to see how everything turned upside down in 10. But there was nothing. If you thought nothing happened in book 8, you'd be astounded how even less happens in 10. So I decided I'd stop reading the series until it was completely finished.

Quintin_Stone wrote:
Malor wrote:

Oh, this is the exact same reason why I stopped reading A Song of Ice and Fire, because Robinson is just milking the series for cash, he's not trying to finish it anymore, or even particularly stay on track.

I think you mean G. R. R. Martin?

As for Wheel of Time, I stopped after Book 10. A momentous event happened in Book 9 and I was excited to see how everything turned upside down in 10. But there was nothing. If you thought nothing happened in book 8, you'd be astounded how even less happens in 10. So I decided I'd stop reading the series until it was completely finished.

Yeah, as much as I defend the series, I felt that the 10th book was pretty much garbage. They finally get around to covering the major, major event at the end of Winter's Heart in the 11th book, and the pace finally picks up again. One of my biggest fears with the Song of Ice and Fire is that Feast of Crows was horribly dull, like along the same lines of Crossroads of Twilight, but Dance with Dragons was nearly as pointless and meandering as its predecessor, where Knife of Dreams almost felt too rushed with so many plot points to move and only so many pages left. At the time, Robert Jordan felt that he was actually going to wrap up the series in two books - thankfully Sanderson was able to convince Tor that at least 2, and likely 3, books were needed.

I guess I'm an odd duck in that I didn't think "nothing happened" in Book 8. It lacked an anchor event at the end like the previous books had, but I recall thinking there were nice moments with the characters throughout. Then again, I was a teenager when I read it and really into the series, so I don't completely trust my judgement in hindsight.

Is book 8 the one with the SUPER awkward "love" scene with Rand and Elayne? My dear lord that was awkwardly written.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I guess I'm an odd duck in that I didn't think "nothing happened" in Book 8. It lacked an anchor event at the end like the previous books had, but I recall thinking there were nice moments with the characters throughout. Then again, I was a teenager when I read it and really into the series, so I don't completely trust my judgement in hindsight.

When I first read Path of Daggers (book 8), I was seriously disappointed because it left Mat, my favorite character, in an unknown state, after a fairly major WTF moment for him at the end of Crown of Swords (book 7) and I wanted to know what happened with him. I really didn't like it until I re-read it later on, in preparation for Winter's Heart; then it was quite good. Egwene finally was becoming the leader she should be, and was doing some good work with the Aes Sedai.

As with a lot of others, I got tired of the middle books where he just decided they were an exercise in how many balls he could juggle at once at the expense of actually advancing the plot. The worldbuilding was interesting though.

Atras wrote:
ClockworkHouse wrote:

I guess I'm an odd duck in that I didn't think "nothing happened" in Book 8. It lacked an anchor event at the end like the previous books had, but I recall thinking there were nice moments with the characters throughout. Then again, I was a teenager when I read it and really into the series, so I don't completely trust my judgement in hindsight.

When I first read Path of Daggers (book 8), I was seriously disappointed because it left Mat, my favorite character, in an unknown state, after a fairly major WTF moment for him at the end of Crown of Swords (book 7) and I wanted to know what happened with him. I really didn't like it until I re-read it later on, in preparation for Winter's Heart; then it was quite good. Egwene finally was becoming the leader she should be, and was doing some good work with the Aes Sedai.

I've suspected that the middle books are stronger when you're not waiting years for them and then more years to find out what happens next.

Growing up the son of booksellers, I was lucky enough to get an advanced reading copy of the Wheel of Time in the summer of 1989. To a 16 year old kid who had already outgrown Weis and Hickman, Eddings and the other pulp fantasy of the day, Jordan rekindled my love for the genre, and I dare say, paved the way for Martin, Erickson, Hobb and everyone else. Yes, the middle 4-5 books really bogged down, and Jordan should have had anyone other than his wife edit his books, but I still loved the world and spent way too much time on various WoT theory boards.

I can't wait until this winter to bring the tale to a close, and as much as I have enjoyed Sanderson's treatment of the world, I am also keenly looking forward to reading the conclusion, which has been evidently little touched from what Jordan wrote before his death.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I've suspected that the middle books are stronger when you're not waiting years for them and then more years to find out what happens next.

I agree, I found the series shortly after Knife of Dreams came out and managed to read everything up to it back to back. Perhaps it was just inertia but I didn't dislike any of them. Mind you Crossroads is still my least favorite.

Quintin_Stone wrote:

I think you mean G. R. R. Martin?

Yeah, I did, brain misfire, sorry.

One of Jordan's annoying habits was to draw out the story by bringing dead villains back from the dead. Rand "Two Steps Forward One Step Back" al'Thor.

I've seen some speculation that Jordan had this belief that if he finished the series, that he would die, that working on it would keep him alive, so that's why it just kept getting more and more complex, and things didn't stay resolved. If he never finished it, his illness wouldn't get him.

I have to say that I am looking forward to this so much. I have read most of the books multiple times (even the slow/mostly empty ones), and cannot wait to put the series to bed. Still, huge fan.

Quintin_Stone wrote:

One of Jordan's annoying habits was to draw out the story by bringing dead villains back from the dead. Rand "Two Steps Forward One Step Back" al'Thor.

Yeah, that was super annoying.

Malor wrote:

I've seen some speculation that Jordan had this belief that if he finished the series, that he would die, that working on it would keep him alive, so that's why it just kept getting more and more complex, and things didn't stay resolved. If he never finished it, his illness wouldn't get him.

So TWoT is the Winchester House of fantasy novels? That actually explains a lot.

Apparently some Walmart's are selling the book early. I checked my local Walmart and they had about 6 of them on the shelf.

Anyone else finish the book?

Found it... kind of straightforward, actually. I dunno. At this point I'm sort of just glad it's finished.

For those who need catching up before jumping into the final book, here's a decent recap of the first ten.

I just ordered the last one today on Amazon, for tuesday delivery. I am excited for resolution.

I finished it earlier this week. Pretty straightforward, but at least Sanderson tied up most of the strings that Jordan created. At this point, if I ever re-read the series, I would probably read the first five or six, and then skip to the Sanderson books.

It still feels like Jordan devoted entire books to characters just so that they could be name dropped in the Last Battle. Of course, at that point I don't even remember who characters like Tylee are.

They killed off Neo!

Just finished the book.

I agree I was having some issue remembering who the hell all the characters were.

I don't think I'd ever have been able to finish the series if it weren't for wikis. That little appendix at the back of each book just plain doesn't cut it after a while.

Spoiler:

I was sort of disappointed with the Rand vs. Dark One fight. I was sort of hoping for some kind of bizarre, out-of-left-field twist. Like the "Rand kills the Dark One, but Paidan Fain becomes the new Dark One for the next cycle" theory or something along those lines. Instead we got, "Papa Dark One's future was too evil. And Mama Rand's future was too good. But THIS future was JUST RIGHT!" Eh. It was fine, just... expected.

Oh well, could've been worse. Sanderson could have

Spoiler:

gone all author-insert fantasy, brought a new character with a magic pencil in to erase the Big Bad from existence at the last minute, and then informed Rand that all of his character development didn't count and he was being held back a grade in Protagonist School because he was too much of a jerk five books ago.

(Dark Tower spoilers)

The series has a lot of great characters that could merrit their own book or series:

the gleeman Thom Merrilin, Suiane Sanche and her lieutenant, Perryn, Egwene, Nynaeve and Lan, the head of the black tower with all the male magic users, Matt, Avienda and her people (Berelain and others)

Hell, I'd love to read a story about Tam al Thor and his sidekick from the beginning of the first book. Or a history of Menetheren (sp?) the town Rand, Matt, Egwene, Nynaeve and Perryn grew up in. That has got to be chock full of interesting bits with all those power brokers being born there and the allusions from Moiraine.

Speaking of which, a Moiraine coming of age story and the history of the Amyrlin seats would be great. The initial corruption of the Forsaken would be a terrific read. It is all just stuff that gets briefly touched on that needs fleshing out.

The only prominent characters that I'm not really interested in are Elayne and the Children of the Light guys. Elayne's mother had way less pages but was way more interesting.

Oh, oh, oh... the ogiers and telanriod... Like I said, I can go all day. Jordan was a mile wide and an inch deep on a lot of this stuff. I think the Cheshire Cat was his editor during the late-middle books.

fangblackbone wrote:

Speaking of which, a Moiraine coming of age story... would be great.

That's pretty much what the New Spring prequel novel was.

What the hell happened with the pipe at the end of the book?

Spoiler:

Is it Rand now can influence the pattern directly? Or does he just have a magic pipe?

Nosferatu wrote:

What the hell happened with the pipe at the end of the book?

Spoiler:

Is it Rand now can influence the pattern directly? Or does he just have a magic pipe?

The former, as far as I can see.

Spoiler:

He did not light the pipe. That's impossible. Instead, he only realized the truth. That there is no pipe.

Have a cookie. It'll make you feel right as rain.

Count me in the solid if not spectacular ending camp.

Spoiler:

Can't help but think that Sanderson is a big Portal fan, the One Power really became thinking with portals towards the end there.

I think I saw mention in one of the TOR weekly e-mails that Harriet and the powers that be are already contemplating spin offs.

It will be interesting to see if we ever get a film/tv treatment of the series or another video game.

Badferret wrote:
Spoiler:

Can't help but think that Sanderson is a big Portal fan, the One Power really became thinking with portals towards the end there.

That bothered the nitpicking part of my brain a little, actually.

Spoiler:

All the creative uses for Gateways were neat, but back when they were introduced they were this major weave that not everybody was strong enough to produce at all, let alone hold open for seemingly hours on end to give a general a birds-eye view of a battle. And then by the end everyone and her little sister were popping them off like they were nothing. Channelers are a finite resource, they get fatigued and need rest. You'd think that it would be more efficient to just chuck a fireball than open up a Gateway in front of an underground dragon cannon.

Most disappointing prophecy:

Spoiler:

Alivia will help you die turns into Alivia will pack your bags and put some clothes out on the bed for you. Seriously?

Hbi2k,
[spoiler] remember that pretty much everyone of any note was running around with angreal at the last battle, and beyond that must if the people that couldn't do the weave weren't on the front lines. Also I get three feeling that the Seachan had tons of Channelers in their ranks, and they were used to using the one power to it maximum, which the aes sedai actively refrained from using it. I suspect they all got stronger in the last few years through usage.