Mass Effect 3 Spoiler Thread

While I agree, are you aware of the controversy surrounding her face?

Spoiler:

that the picture is a photoshoped stock photo from getty images?

kexx wrote:

While I agree, are you aware of the controversy surrounding her face?

Spoiler:

that the picture is a photoshoped stock photo from getty images?

This doesn't surprise me, I was going to look it up today because there was something familiar about it. I was just glad she wasn't some kind of bird-monstrosity.

oilypenguin wrote:
kexx wrote:

While I agree, are you aware of the controversy surrounding her face?

Spoiler:

that the picture is a photoshoped stock photo from getty images?

This doesn't surprise me, I was going to look it up today because there was something familiar about it. I was just glad she wasn't some kind of bird-monstrosity.

Your love is the special kind of love.

It sure is =)

Here's the article about more people being mad at Bioware for some reason. Also the comparative photo.

Spoiler:

Tali really resonated with me and I'm extremely happy about how things went with her in ME2 and I'm so far pretty happy about ME3 (ugh, I bet one of us will die and it will be awful). There has been a ton of innuendo and flirting while on missions that's weirded out my best friend and third wheel, Garrus. I approve.

I liked Tali so much that part of the reason I haven't done a femshep run is because she isn't a romance option. I dunno, I just <3 Tali.

Spoiler:

I'm also glad that they kept her to just a photo as an ingame model might have been as horrifyingly weird as that reporter. Ugh.

Okay there is a point in the Quarian chapters where Joker essentially says "Shepard you aren't planning on solo'ing that ship are you?" immersion killer. I know some of the dialogue can be hokey but for some reason that line just killed it for me.

I dunno, I felt that was in-character for Joker.

Joker, you understand, who is voiced by Seth Green of all people ...

Spoiler:

Gets himself a robot girlfriend. A ROBOT. GIRLFRIEND. If that, in and of itself, isn't a meta-joke of one kind or another, I dunno what is.

Michael Zenke wrote:

Joker, you understand, who is voiced by Seth Green of all people ...

Spoiler:

Gets himself a robot girlfriend. A ROBOT. GIRLFRIEND. If that, in and of itself, isn't a meta-joke of one kind or another, I dunno what is.

Spoiler:

I saw the video of that. How exactly does that happen?

DSGamer wrote:
Michael Zenke wrote:

Joker, you understand, who is voiced by Seth Green of all people ...

Spoiler:

Gets himself a robot girlfriend. A ROBOT. GIRLFRIEND. If that, in and of itself, isn't a meta-joke of one kind or another, I dunno what is.

Spoiler:

I saw the video of that. How exactly does that happen?

Spoiler:

In the first mission on Mars you fight a Cerberus infiltration robot. It puts Ashley/Kadian in a coma and Shepard shoots it but they take it with them, theoretically to research but it apparently just gets left lying on a shelf in Normandy's AI core. EDI examines the thing and winds up controlling it. So that's EDI. She gets to come along with Shepard on missions and make sexy-time with Joker (as part of ME3's goal of giving everyone a romance (Garrius and Tali? Really?))

DSGamer wrote:
Spoiler:

I saw the video of that. How exactly does that happen?

I don't know about the how, but as for the why...

Spoiler:

I guess it's so he can "solo" the ship...

Wow. That's incredible. And

Ending Spoilers

Spoiler:

They go to all of this trouble and essentially wipe out the galaxy as it's known? Minus that video of Joker and EDI on the planet they crash land on.

DSGamer wrote:

Wow. That's incredible. And

Ending Spoilers

Spoiler:

They go to all of this trouble and essentially wipe out the galaxy as it's known? Minus that video of Joker and EDI on the planet they crash land on.

Further major ending spoilers:

Spoiler:

There's three "significant" endings. None of the endings wipe out the galaxy, but there's some ambiguity surrounding how they affect the Mass Relays and which of the endings do what to them. Basically, from the final cinematic (seemingly regardless of which ending you choose), the Relays are seen to be destroyed, which would effectively leave every single military force of every single galactic race (depending on how many of them you got involved) stranded in the Sol system. Not such a good thing, really. None of this is thoroughly explained, which is a big part of the reason for all the anger and hate.

On the ending...

Spoiler:

I'm basically happy with how all the character stories got wrapped up, and how your choices were represented and acknowledged in the third game.

The exception is Shepard's story, the main plot. But then, the Reapers were the least interesting part of the previous games as well. Weird that they decided to destroy the mass relays at the end, which would make any follow-ups pretty difficult, as it would basically wipe out Mass Effect civilization. But it is not unprecedented for DLC to retcon unsatisfying endings. (For the happy ending, spend 800 Bioware points!)

Regarding Mass Relays

Spoiler:

The ships can travel FTL even without Mass Relays. Consider that all through the game you travel between stars within a cluster without using one; you're just limited by your fuel supply.

Without the Mass Relays everyone can still travel around the local cluster easily. Going beyond that would just require setting up fuel depots and the like. So galactic civilization won't collapse; it will just take longer to get between clusters. It may take a while to get set up but it won't end everything.

James Vega now lives on the normandy in the cargo hold by the transport pod. I am the commander of the ship and I do not like him. I want him gone.

Spoiler:

femshep does not like being called lola.

Am I able to tell EDI to open the cargo bay doors in the middle of the night?

Can I request a transfer?

On a happy note I found my hamster. Why can I not take my hamster into battle over Vega? http://theoatmeal.com/comics/pets_war

Bonnonon wrote:

James Vega now lives on the normandy in the cargo hold by the transport pod. I am the commander of the ship and I do not like him. I want him gone.

Spoiler:

femshep does not like being called lola.

It could be worse... manShep gets

Spoiler:

called Loco

tanstaafl's take is how I saw it.

Spoiler:

FTL transport and mass relay transport are separate things, and it's not like the technology on how to build Mass Relays is lost - the universal transport system just gets reset. Frankly, I don't see why Catalyst would do such a thing in the first place, unless it was an unavoidable side effect.

The Mass Relays are less like standard FTL tropes in scifi and more like Star Trek Wormholes.

All that said, I found the ending unsatisfying. Catalyst was barely foreshadowed and his agenda and his solution were unexpected and illogical, especially because the entire character of Legion undermines Catalyst's most basic premise.

Would like to see DLC exploring alternate ending concepts.

I'm stupidly busy right now, so I know I won't have time to play the game in the pace that I would like, so I've put it off for later, but I lost the battle to strong will, and went ahead and saw every spoiler there is. I just couldn't sit there reading all these comments about the ending and not be in the know, so I caved, youtubed everything.

Now, I know I don't have the entire context of how things play out, but:

Spoiler:

Holy crap those are sh*tty endings. I mean, I saw EVERYTHING on youtube, and was moved several times, mainly with Thane, Mordin and Tali's suicide option. I feel that I'll probably regard the game as the best of the three titles, but once I hit the dreadful mark about Catalyst, it all goes to sh*t, and badly. It's still too early I guess. I've read every conceivable theory out there about the "perfect" ending, and the only option left I guess is to wait for someone to complete the game NG+, and see if that triggers it. But holy cow what a bad ending.

It's not that the tone is dark, and is unhappy or whatever. I can deal with bitter-sweet. I enjoy bitter-sweet. The sweet ain't that sweet without the sour, and seeing Mordin, Thane and Tali (my love interest) die, I was heart broken, but man were they well written. It worked. It clicked. Hell, I was even saddened to see Legion fall, but it served a purpose. It motivates me further. EVerything that's happening, everything my crew has been doing, has been to be at better odds to beat the reapers. But the final 10 minutes undoes everything that ever mattered. No matter what you choose, everything goes to sh*t because, f*ck it, why not...they'll never expect that. I don't care Shep dies. But it's badly written. I can't go on without playing every minute of the game. It's unfair. It's irresponsible. But I was gravely disappointed. I can't believe how anyone over at Bioware would think this would be an acceptable ending. All 3 endings are the same thing anyway, why have 3 different ones.

I did enjoy everything else I saw though. Especially Garrus' romance. For me, Tali and Garrus are the canon romances. That's how it rolls on my two different playthroughs. At least on ME2.

LarryC wrote:

tanstaafl's take is how I saw it.

Spoiler:

FTL transport and mass relay transport are separate things, and it's not like the technology on how to build Mass Relays is lost - the universal transport system just gets reset. Frankly, I don't see why Catalyst would do such a thing in the first place, unless it was an unavoidable side effect.

The Mass Relays are less like standard FTL tropes in scifi and more like Star Trek Wormholes.

All that said, I found the ending unsatisfying. Catalyst was barely foreshadowed and his agenda and his solution were unexpected and illogical, especially because the entire character of Legion undermines Catalyst's most basic premise.

Would like to see DLC exploring alternate ending concepts.

Mass Relays: Not exactly.

Spoiler:

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Mas...

No one knows how to build a Relay, which is less important than the fact that they're made of a material that's never been seen by any of the current races. And as it would take many years, even several decades, to return to their original systems by FTL travel, it can be safely assumed that a significant part of each species - with the meaningful exception of humans - will die. And, because of the ambiguity I mentioned before, it's not even clear if the respective star systems will survive the destruction of the relays, as evidenced by the annihilation of the Bahak system when the Alpha Relay is hit by an asteroid.

Literally, *everyone* could be dead. They're probably not, but it's really not clear.

I was looking at the Bioware ME3 forums, and one user really sums up nicely what I think everyone is saying:

Spoiler:

The ending was not bad because it was bitter, or sad, or didn't feature rainbows and butterflies. The ending was bad because it did not fit Mass Effect.

First, to me the primary theme of Mass Effect is determinism (evolution) vs. self-determinism (free will). In Mass Effect 1, Sovreign tells Shepherd that he has no choice in the matter...the desturction of all life is inevitable. Shepherd effectively says "Screw you" and through determination, sacrifice, and perseverance he stops Sovreign and proves that life is not determined. Free will is the truth. ME2, everyone tells Shepherd that he is attempting a suicide mission--one way trip. His fate is determined. Shepherd's response: "I'm going to stop the Collectors but I plan to live to tell about it!" He defies fate and proves that through free will, sacrifice, and determination life can persist through insurmountable odds.

Now ME3. The kid tells Shepherd that their fate is inevitable. No matter what Shepherd does, synthetic life will destroy organic life. The only way Shepherd can prevent this is to synthesize organic and inorganic life (which if you think about it is essentially saying everyone must become a Reaper). This ending is entirely inconsistent (despite having glaring logical errors and lacks empirical support). As proven above, Mass Effect's primary theme is fatalistic determinism vs. free-willing self-determinism with self-determinism being proven again and again to be the truth. Now, the Reaper Guardian kid says that no that theme is wrong the truth is determinism. And this is asserted with no question. Major problem here.

Furthermore, the Guardian lacks empirical support for his claim. The reconciliation between the Geth and the Quarian disproves the Guardian. EDI disproves the guardian. The backstory of the Geth and Quarians disproves the Guardian. Essentially, the Guardian makes an assertion with zero empirical evidence and Shepherd just accepts this. I cry foul.

Then he has this to add, which I'm not too sure about, but still rings somewhat true:

Spoiler:

Furthermore, to me the dichotomy between organics and inorganics always was a metaphor for racism. I don't believe I am alone in this opionion and the entire theme throughout the game seems to prove this. Essentially what is the message being given by the Guardian then: racism is inevitable. Again, I cry foul! I do not say for one second that Bioware is propounding racism, rather I am saying that whoever wrote this ending was incredibly careless and not aware of the thematic implcations of his writing.

Thought it was well put. Again, I've not played the game, just seen A LOT of it on youtube, and within that context, I say I have to agree.

3 ex-members

Spoiler:

dead. All among the best characters too. And nothing I could do about it. This game...

About the ending:

Spoiler:

How disappointing. I can't even fathom how anyone at Bioware thought that was an acceptable ending. And to be clear, I'm talking about the last 10 minutes. The actual ending was fantastic. The fleet warping in, the goodbye's, the frantic firefights, I mean I was in and then they threw in the absurd Catalyst figure and three random choices. What? I had access to the "best" ending because I had a military rating over 7,000 and 100% readiness. I played through two of the endings and just watched the third on YouTube and they were all essentially the same.

But the sameness isn't really the issue, the issue is why was there even that choice? Why would I want to make some ludicrous philosophical decision at the end of the Mass Effect 3, a series that has been about Commander Shepard and the relationships he's built? And the actual decisions weren't even cool. Apparently the "best" ending is to choose the destruction of synthetic life. You need a minimum of 5,000 military strength for that. But even that's not kosher because I like the Geth and I like EDI and I didn't want to wipe them out. And then they threw in the mass relays being destroyed with every ending? Why? And in the cut scene they show Joker on some random planet with two crew members jumping out? They couldn't even show every crew member? I don't even understand the purpose of crashing on a random planet. I mean, is the real ending going to be DLC? What the f*ck.

Edit:

Spoiler:

Also, why does the Catalyst give you more options based on your military strength? It makes no sense. What's worse is you don't really get to see the effectiveness of all the support you gathered. In ME2, you could see the effect of having your crew members loyalty and ship upgrades. In ME3, it all amounts to jack sh*t. You don't see a bunch of Krogan saving Liara or Geth Prime's doing something awesome on the ground assault. You don't see any of the specific support you gathered.

You don't even see the key members of your crew helping in the final assault. It's one thing not to show what Grunt, Miranda, Jack etc. are doing but you don't even show the other members of your current crew?

All your military strength number dictates is how many lame options you get in the unsatisfactory garbage ending. All those relationships you built, all those decisions you made, all the things you care about in the series amount to nothing and are given a big middle finger. Here are three random philosophical options to choose from jackass.

I normally don't get worked up over stuff like this but that ending was so awful I can't stop thinking about it.

liquid:

Spoiler:

Tali and Grunt lived in my playthrough. I'm not sure why.

Not sure which ones liquid is talking about. But I already mentioned my early deaths a page or two back. Doesn't quite make sense, especially the one, where everyone says that person didn't die, even the damn wiki about the mission.

I did finish the missing Krogan scouts mission this afternoon...

Spoiler:

And despite charging into overwhelming odds, Grunt came walking out at the end, covered in blood, but hungry and alive. :cool:

Okay, now my turn to talk about ending.

Spoiler:

Okay I only had two choices (I didn't max everything) I chose the one in blue on the left, to control them.

The people I saw at the end were Liara, Joker, and Garrus (the ones I would have wanted to live)

I loved loved loved the ending mission right up until you go up on that shiny platform. I thought up until that point it was one of the better ends to a game I have seen, very reminiscent of something like a MGS4 which went for a similar feel (the hero is hurt super bad and has to go on guts to finish the job). Then it all falls apart.

I agree with the determinism vs self-determinism point up above.

Also, there is a guide here on the point values you need for certain situations to occur: http://www.justpushstart.com/2012/03... I fell into the category right before Shepard can actually live. I actually like the Shepard dies and I think it works better, nice to have a very definitive end cap to a trilogy for once, at least until they retcon for DLC.

I have many more coherent thoughts on this but they will have to wait until the morning I think.

One more thing to add here:

Spoiler:

I spent 2 hours of my life saving the Quarians from the Geth and helping them regain their homeworld. Then me and Tali had that awesome touching moment on the world where we talk about the future of their world....

and then the end of the game STRANDS THE ENTIRE RACE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE GALAXY!

The more I type about this game on the Internet the angrier I get.

More (I can't sleep!)

Spoiler:

There are big problems in my opinion with the ending, they have been covered extensively both here and on the Internet as a whole so I won't go into that.

Do you want to know how they could have fixed it? Very easily, in probably a day or two of work? A "heroic" "happy" ending.

It should have had a paragon point requirement and a readiness requirement and a War Asset requirement but it should be there. it encourages multiple playthroughs or a completionist run and it gives them a way to extend the fiction in the future if they so choose (I would love to see a ME4 with a new enemy but with my Shepard still hanging about).

so what would be in this ending? Basically the "Destroy" reaper option without it being all synthetics or there being any other consequences. Geth? They are cool! EDI? She is hot in her own little machiney way. Also, those relays? Yeah we still need those. I think the reason this is a big issue for me is because "My" Shepard always had a great option to pick at the end of the first two games, choices that My Shepard would have chosen given an infinite number of options. And when there isn't that option I feel like the character I had spent probably 150 hours being and playing wasn't given "her" option.

I know that life isn't like that, sometimes there are no win scenarios, but that is what I want in my game, I want the scenario where My Shepard WINS. I know I know, this is a story told by someone else but when I want something and I don't get that there is letdown. There is a reason I wanted that, I had spent 3 games building up to that ending cinematic when My Shepard comes out of the final battle as the savior of the universe, yes people died, yes it was hard, but My Shepard saved the day. That is what I wanted to see, that isn't what I saw, I wanted to see what I wanted to see.

I thought the ending was the best possible ending to the Mass Effect series from the time you jump into the Sol system right until you go up that blue platform, right there it goes off the rails in a way I haven't seen in a REALLY long time.

At this point my sleep deprived brain is just rambling, I probably shouldn't post anymore tonight, this is probably only half coherent as it is.

LarryC wrote:

liquid:

Spoiler:

Tali and Grunt lived in my playthrough. I'm not sure why.

Spoiler:

Miranda, Thane, Mordin and Wrex/Grunt, I couldn't tell. Some Krogan shuttle got blown away in the final mission

Ending:

Spoiler:

I dived into the beam of light. No idea what happened after that but I'm not satisfied with it. Actually, I'm not satisfied with any of the options that little annoying kid told me. LAME ENDINGS. Even Sheperd dying without getting the Citadel to fire a single shot would have been a much better ending

Alright. This the spoiler thread and I'm assuming we've all finished the game here. No need to spoiler-tag ending discussions, since there's really only one ending. If you've finished the game in any way, you have essentially seen it.

Here are the problems, as I see it, with the end-game scenario. Up until Mr. Catalyst shows up, the game is perfectly fine.

1. It's tedious. You can't save past the beginning, meaning you have to replay minutes of noninteractive game where the scenery and the dialogue are not particularly riveting and yet you're still constrained to press your finger on the movement commands. This is the worst possible combination of cinema and game mechanics. Bad.

2. You can lose. Both ME1 and ME2 had different endings, but in many of those endings, whether you won or you lost was a matter of perspective. People who "won" the game still replayed the game doing "all the wrong things" just so they could see what happened if they did it that way. That's not a "losing" ending because there's still a payoff. In ME3, if you don't win, you get access to LESS content, not DIFFERENT content, which is a clear losing situation for the player.

3. You can't win. Even when you get the best possible ending, there's so many things that are destroyed by killing all the Mass Relays that no matter what you do, it's a tragic end for the Galaxy as a whole, almost as bad as just letting the Reapers win. And this is the only result you can ever get. You don't get any alternate interesting content. It's not even depressing in a cathartic or logical sort of way. It's just... ...callous and nonsensical.

These are the three essential missteps in the ending of ME3 that, up to that point, is a truly magnificent game. It's worse than the ME2 misstep because most of us simply forgot that there was this cheesy battle with a giant pseudo-terminator. Thankfully, they didn't make that mistake this time around. Unfortunately, they made worse ones.

It says something about the ending that it could induce such nerd rage and discontent over a game that is otherwise a towering accomplishment and a milestone in game design.

It is quite literally an epic fail.