Final Fantasy XIII-2‽ Catch-All

Cheeto1016 wrote:
zeroKFE wrote:
As for out of the way treasure spheres? Just throw your damn moogle.

He may not have that ability yet depending on which path he took through the story after leaving the Bresha (however that's spelled) Ruins.

See!!! YOU PICK THE WRONG PATH AND YOU ARE SCREWED!

Bleh.

Well, in this case you just spend too much time trying to figure out how to reach treasure chests that rarely contain anything useful.

Spoiler:

Head to the Sunleath Waterscape and progress the story a little bit. Maybe 20 or 30 minutes in you will learn the ability to throw Mog, which will allow you to get pretty much any treasure chest (or artifact) that you can see.

To be fair, that's a tough, tough ability to get right out of the Bresha ruins. I managed to beat that boss, but it took more than 10 minutes (target was 5) and there were several times I simply couldn't keep up with the rate at which he healed. Probably burned 5-6 phoenix downs, too. Luckily I have a million from grinding out the "Clock Stopper" achievement in 3 AF.

When I eventually made it back to that location, I wondered what all the fuss was about. Amazing what 30-40 levels can do.

Minarchist wrote:

Probably burned 5-6 phoenix downs, too. Luckily I have a million from grinding out the "Clock Stopper" achievement in 3 AF. :)

You know, I wasn't specifically trying to get that achievement, but I got it in the same location too. In my case, I was obsessively trying to capture an Exoray for my team because I'm obsessive about capturing monsters. Hilariously, I got the achievement, and then the very next battle I finally got my exoray.

Nice.

I haven't been going for rare monsters much, but I have gotten lucky. I picked up all of the rare monsters in the Bresha Ruins without even trying, snagging each of them on my very first encounter, which probably has like a 1/1000 odds all told. Which probably means I'm going to have to play for 40 hours to get the casino fragment as karmic retribution

Wow, a week goes by with a brand-new FF game and nobody posts? Must all be too busy playing.

For my part, I've beaten the game and am sitting on 158/160 fragments, with only three beasts left for one and the "lucky 7" slot fragment for the other. I've mostly enjoyed it so far, but there are several things about it that lead me to like XIII far more. It's an interesting evolution of the original game. (Or perhaps devolution.)

Anyone else beaten it yet? Want to discuss the similarity between its ending and X-2's?

Holy crap! You've played way more than me.

I've been splitting time between FFXIII-2, Kingdoms of Amalur, and Europa Universalis III, with the majority of my gaming time going to EU3.

I'm actually maybe halfway through the main story in FFXIII-2, and expect to have a lot of post-story gameplay too. I just finished the story bits on the first visit to the Archylte Steppe and am about to return to the Sunleth Waterway after I do a little exploring and stuff. Chapter... 3-2 I think?

So far, this is actually the game I had hoped FFXIII would be, at least gameplay-wise. It actually feels like a Final Fantasy game.

You guys are way ahead of me, sucks i got caught up in a freelance project this weekend.

I'm not that far in either. I finished Sunliffe Waterway (second visit) last night, and then went and grabbed an Albino Lobo (great RAV) and a Chichu (awesome COM). Chichu, upgraded to about level 25, among makes things too easy!

Locations:

Spoiler:

Albino Lobo is a rare monster in Bresha Ruins unless you use the Moogle throw at the Atlas pit in Bresha Ruins to get the key in the treasure sphere, and unlock the gate in the command centre thing to get into the sewers behind there. He spawns pretty often there, and I got his crystal first time using Feral link to kill him.

Chichu is only obtainable by throwing Mog into the big cluster of red flowers south of nomad camp in the Plains of Eternity in Archylte Steppe. It took a few throws. He really is a madly powerful COM for a mutant sprout!

I'm running an all-chocobo setup, which is pretty rad. I haven't managed to tame green or black, but since I never run with a monster SAB or MED anyway that hasn't mattered much. Takes a while to level them up, but boy howdy are they powerful. My RAV blue chocobo has a six-segment ATB gauge (!) and like 1,000 magic. Silver and gold chocobos also rock, and Purple is a fantastic SYN -- I'll usually put him in with Noel and Serah both as SABs, MEDs or SENs.

Minarchist wrote:

boy howdy are they powerful

Playing through Final Fantasy Tactics for the first time a couple years ago great increased my respect and hatred for the giant chickens. Bunch of dirty rat bastards in feathers is what they are

My silver, after a couple judicious infusions, also tears up fal'cie class at the races. He's a winner.

Minarchist wrote:

Anyone else beaten it yet? Want to discuss the similarity between its ending and X-2's? :)

I say throw your thoughts out there and spoiler-tag it. I'm not terribly worried about spoiling the game, oddly. It's going to remain fun regardless. And I'm curious about your thoughts so I'll certainly read 'em.

I've been messing about in the Academia for the last couple of hours. It's like a punishment to those who said that XIII was too linear in its level design.

spider_j wrote:

I've been messing about in the Academia for the last couple of hours. It's like a punishment to those who said that XIII was too linear in its level design.

You know, I find that encouraging despite your dire tone.

spider_j wrote:

I've been messing about in the Academia for the last couple of hours. It's like a punishment to those who said that XIII was too linear in its level design.

400, 4XX, or 500? I have a hate/love/hate relationship with them, respectively (with the latter being a white hot hate).

So, I have a question for you guys who are farther in the game. Right now I have maybe 50k gil. The only thing I've really bought was a couple of weapons that I quickly replaced with drops. I can see a few accessories that I might pick up, but their prices are quite reasonable. I'd like to drop a good chunk of cash on monster upgrade materials but I'm concerned that I might suddenly encounter a big ticket item that I'd like to buy (or when I finally find this mythical casino I'll want extra credits to get started abusing that).

So, should I be banking my gil for a future purchase or burn it down upgrading and infusing monsters?

There's no reason to save your gil, really -- any expensive items you may want aren't even available until post-game -- unless you decide to play the slots a lot (the exchange rate in the casino is tough). However, there's also no real reason to drop gil on monster upgrade materials, as there's pretty much always a good place to farm for them, even the "potent" ones that are so important for good monsters.

However, there's also no real reason to drop gil on monster upgrade materials, as there's pretty much always a good place to farm for them, even the "potent" ones that are so important for good monsters.

Yeah, so far I've just leveled my monsters with what I've picked up running around the areas, but I'm now to a point where I want to do a bit of monster crafting since parts of my current team have started to reach the end of their utility. I certainly could just build up the new team as I go, but it would be a lot more pleasant to just buy a mess of materials and do it all in one pass instead.

Thanks for the input though -- I think I'll maybe try to find a nice balance between spending and saving.

I have run out of wild artifacts, any tips on getting more? I couldn't find them in the datalog to know where to look. I'm stuck trying to get graviton cores, and don't have the proper times open.

Happytime Harry wrote:

I have run out of wild artifacts, any tips on getting more? I couldn't find them in the datalog to know where to look. I'm stuck trying to get graviton cores, and don't have the proper times open.

Congrats! Choose your tag.

Happytime Harry wrote:

I have run out of wild artifacts, any tips on getting more? I couldn't find them in the datalog to know where to look. I'm stuck trying to get graviton cores, and don't have the proper times open.

To actually answer your question, you have access to nine Wild Artefacts by the point of Academia 4XX, although one of them can only be bought using a metric ton of casino coins. At any rate, you don't need that many even to pick up all seven pieces if you so desire (you only need five). This page only lists wild artefact locations, so no other gameplay spoilers if you're trying to avoid them.

I had found 3 just by playing, and had already used 1 so I only had 2 when it came to this FedEx quest. I have 5/7, just didnt wanna spin my wheels looking for them, appreciate it.

And thanks, we'll see if anyone can come up with a better one than I originally thought of.

Minarchist wrote:
spider_j wrote:

I've been messing about in the Academia for the last couple of hours. It's like a punishment to those who said that XIII was too linear in its level design.

400, 4XX, or 500? I have a hate/love/hate relationship with them, respectively (with the latter being a white hot hate).

Whichever the first one you get to is, with the

Spoiler:

constant unavoidable fights with ghouls that give you 2cp for winning a fight that is shorter than the load for that fight. I would have enjoyed navigating the rather labyrinthine level if not for the stupid fights

That's 400. The nice thing is, they're a pretty good drop for the potent orbs, the level-3 monster item. But yeah, they get a bit annoying.

I 100%ed the game last night. One of the fragments and the last achievement I needed required some controller rubber-banding, let's just say. Anyway, some brief (for me) thoughts below. Some very, very minor [color=red]spoilers ahead[/color], yadda yadda. You've been warned, but safe-to-read unless you're in total blackout mode.

I...didn't like this game as much as FF XIII. There, I said it. It was more "open" throughout, yes, but that's no panacea. I didn't think about it much at the time I played the original, but I think XIII really was the game FF players had been asking for all along, but they played it and still weren't happy.

Let's start with the characters. Admittedly Serah was by far the person I liked the least in XIII, so I'm biased. That being said, I actually thought they did a reasonably good job bringing her from the coy, helpless, "I need my knight in shining armor" person she was in XIII to a more confident woman by the end of 13-2. I liked her arc, though I think much of the writing/translation was worse than the last game. Noel, on the other hand, reeked of Marty Stu (or whatever you prefer to call a male Mary Sue). He was too perfect, and his only conflict was external...and even that was slight. He was an odd foil to Serah. Caius, as far as villians go, was relatively forgettable, though I liked how he worked his way through the plot. Mog...shoot me now. Ugh.

Plot-wise, there were some interesting bones here, though time-travel is not exactly unexplored territory for games. There are some logical inconsistencies in the narrative, with how your characters are so laser-beam focused but then skip gaily through time without a care in the world (lack of urgency in the narrative). They predictably brought back all of the XIII characters "for the fans" or whatever, though most of those threads are left completely dangling and unexplained. I don't mean in a "it's not necessary to tie up all loose ends" way, I mean in a "what the hell are they doing here" deus ex machina way. The ending was just bad. If XIII ended on an upbeat (if bittersweet) note that left you feeling somewhat good, this game spits in your face. Then shows you a "to be continued..." sign. Nice.

And here's the big point: maybe the more open-ended structure just isn't a good fit for the plot of Final Fantasy games. See, in XIII, you had a high-energy, compelling plot that pushed you forward with its urgency. The ability to break off and play slots for a few hours would make no sense in this context, much the same as Oblivion's "Hell Gates are opening everywhere! WE'RE ALL GONNADIEDIED--oh, you wanna play archmage for a while? That's cool, hellspawn won't spill out until you're ready." The point at which FF XIII opened up made perfect narrative sense -- you finally made it to Pulse, and your characters had no earthly idea what they were supposed to do next; wandering aimlessly is true to the narrative here. And then, post-game after the urgent story is resolved, you have full run of the place.

Contrast this with FF XIII-2, which allowed you during most of the narrative to mess around as you will. Considering how incredibly driven Serah was to find Lightning, Noel to find Caius, and the overall urgency of things, this made no sense. It also allows for the idiotic quests of poking around for a while to find a bunch of stuff we need, bringing the narrative to a halt. The most telling example of this, for me, was when I hit Academia 4xx. I had spent a few hours collecting various fragments in past places and leveling up some monsters -- basically dicking around in the world, despite the urgent narrative, simply because I had the opportunity. When I was finally ready to pick up the plot thread again, I got a quest to -- wait for it -- go dick around in the world and spend a few hours collecting various fragments of things. This is a huge problem in narrative consistency, and it killed 13-2 for me.

Gameplay was a bit of a wash. I love this battle system and am happy to see it return. The gotta-catch-em-all monster setup is always fun, but I think the positive effect of that is counter-balanced by the fact that it limits your paradigms pretty severely. In several of the difficult fights I wished to have 3 characters that could take on any role, as in XIII. This is especially true because Noel and Serah don't have a full complement of abilities between them. For instance, neither of them have either of the crucial skills Bravery or Faith, even as maxed out SYNs. Why the hell not? That means I have to use a monster slot as a SYN for any major battle whether I want to or not. Stupid, stupid decision. Feral links are completely pointless, on aggregate. A few have handy status effects, but all the "attack" ones (the vast majority) just take too long and only have one creature attacking. If I spend time to hit a feral link during a stagger, for instance, that stagger bar continues to deplete through the entire little cutscene and attack, when only one character is attacking instead of 3. After I got the 100 feral links achievement I pretty much never used them again, except in rare instances when I needed action in-between ATB gauges filling up. So overall, still great, but not an improvement. Maybe even a step back.

Though 13-2 ostensibly has more locations than its predecessor, it really has less due to many of them being the same location tweaked slightly. And you know what's awesome? Running up and down a long corridor like Yachas Massif several times for plot progress, only to be sent to a slightly different version of the same long corridor to run up and down it several times. That's totally awesome. Is this what you wanted when you complained about XIII's linearity?

The score, that triumphantly delicate and complex architecture built by Hamauzu for XIII, is trampled by elephants here. Plenty of tracks are re-used without any thought of the meaning of themes and how they were originally used; they're just strewn about randomly, like so many hooker's clothing items about a cheap motel room. And the new tracks are categorically terrible and mis-matched to the game. Oh...and did you think the J-pop song at the end of XIII was bad? Just wait until you hear this one. Especially when you see the visuals it accompanies! Talk about a WTF moment.

In truth, I did not find FF XIII-2 to be a bad game. I obviously enjoyed it enough to finish it, and 100% the game (~46 hours for me, if you're curious). However, I think that compared to its predecessor it falls flat. Really, I think FF XIII was the JRPG that many gamers had been asking for with their complaints of previous JRPGs, but then when they actually got it it was new and unfamiliar and they rejected it for the same old thing.

In brief: this is why we can't have nice things.

I should say: I didn't hate the game. I rather enjoyed it (I hope that is obvious, since I completed it). I think I mentioned this in the last post, but it probably got lost amidst a wall of negativity. Consider the above post more of a comparison between 13 and 13-2, not a judge of the game in its own right. It's not a great game that breaks new ground, but it's not Star Ocean 4, either. My point is that we complained for years, got what we want,and then complained about it. Not a good track record for gamers in this regard.

Minarchist wrote:

Oh...and did you think the J-pop song at the end of XIII was bad? Just wait until you hear this one. Especially when you see the visuals it accompanies! Talk about a WTF moment.

...dammit.

Anyway, from as far as I've gotten so far, I actually agree with many (though not all) of your negatives on the game.

I still prefer the openness to be whenever and however I want to this degree (reminds me more of some of the more open FF games of the past that I loved, like FFXII, or FFVII in the mid/late game, or FFVI in the mid/late game, etc. The only one more open than this one from what I've seen so far was FFX-2. And actually, that one was a little TOO open. So I can understand how you may feel that way about FFXIII-2.

I like both protagonists a fair amount so far. I agree that despite my well-documented loathing of Vanille's voice acting and overly cutesy behavior, Serah was actually my least favorite character in FFXIII proper. She's FAR more palatable this time around. Mog... well, when all it spouted was the occasional "kupo" it was fine, but then it went downhill from there.

Is it evil of me to love throwing Mog long distances just to hear that panicked, despairing "kupooooooooo!" cry? Cracks me up every time.

Minarchist wrote:

And you know what's awesome? Running up and down a long corridor like Yachas Massif several times for plot progress, only to be sent to a slightly different version of the same long corridor to run up and down it several times. That's totally awesome. Is this what you wanted when you complained about XIII's linearity?

Ugh, I'll agree, that's not what I wanted. I wanted more like the Archylte Steppe, or the places with a bit more nooks and crannies to explore (like Oerba). Finding spots to jump to or throw Mog to so you can recover items? That's cool too. Rerunning the same long corridors? Not so much.

What really puzzles me is that while the soundtrack is so whacked out (seriously, what were they smoking when they did that part of the game?), I actually have been enjoying it for the most part. Maybe it's because it's just so f*cked up ALL the time that I can roll with it, whereas FFXIII's felt a bit more uneven (when it was good, it was definitely awesome, but the rest of the time grated on my nerves). I dunno, it's hard to explain.

I definitely miss the battle music from FFXIII for sure. Though for reasons beyond my understanding, I get a kick out of the heavy metal boss music in FFXIII-2. *shrug*

I will say that I have easily had more fun (MUCH more fun) with the ~10-12 hours I've put into FFXIII-2 so far than I did with the same stretch of time in FFXIII. But fun is entirely subjective.

Farscry wrote:

Is it evil of me to love throwing Mog long distances just to hear that panicked, despairing "kupooooooooo!" cry? Cracks me up every time.

Not just you. Best part of the game.

I will say that I have easily had more fun (MUCH more fun) with the ~10-12 hours I've put into FFXIII-2 so far than I did with the same stretch of time in FFXIII. But fun is entirely subjective.

Which is totally fair. And to (re-)re-iterate, I mostly had fun with the game. There were several parts I didn't really mention due to it being a comparison piece, like the anomaly puzzles, which I almost universally enjoyed. I didn't like the crystal-matching ones since the controls weren't very precise, but the platform path and clock puzzles were a great diversion when I didn't feel like running down one of the four iterations of Yachas Massif at the moment.

It's the cognitive dissonance that bothers me more than anything else. In other words, my opinion is still right, and yours is wrong.

Yeah, it's strange how while I can agree that the game design was tighter and better implemented in FFXIII, I am having more fun with the decidedly schizophrenic design of FFXIII-2.

Hoo, man. I really need to break this habit of clicking spoiler tags when I haven't even started the game in reference.

Did the same for a rather poignant moment in LoZ: Skyward Sword.