Coffee Catch-All

Local roasters are usually better for buying the freshest beans, too. Many local roasters will out a roasted on date on the bag to let you know how old they are. French roasts are typically 'well done' beans and tend to lack the oils in more mild roasts that create better flavors.

I don't think coffee would be as fun without always striving for a better cup. That's just me, though.

ZaneRockfist wrote:
trichy wrote:

I am loving the process of exploring coffee and the different methods, but I feel like there's no end to this process. I just want a decent cup of coffee, but there's a part of me that keeps wondering if I'm missing a mouthful of liquid angel tears if I don't drop a pretty penny on the nuclear-powered ceramic polished crossbar grinder and the vacuum-drip pulse brewer with Thermawiggle technology.

It is a pretty elusive beast. You think once you get an Aeropress or whatever, it is over with, but it really has only just begun. Coffee making is an art and there are many disciplines.

Anyone here have experience with Moka pots? How do they compare to brews made with an Aeropress?

I have lots of experience with a Moka pot, but I have never tasted what comes out of an Aeropress, so I'm no help there.

momgamer wrote:

I have lots of experience with a Moka pot, but I have never tasted what comes out of an Aeropress, so I'm no help there.

Thoughts on it?

B Dog wrote:
tuffalobuffalo wrote:

Yeah, that's it. I remember it being cheaper for some reason. :)

Thanks. That one is on my radar now, as well. I like the sound of the glass container, since I'm reading that static electricity is an issue with some of the grinders in terms of coffee grounds ending up everywhere.

That's the one I have, the Bodum burr grinder, and it's great for everyday use. And yeah, it was cheaper, it was $84 back in June:(

I remain convinced that you won't improve much on a French press with a simple blade grinder -- you just need a few pulses, enough to break the beans into small chunks, not actually powder, so you don't need anything expensive, certainly not a burr grinder. It's a cheap setup, costs almost nothing to use, and makes wonderful coffee.

The more expensive stuff may improve it a little, but I think you're getting into audiophile territory there. (ie, there's very little, if any, REAL improvement, but people detect improvement because they spent more money on it.)

The temperature-controlled brewing systems would probably be genuinely better, not just placebo, but those are expensive as hell.

Quintin_Stone wrote:

My Bialetti Moka 6-Cup Espresso Maker arrived and this thing is tiny! I was expecting something a bit bigger for 6 cups, even if its 6 espresso "cups" (I guess a single espresso shot is 1 oz, right?). I can only fit 2 scoops of grounds in the reservoir, as it advises against tamping.

Yeah, it's small, but I love my Bialetti. It does not need to be large to make good coffee of the thick, black & oily type you get anywhere along the Mediterranean coast. Sometimes I want a more subtle cup of coffee, but other times there is nothing better than a strong, gritty coffee like the kind you get from it.

Well, you can proffer ABX testing results or you can move to self-righteous accusations of snake oil. I suppose both are equally valid choices.

Personally, I messed with weird instant coffees as a late teen, bought a cheap steam-pressured "espresso" machine as a post-teen, then moved into several years as a barista in quality-driven coffee houses. I can appreciate a good cup of coffee and I don't have any wooden volume knobs or pyramid sonic isolators. A simple visual comparison of the results between an impulse blade grinder and a decent burr grinder will show the difference.

[Edit] Dammit, this is my frarkin frogohs. I don't make incomprehensible drunken posts, I just take bait I typically don't bother with.

Malor wrote:

I remain convinced that you won't improve much on a French press with a simple blade grinder -- you just need a few pulses, enough to break the beans into small chunks, not actually powder, so you don't need anything expensive, certainly not a burr grinder. It's a cheap setup, costs almost nothing to use, and makes wonderful coffee.

The more expensive stuff may improve it a little, but I think you're getting into audiophile territory there. (ie, there's very little, if any, REAL improvement, but people detect improvement because they spent more money on it.)

The temperature-controlled brewing systems would probably be genuinely better, not just placebo, but those are expensive as hell.

Heheh... I disagree with a lot of this but will post actual thoughts at a later date when I don't have to be on my phone.

A simple visual comparison of the results between an impulse blade grinder and a decent burr grinder will show the difference

Right, but in a French press, it doesn't matter. The beans steep long enough that it all works out. They basically just need to be shattered, not ground, and you get fantastic coffee.

When the water's making a single pass over the coffee, uniform surface area would be more important, but when the beans are actually soaking in the water for a few minutes, the quality of the grind doesn't seem to matter much at all.

Except that the finer grinds are going to end up over-extracted and extra tannins will be brought out making it uncharacteristicly bitter whereas the coarser bits will be inefficiently underextracted. Plus you end up with extra sludge in the press from those fine dust bits.

LiquidMantis wrote:

Except that the finer grinds are going to end up over-extracted and extra tannins will be brought out making it uncharacteristicly bitter whereas the coarser bits will be inefficiently underextracted. Plus you end up with extra sludge in the press from those fine dust bits.

Yup.

I'm going to vacuum pot tomorrow. I'll take some pictures and post some thoughts. I will take a lot of pictures of the Bodum Grinder and how even the grind is.

The blade generates more heat, which can affect the grounds negatively. I wasn't convinced til i got a burr grinder, and started using the blade grinder in comparison. Definite difference.

tuffalobuffalo wrote:
Malor wrote:

I remain convinced that you won't improve much on a French press with a simple blade grinder -- you just need a few pulses, enough to break the beans into small chunks, not actually powder, so you don't need anything expensive, certainly not a burr grinder. It's a cheap setup, costs almost nothing to use, and makes wonderful coffee.

The more expensive stuff may improve it a little, but I think you're getting into audiophile territory there. (ie, there's very little, if any, REAL improvement, but people detect improvement because they spent more money on it.)

The temperature-controlled brewing systems would probably be genuinely better, not just placebo, but those are expensive as hell.

Heheh... I disagree with a lot of this but will post actual thoughts at a later date when I don't have to be on my phone. :)

I also disagree, I went to my parents for a week and brought some fresh beans home with me and figured I would use there blade grinder for the week as I didnt feel like pre grinding at home or bringing the grinder. BAD idea. SO hard to get a consistent grind. The flavor remains locked in the sliced beans (opposed to crushed), each pot I made didnt match the last... anyway, a bur grinder (even the cheapest one can find) is a real improvement over a blade grinder. You might not notice the upgrade, but try it for a month or so and then go back to your blade grinder and you will be convinced.

So not helping...

trichy wrote:

So not helping...

In the end, it's personal preference. If you like french pressed coffee from grinds in a $20 grinder (like a currently have) then that is perfectly fine. In my opinion you have already made the largest jump in quality by switching to french press or aero press coffee over drip coffee. I just bough a cheap french press last night because it was $10 on clearance, because why not, it's ten dollars!

trichy wrote:

So not helping...

*What jonfen said*

So, I woke up early this Saturday and busted out the vacuum pot while listening to some Bill Callahan (best morning music ever). Here are some images showing how well the Bodum grinder works.

Notice the clean counter! I should also mention that the Bodum grinder is very quiet. You don't have to wince if there are people sleeping.

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/8Sv8n.jpg)

The rubber lid actually attracts coffee flakes via static electricity. This is actually pretty nice because it keeps the counter clean. The grounds are nice and even.

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/5fXCY.jpg)

Here's what it's supposed to taste like. It did actually seem to taste a bit like Apricot and nougat, but that could just be my imagination after reading it.

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/EGgdP.jpg)

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/53C1c.jpg)

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/4CZ5x.jpg)

Cup!

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/aRa5e.jpg)

Thanks for the photos, looks awesome. You've got me sold on the Bodum Bistro, but I'm trying to figure out why it jumped in price from $85 to $120 about 8 months ago. Not sure if they upgraded the model or simply decided it was priced too competitively, but it's definitely more expensive now.

How does that vacuum pot coffee compare to your other coffee experiences?

On the -phile/snob issue; I currently use either French Press or Moka pot depending on mood but I'm not sure I could objectively tell the difference between the two under a blind taste test, now I'll have to do some experimenting and find out - for science!

krev82 wrote:

How does that vacuum pot coffee compare to your other coffee experiences?

On the -phile/snob issue; I currently use either French Press or Moka pot depending on mood but I'm not sure I could objectively tell the difference between the two under a blind taste test, now I'll have to do some experimenting and find out - for science!

With a vacuum pot you get a much thinner coffee compared to french press, but you still get all of the great flavors because the coffee grounds can move around and they aren't exposed to water for more than 5 minutes. It's probably similar to what you would get with an aeropress (haven't tried an aeropress). The consistency is very similar to a pour over but it doesn't have the bitterness that a pour over has.

Mostly, vacuum pots are fun.

jonfentyler wrote:

In the end, it's personal preference. If you like french pressed coffee from grinds in a $20 grinder (like a currently have) then that is perfectly fine. In my opinion you have already made the largest jump in quality by switching to french press or aero press coffee over drip coffee. I just bough a cheap french press last night because it was $10 on clearance, because why not, it's ten dollars!

A blade grinder and a French press make great coffee. Way better than anything I've ever gotten in a store. I don't serve coffee very often, but people almost always go 'wow!' when I do.

jonfentyler wrote:
trichy wrote:

So not helping...

In the end, it's personal preference. If you like french pressed coffee from grinds in a $20 grinder (like a currently have) then that is perfectly fine. In my opinion you have already made the largest jump in quality by switching to french press or aero press coffee over drip coffee. I just bough a cheap french press last night because it was $10 on clearance, because why not, it's ten dollars!

agreed about the french press, but I still have to defend drip!

IMAGE(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7118/7826950028_0262b0f6db_z.jpg)
2012-08-20 04.52.16 by Daniel MacGibbon, on Flickr

You can get yourself a really good cup of coffee with a pour over. Although I like the earthy, steeped taste of a french press, I also like the light airy flavor of a good pour over.

ZaneRockfist wrote:

Anyone here have experience with Moka pots? How do they compare to brews made with an Aeropress?

I'm still trying to learn my Moka. There is a flavor difference even to my unrefined palette. The aeropress is faster, easier to use, and easier to clean, but less suitable for making large batches (assuming you get a large moka pot).

Malor wrote:

A blade grinder and a French press make great coffee. Way better than anything I've ever gotten in a store. I don't serve coffee very often, but people almost always go 'wow!' when I do.

This is definitely true.

I wouldn't go so far as to call the difference between blade grinder / French press coffee versus "superior" methods a placebo effect, but I WOULD say that I think that's a pretty clear point of diminishing returns, at least as far as brewing methods go. At that point, you're better off looking to the quality and especially freshness of your bean to try to get improvements in flavor, unless you're already using very good beans roasted within two weeks of brewing.

A blade grinder is terrible if you're doing a large quantity of beans. You'll often get beans broken only into a couple of pieces on the top, and as someone who once made coffee after forgetting to grind, big pieces equals weak coffee. A blade grinder also can't control the size of your grounds, which matters when you're making coffee/espresso with some metal filters. Unless you like grounds in your coffee, which I don't.

That said, I think a blade grinder is fine if you're not grinding a lot of beans at once and you're using a paper filter or metal filter with a tight pores.

ZaneRockfist wrote:
momgamer wrote:

I have lots of experience with a Moka pot, but I have never tasted what comes out of an Aeropress, so I'm no help there.

Thoughts on it?

I love it. I've had mine for over 10 years, and it will perform with just about anything you run through it. I actually got something suitable for a latte with Folgers once, in a pinch. On weekday mornings I generally run a pot of a couple favorite Starbucks blends, and then drink drip the rest of the day. On weekends/special occasions I run a Kona a friend sends me from Hawaii that's so smooth I don't even add hot water - just savor it straight.

I drink too much coffee.

So I finally ordered a Vietnamese espresso while getting some pho last night. My goodness, if I owned an espresso maker I'd have given myself diabetes within the week.

Kraint wrote:

So I finally ordered a Vietnamese espresso while getting some pho last night. My goodness, if I owned an espresso maker I'd have given myself diabetes within the week.

I think I've had this before, but it's been awhile. Does it also have lots of cream or is it mostly just lots of sugar?