Arkane's Dishonored

Malor wrote:

Well, I finished, 22 hours. Mostly stealth. I guess I must have killed someone along the way, because I didn't get the Clean Hands achievement, but I got the one for 'less than ten'. As far as I'm concerned, this was a bloody home run. I have one major criticism about the ending, but it's not a game-wrecker.

This game is wildly better than the new Deus Ex, which was very good. It's better than either Bioshock, but I think it probably doesn't quite hold up to the original Deus Ex. It's certainly a lot shorter.

This is Arkane's best, by miles. I wouldn't have minded it being a little longer, but every minute was interesting. No fluff or filler. Quality throughout. The world-building was unlike anything I've ever seen in game fiction. Not even Thief was that good.

This may not be the best first-person game ever done, but it's in the top three.

Criticism on the ending:

Spoiler:

They never dealt with the creation of the Heart! A horrific crime was committed there, and you should have been able to confront the Outsider in some way about it. Just leaving that unresolved .... wow, what a huge ball to drop.

Still, it beats Human Revolution's Choose Your Own Adventure ending by lightyears.

Its certainly better than both bioshock games in terms of gameplay, but for me at least a game needs to have a good plot and not just great world building and gameplay (although that certainly helps). Right before dishonored came out I played through most of minervas den and bioshock 2 at the very least still holds up in the gameplay department and the plot is much better, and the world building in the bioshock games is still some of the best out there. (Although you could definitely make a case for Dishonoreds being better) I will say that if Arkane gets the story right in the next game it could be far and away better than anything I've ever seen(Except Final Fantasy Tactics but only because I was nine when I first played it ;)). For right now though its a strong contender for game of the year, and I really liked Mass Effect 3.

Draco wrote:

What's the game saying when you go into Dark Vision? Sounds like.... "chaos dies"?

I assumed it's gargled "enhanced eyes".

bnpederson wrote:
Draco wrote:

What's the game saying when you go into Dark Vision? Sounds like.... "chaos dies"?

I assumed it's gargled "enhanced eyes".

I didn't think it was anything audible; I just think of it as "ambiguous creepy magic voice".

Finished and clocked in at 14 hours.

I enjoyed the game, but I didn't have many "wow" moments. I expect that's because I didn't do much of the extra stuff (collectibles, shrines, non-lethal alternatives) and also because I relied almost exclusively on two powers: Dark Vision and teleport. I think a second play-through with different powers would make me appreciate the level design even more.

I found the AI disappointing whenever I wasn't stealthy enough -- they'd just bum rush you and if you were in a tight corridor, you could just shoot everybody, fish-in-a-barrel style. Reminded me of the Hitman games in that way.

The powers are pretty cool. I liked the possession one a lot, but I almost felt bad making dudes walk themselves into a dark corner where they'd meet their fate. Almost. I also didn't get to use it much as I acquired it late in the game.

Any of you try out the other powers? Any recommendations?

ebarstad wrote:

Finished and clocked in at 14 hours.

I enjoyed the game, but I didn't have many "wow" moments. I expect that's because I didn't do much of the extra stuff (collectibles, shrines, non-lethal alternatives) and also because I relied almost exclusively on two powers: Dark Vision and teleport. I think a second play-through with different powers would make me appreciate the level design even more.

I found the AI disappointing whenever I wasn't stealthy enough -- they'd just bum rush you and if you were in a tight corridor, you could just shoot everybody, fish-in-a-barrel style. Reminded me of the Hitman games in that way.

The powers are pretty cool. I liked the possession one a lot, but I almost felt bad making dudes walk themselves into a dark corner where they'd meet their fate. Almost. I also didn't get to use it much as I acquired it late in the game.

Any of you try out the other powers? Any recommendations?

A stealthy, non-lethal approach with ample time taken to explore the world, the expository writing and dialogue, and hidden items/loot is precisely the type of game I'm playing and highly recommend. It reminds me strongly of Bioshock in that you could critical-path your way through the game with brute force and miss a big part of what makes the game great: the world itself.

As for powers, Blink and Dark Vision (both upgraded) are my two go-to powers and pretty useful for the style of play I mentioned above. Possession and Bend Time - while awesome - I've only found to be situationally useful, but depending on your play-style, could totally work as primary skills. Try taking one or two active powers and focusing the rest of your rune investment into passives (if you're playing thoroughly enough, you'll find plenty of runes and bone charms to use) and weapon upgrades. If you want to do a strictly non-lethal approach, focus your weapon upgrades on your crossbow and keep an ample stock of sleep darts handy. For a real challenge, forgo Dark Vision and turn up the difficulty. Exploring the world without being able to track enemy movements, cones of vision, and item locations really takes it up a level.

Draco wrote:

What's the game saying when you go into Dark Vision? Sounds like.... "chaos dies"?

In my internal narrative, it's saying "kill some guys!" And on my current violent playthrough, I reply "will do!"

Bottle wrote:
Draco wrote:

What's the game saying when you go into Dark Vision? Sounds like.... "chaos dies"?

In my internal narrative, it's saying "kill some guys!" And on my current violent playthrough, I reply "will do!"

I sort of heard "Eat Pie", which seems like pretty good advice regardless of what's happening with the rat/person possessed.

I've been having lots of fun just killing everyone I come across, and mostly following the path. I still like to explore and get the items around the level, but I'm actively skipping the side quests unless they're in my way. I'm also discarding the lore, which hurts my soul, but helps my playtime. I'm saving a pure, complete play-through the second time around, if and when I have the time.

I'm also surprised that Acrobatics hasn't been brought up more. It's absolutely my favorite power, and I feel the game's actually lacking without something that kinetic. While the enhanced sprint in lvl 2 isn't much of an upgrade, it feels much more natural than the standard sprint, which may have been toned for the stealth mechanics the game has to balance. I spend just as much time trying to scale the level as I do making progress, or being in combat.

I'm on the first mission with walkers, and my only complaint would be the limited story I've experienced, outside of pages of course. I'd love more story building, as everything else they've built is so goddamn good.

Nicholaas wrote:
bnpederson wrote:
Draco wrote:

What's the game saying when you go into Dark Vision? Sounds like.... "chaos dies"?

I assumed it's gargled "enhanced eyes".

I didn't think it was anything audible; I just think of it as "ambiguous creepy magic voice".

I thought it was "Oh Yes!" But that seems kind of silly.

Question for you folks killing and blowing things up: Do guards re-spawn on you a lot and come after you in pursuit? It seems like if I kill even 1 person in a level, there will always be some new guys out looking for me whenever I move back through that area.

It feels cheap that there is absolutely no one else around when I stash a body, and yet if I backtrack through that area and hadn't hid the body "well enough," the game will spawn guys to punish me. At least I think they spawn.

Is that what is actually happening or have I just been unlucky? It's my only mechanism complaint, but I haven't explored it much because I do my best not to run into that situation.

Edit: Also, it is saying "enhanced eyes." Reminds me a lot of Crysis, actually.

EDIT: I realised that I hadn't understood how mana worked. Although I saw it dissapear in single chunks, I assumed that the longer a spell lasted the more mana it took. But with single blocks, you can have multiple spells running each with its own mana allocation. You just have to keep topping it up. (Which is the difficulty, since it's too expensive and not commone enough.)

Just had something odd happen, never noticed it before. I cast slow time. Then, and I'm not sure of the exact order, I went into the radial menu to drink a mana potion and readied the wind spell on my dpad.

Here's the bit I never noticed

Although slow time was continuing, the wind spell was ready to use and the mana bar wasn't going down. It was like slow time was either running on an unseen mana gauge, or it swapped to some kind of non-mana cooldown.

Somewhere in this I'd jumped from a roof onto a tall boy and attached a razor mine to it, then it exploded. But the more interesting thing is the mana.

Someone may have discovered the body and called reinforcements. I kill everyone, so I haven't had the time to observe AI behavior outside of their initial alert to the player being spotted. Last mission I did, some enemies did appear after I completed the objective, but I think that was a scripted challenge.

I view it as reinforcements. And it doesn't seem to happen too often. I made the Backyard area a ghost town. No one ever respawned there.

Blink + Dark Vision are my primaries as well. I may have messed up as I tossed a rune into acrobat and vitality and bend time; I may wish I had those runes back at some point.

But stabbity + crossbow works pretty darn well on their own.

Agility 2 + boot stealth 2 = Sprinting ninja. Rushing into someone and stabbing them in the back is pure awesome.

Malor wrote:

Well, I finished, 22 hours. Mostly stealth. I guess I must have killed someone along the way, because I didn't get the Clean Hands achievement, but I got the one for 'less than ten'.

Just FYI, I think I figured out where I screwed up and possibly other people too: Remember the opening sequence, when you're supposed to defend the Empress? Yeah, killing people there means you can't get the Clean Hands achievement. You have to just constantly defend.

I'd be willing to bet that's where a lot of us screwed it up, not even thinking it counted since it was so obviously a tutorial.

This guy apparently has the answer to the Clean Hands problem: http://www.trueachievements.com/view...

bnpederson wrote:
Malor wrote:

Well, I finished, 22 hours. Mostly stealth. I guess I must have killed someone along the way, because I didn't get the Clean Hands achievement, but I got the one for 'less than ten'.

Just FYI, I think I figured out where I screwed up and possibly other people too: Remember the opening sequence, when you're supposed to defend the Empress? Yeah, killing people there means you can't get the Clean Hands achievement. You have to just constantly defend.

I'd be willing to bet that's where a lot of us screwed it up, not even thinking it counted since it was so obviously a tutorial.

Huh, I was already considering restarting to get Ghost on mission 1, and this might seal the deal.

EDIT: Only took an hour to get back to where I was before, and I got Ghost this time. Still only 766/1000 coins though, I must be missing an entire hidden area or a bunch of guards to pick pocket.

Eh, I usually end with 500/1000 in the prison break, it isn't that big a deal. You can just wander around the main hub and get another 400 or so, plus other missions give such absurd amounts more, like 2000 or 4000 easily, that I never worried about missing a bit.

Plus if you're going no-kill the whole way you won't need over half the upgrades. You'll never need to bother with the sword, pistol, grenade, bolt capacity (doesn't increase your sleep bolts), or spike trap upgrades. That usually left me with plenty of cash to play around with.

So I'm up to the masquerade level, and as a huge Looking Glass fan, and a Thief fan in particular, this is basically my reaction:

Making my way across Dunwall reminds so much of exploring the City in Thief, in that you're traversing what feels like a real space where people live instead of preplanned routes. I really liked Human Revolution, but there you're constantly aware you're picking between route A, B or C, to the point that you're awarded xp for finding them. Here, it feels like I'm discovering stuff organically based on the interplay between my abilities and the environment. And it's glorious.

I'm still early in the game and finally had some time to play this weekend. I don't know if anyone else has had to mess with it, but this is the only game that opted to use on board graphics instead of my GPU (GTX 555). I've only had this issue with this game and think it might be because of using the HDMI port that's available on my motherboard and not the mini on my GPU (have my system hooked to the TV and using Steam Big Picture, loving it!). At first I didn't know what the deal was, only that the intro to this game looked down right ugly and I was super confused. I had heard some people say that they didn't like the graphics in this game, since it's a little painterly, but yeah, I thought it was me for the intro level and the tutorial. After messing around with my system, found out it auto-selected intergrated graphics over GPU and then felt relieved. Played first hour over again and was happy to look at a very beautiful game. As for the game, man is it good! I'm so glad between this and XCOM, we finally have some old school/interesting and strategic games on market. And big budget! Hard to split my time between them both!

Saw this on Redbox for the PS3 and grabbed it on a whim. Very nice-looking game, enjoyed the first couple of levels. Considering it's a rental I'm most likely just going to blow through with the chaos meter firmly in the red. I don't have the patience to figure out patrols and corners well enough to avoid being spotted.

Started a second play-through, choosing some different powers (Agility and Slow Time, to start with). Slow time is great, especially if you're outnumbered or need to do multiple tasks in very quick succession.

I've also discovered some new paths, side quests, an am trying the non-lethal approach wrt main targets. While it's not a whole new game, there's certainly enough content here to justify a second run through.

I also just figured out where I made a mistake in the mission I just finished -- how does replaying a mission affect your consequences later in the game if you do something differently?

Malor, you have no idea how you are testing my resolve to wait for this until Black Friday. This game sounds incredible.

post first-mission, home-base rune/charm question/hint request:

Spoiler:

When exiting the back of Piero's workshop, and walking toward the charming Blood from the Eyes! writing on the wall of the building behind the shop, I heard the heart make a thump. Equipping it, I noticed that two runes/charms appear to be underneath the building/rocks. I've gone up high, I've gone low and looked for holes/caves/etc., but as of yet I haven't found a way to get to them.

Puce Moose wrote:

post first-mission, home-base rune/charm question/hint request:

Just keep playing the story, Puce.

I love games that let you screw with the AI

Spoiler:

In the second mission I decided to terrorize the two women in the brothel's washroom. I snuck to the door, then ran inside and knocked over a bowl while jumping on the table. They went shrieking away and a guard showed up about thirty seconds later. I was merciful and choked him out.

God I'm weak, all the allusion to deus ex, hitman and everything else got me to buy the game. Decent price at least, only 38$ will the discount and store credit. It's nice to have disposable income.

bnpederson wrote:

...bolt capacity (doesn't increase your sleep bolts)...

It doesn't? So your max sleep bolts is always 10? Damn, that's 300 coin I could have put towards more rewiring tools.

The upgrade says it increases the amount of standard bolts. Not seen one for tranqs and incideniary yet.

You should be able to reply levels with all the unlocks available, but none allocated. That way you can choose how powerful you want to be. That way NG+ won't break the game, people making themselves too powerful on a replay will.

You sure love breaking format, stevenmack.