JO Respawn Server Setting

OK, to be open, last night I was on the losing team most of the night. Actually, it may have been the losing team because of me, but that is not the point. The reason I disclose that is so I won't be accused of not liking the settings because we lost.

OK that out of the way, my point is this: Last night, once the rebels had gotten ensconced in an objective, we could not blow them out of it for love nor money. I believe this was because the spawn settings allowed rebels not healed by medics to get back to the fight too quickly.

As you all no doubt know, the basic principle of modern infantry combat is to gain local fire supremacy - suppress with one squad and maneuver with another unit to attack. Without suppression, the moving units will usually get caught away from cover and mowed down. Without threat of "death" (i.e. a longer spawn time) defenders are more likely to brave incoming fire and stay in the open to shoot attackers, knowing they can spawn back in quickly.

This also means is that medics have much less worth (i.e keeping guys at the front alive) as guys can just respawn quickly and get back into the fight.

As I elluded to, I am sure the rebs had a number of guys at the objectives healed by medics and go back into the fight immediately, that is good, it makes sense and that is the way it should be. Its just that when you needn't wait for a medic to get back into the fray quickly that the gameplay suffers.

I'd like to see the spawn times increased, so that an attacking team, if it can eliminate medics in an objective area, has an opportunity to kill defenders and move in before the waves of just respawned reinforcements flood back into the objective.

I know no one likes to sit out of the fight while playing a game, but I think the increased strategies having to fight smarter would bring about would outwheigh the negative aspects.

So that's my thought on the matter. Maybe another 10 seconds? Try it and see if it works?

I think medics are to valuable already which is why half the team is usually medics. Most maps it takes quite abit of effort to get back to the fight if you have to respawn. A longer spawn time would probably make more people want to be medics. The real trick is getting Zed on your team to coordinate the fireteam.

I usually play a medic, but last night I changed over to a rifleman to see how it went. Getting the M203 really is a bonus. Half my kills on that ruins map came from lobbing the the M203 grenades into the middle of a couple of guys. Anything that promotes more riflemen (on my team) I would be all for.

OK that out of the way, my point is this: Last night, once the rebels had gotten ensconced in an objective, we could not blow them out of it for love nor money. I believe this was because the spawn settings allowed rebels not healed by medics to get back to the fight too quickly.

On the TKOTH maps, you have the exact same spawn rules as we did. No one to blame but yourselves there. On the AAS map, that whole thing just kind of broke down into chaos. I''d rather take out the sniper class than limit spawn times. Perhaps we should just stick to TKOTH? That''s where I thought that we had the best time.

"Minase" wrote:
OK that out of the way, my point is this: Last night, once the rebels had gotten ensconced in an objective, we could not blow them out of it for love nor money. I believe this was because the spawn settings allowed rebels not healed by medics to get back to the fight too quickly.

On the TKOTH maps, you have the exact same spawn rules as we did. No one to blame but yourselves there. On the AAS map, that whole thing just kind of broke down into chaos. I''d rather take out the sniper class than limit spawn times. Perhaps we should just stick to TKOTH? That''s where I thought that we had the best time.

Argh. I didn''t mean to imply any unfairness as far as the times went, Minase. I had hoped to head that off with the disclaimer.
Overall, your team''s better coordination was no doubt a factor, especially in getting a large force into the objective initially. That isn''t the point I had brought up though. As far as the chaos, I agree - and I think it helps my argument. Easy to spawn/run/shoot/die/respawn/repeat when the spawn time is low, and this adds to the chaotic feel.

Spawn time used to be 5 seconds by default which meant if I assaulted a PSP the guy I just killed would spawn behind me right away, it sucked. We moved to 10 seconds to alleviate that a bit but I agree with Swampy, it''s still not enough. My recommendation to keep things moving and keep them interesting would be increase the spawn time to 20 seconds (it seems like a long time, but it''s not) and reduce the amount of time it takes to capture a PSP. I would honestly rather see more assault maps flat out ""won"" than the sort of ""capture the first contested spawn and hold it"" victory we saw last night. Again, this has nothing to do with getting our ass kicked.

Perhaps we should just stick to TKOTH? That''s where I thought that we had the best time.

If anything I might alternate TKOTH maps and Assault maps next time, I enjoy the variety.

Argh I don''t want to give away too many strategies but they are pretty obvious so I will let them out.:) The example I will use is AAS from last night.

As long as the objective is completely capture and you have more people there you can spawn; therefore the trick is to just get them to have less people there and then you push them back to the previous spawn.

When we took C last night, I shouted like a madman for everyone to stay there, not to leave, and defend it. Its very very hard to take a spawn point if it is heavily defended and that is the way it should be in my opinion, you get rewarded for working together. Now on to how we took B.

Grrr I hate to say this but its basically because you guys were trying to push too hard. I basically asked that the team hold back and not even go into B until they were absolutely sure they would prevent you from spawning there. As an example mateo and I rushed it once we saw there was only one guy there. Immediately without killing anyone, B has become useless to the other team. At that point we move as many guys as possible from C to B which makes C be vulnerable, but we stack enough guys at B to cap it faster than you could take C anyway.

It really comes down to my team did such a freaking awesome job as a team that things just worked.

As far as TKOTH goes, even though Slick says its because of me, I really attribute that to the team once again. I feel bad that I am so bossy on there but if you all try to stay alive as a team it helps tremendously. Get in the bunker, dont lean over the edge, all of this stuff I was yelling just to try to keep my team alive so we would ALWAYS have a ton of guys there. It doesn''t seem like a lot, but sometimes people get so excited they don''t realize whats killing them.

My team just rocked, and thats probably pretty unreadable, but I''m at work and busy.:)

That one TKOTH map that''s on the center of a high mountain is fun, but once a group has a firm hold on it, especially with a few medics, it is near impossible to take back. Too bad, because it is a fun map.

Oh one more thing, I tried to spawn at C at one point last night and the spawn time was 35 seconds, it changes based on how many guys are there/waiting etc.

Oh one more thing, I tried to spawn at C at one point last night and the spawn time was 35 seconds, it changes based on how many guys are there/waiting etc.

Yes, but you can easily choose to spawn back at default and grab a chopper or in the case of the last map, spawn at A which was adjacent to B.

I think we should try 20 seconds and see how it goes next week.

I think that it has more to do with how many guys are dead and waiting to spawn there, as opposed to another spawn location.

It really comes down to my team did such a freaking awesome job as a team that things just worked.

...I feel bad that I am so bossy on there but ... it helps tremendously

I think you had some superfluous verbiage there, so I took the liberty of editing it out.

I think the reason your team worked so well(on that AAS map) is that someone took charge of the situation, looked at things beyond his immediate arena, and gave people a specific goal/order/plan.
While our team did, indeed, seem a bit chaotic and pushy.
This is one map where the snipery goodness of Minase worked exactly like I feel it should. I have no idea where he was most of the time, but boy did he sow the seeds of confusion. Just when I''d feel like we were going to regroup and get it together, ""Minase exterminated PlayerX with a headshot"" followed quickly by an abbreviated Minase-hunt.

It was brilliant, even if unintended.

But the main point is, I felt more in control of myself when someone else took control; like Sanjuro telling us to ""Circle up"" on Snake River or Certis telling us to converge on B on the AAS map.

Some of us are just grunts. We really do work better with someone taking stock of the bigger picture and showing us the snippet we need to see rather than everyone trying to keep an eye on everything.

Zed seems to make a really good tactical leader and we just need one other person to even things out. I''m not that person. Tell me where to go, when to go, whether to advance or secure and I''m good. Then I can concentrate on the immediate things, like reviving a fallen teammate or pointing out the sneaker on the other side of the river instead of getting confused trying to coordinate my own view of the strategic with the tactical and mesh that, somehow, with all the reports coming in of where every single person on the team sees the opfor and where we should be pressing or holding.

What a rambling mess that is, sorry. Basically, you might feel bad about bossing around your teammates, but I think that is precisely a key component in the AAS victory, couple with our own lack of a focus/coordination. We need two folks willing to play commander, I think.

I wonder again if next week we should password protect the server or drop the max amount of players to 30 instead of 40. I noticed when the server was close to full everyone''s ping dropped to yellow. Tactics are also diluted when 40% of your team isn''t on Teamspeak or paying attention.

Well, I''d hate to miss an opportunity to play with Busta Cap 10 or Sweaty Fat Chick, so maybe just lower the max players to ensure we can all fit in, plus an ""outsiders"" set of 5-10 slots?

Then again, if it''s just us, we can rest assured that we won''t have random dummies spawnsniping or flying helicopters in random directions away from the battle for no apparent reason.

Either way works for me.

The other side of that coin is, whether guys want to play that way. It can be fun for awhile, but at some point at least for me, I want to venture out and fight. That may be one of the reasons our team did not do as well on some maps. We did much better on Snake river, when we pretty much self assigned sectors of the objective, which was an open area. I''m not so sure I want to just sit in the bunker and not lean out or look for incoming troops just to accumulate time in zone. Perhaps a part of the reason you guys did better was that you had more guys willing to do that combined with someone reminding them to?

I did attempt to coordinate our team a few times last night but i was largely ignored so i just shut up =). I''m not big on being bossy or even saying much on TS. There were a few times where i saw an opening to advance in the maps but our team was just too spread out and alot of times i was the only 1 there for the opening lol. I did manage to clear out the zones on my own a few times but since i had no backup it got us nowhere. It wonders me how bad it would have gotten if me and Zedian had been on the same team.

It can be fun for awhile, but at some point at least for me, I want to venture out and fight. That may be one of the reasons our team did not do as well on some maps. We did much better on Snake river, when we pretty much self assigned sectors of the objective, which was an open area. I''m not so sure I want to just sit in the bunker and not lean out or look for incoming troops just to accumulate time in zone.

Ah yes, the map where I kept having to order you clowns back because everyone was outside the zone in their eagerness to kill some Rebels

I think ""keeping your head down"" works well for Suga Mountain (a map which I like less than I did before) but for most of them, especially Assault maps, you''ll see plenty of action on defense or offense. I probably should have taken the leader thing more seriously and tried to coordinate some assaults so we would have kept the rounds closer but I kind of lost my will to do so as more randoms joined the team. Maybe next week I''ll give it a real go.

Tench, I will follow you to Hell and back if you let me stay on your team.

"Zedian" wrote:

When we took C last night, I shouted like a madman for everyone to stay there, not to leave, and defend it. Its very very hard to take a spawn point if it is heavily defended and that is the way it should be in my opinion, you get rewarded for working together. Now on to how we took B.

I can confirm, Zed was shouting like a madman. It''s part of our overall tactics. Next time, if the other team is winning, we''ll send him to shout like a madman on the other channel to throw everyone off.

"Tenchid" wrote:

.... It wonders me how bad it would have gotten if me and Zedian had been on the same team.

Don''t get to cocky Tenchid. I killed you plenty o times. I always know your sneaking up from the flank.

"Dramatic Marlin" wrote:
"Zedian" wrote:

When we took C last night, I shouted like a madman for everyone to stay there, not to leave, and defend it. Its very very hard to take a spawn point if it is heavily defended and that is the way it should be in my opinion, you get rewarded for working together. Now on to how we took B.

I can confirm, Zed was shouting like a madman. It''s part of our overall tactics. Next time, if the other team is winning, we''ll send him to shout like a madman on the other channel to throw everyone off.

Bwahahah!

"Slick" wrote:
"Tenchid" wrote:

.... It wonders me how bad it would have gotten if me and Zedian had been on the same team.

Don''t get to cocky Tenchid. I killed you plenty o times. I always know your sneaking up from the flank. :wink:

I''m not I not only had alot of kills last not i had alot of deaths too. When people you play with get used to your tactics it is of course harder. On the other side of that though when you play on the same team as people your used to it''s much easier.

I can confirm, Zed was shouting like a madman. It''s part of our overall tactics. Next time, if the other team is winning, we''ll send him to shout like a madman on the other channel to throw everyone off.

First another off-topic, then back on-topic.
I find it easy to know when Tenchid is coming, too, because my patient list suddenly swells.

On topic, and tangential, Certis, I replied to your post on the GameCal page for last night''s game about my request for a change in the spawn-in time, but looking back, I''m not sure we''re talking about the same thing. Still, here''s the lead-in, and my last reply. This is related to the initial spawn-in for a newly loaded map.

duckilama says:
... and I tend to spawn in a bit later than most...

.. speaking of, Certis, any chance of adding that spawn-in delay that I''ve seen on the AGE server? Any one else want it or not want it? It''s no biggie, just throwing it out there.

Certis replies:
Ours is 10 seconds right now, what is their delay?

duckilama replies:
I think 30. Basically, it prevents what happened last night on the last map I played, where you spawned in way before me and headed to C.
You spawn in early, you have 30 seconds to enter the Armory menu(where you stand) while all the slower PCs finish loading the map. I''ve never seen this on our server, so if I''m describing what you already know, I apologize.

It''s really a much bigger deal on the TKOTH maps that tend to be a race to find a hiding place, so I don''t want to slow things down for everyone else. If more people are seeing the ""Game starts in X seconds, Press Shift to access Armory menu"" thing on each map, then forget this request.

I know once things go off the side-nav, they tend not to be seen ever again, which is why I copied this here, and it''s semi-related, but not quite the same.

Leading is definately a role you need to embrace. In real life work and in my games I''m more of a doer than a go out and getter if that makes sense.

Being one of the few who posts on CoH is kind of making me into the new SG ''leader'' if not organizer and such for now but at the same time I really want to play with other people and no one else seems to be taking the bull by the horns so I''ll step in...

anyway some off-topic thoughts on leadership.

Gotcha! Yeah, I can set it to 30 so everyone has time to load in and start evenly.

Great, thanks Certis. Another side-benefit is, my default ""character"" is set to Medic. Every time a new map loads, I''m reset to medic, even if I have changed to Gunner/Rifleman/Engineer. While not a huge deal, this gives people a chance to tweak their loadout before a new map begins, rather than going on a mad scramble to find the oh-so-cleverly-hidden ""armory"" piles on some maps. Not that you need more convincing, just something that popped into my head. Had to get it out.

"Tenchid" wrote:

I''m not I not only had alot of kills last not i had alot of deaths too. When people you play with get used to your tactics it is of course harder. On the other side of that though when you play on the same team as people your used to it''s much easier.

I totally agree. If you know what the other people on your team are best at and what they are going to do you act as a much more cohesive force. That''s why when the regulars team up on TS and swarm another server we usually slaughter them.

edit: Anyway, I''d rather have you on my side than not.

I think one of the best parts was on the Surga mountain where I told medics not to go heal people cause they were too far out. I felt so bad when I saw people 100 yards off just lying there helpless, but most everyone was cool with that.

"Zedian" wrote:

I think one of the best parts was on the Surga mountain where I told medics not to go heal people cause they were too far out. I felt so bad when I saw people 100 yards off just lying there helpless, but most everyone was cool with that.

Yeah, a tearful moment wasn''t it? Maybe we can designate just one medic to go out and save em, and hav someone cover them from the bas in the proccess.

Just when I''d feel like we were going to regroup and get it together, ""Minase exterminated PlayerX with a headshot"" followed quickly by an abbreviated Minase-hunt.

To me, this is the biggest value to having a sniper - the distraction. When you guys send half your team out to kill me, it means that the rest of the guys can cap B that much easier. The next best thing is taking out the guys at the fixed guns. It''s much easier to take a point when you don''t have people spamming the .50s.

Oh, and I want to be on Zedian''s squad. Hearing him berate the more inept members of our team is priceless. He went on about Marlin teamkilling all of our medics for at least 5 or 10 minutes.

It seems to be a good idea to have a patrol go and engage the OPFOR before they even get close to the base. A catch them off guard kind of thing. I think it was me and Alexander that went down to intercept the two guys that got off the chopper on Shurga. I apologized for stealing his kill.