Tebow is the Eminem of the NFL

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I am a Patriots fan. I loved watching Tebow get owned by Tom Brady. I also believe that Tebow is grossly overrated, and his popularity is a function of Christian Dominionist born again shtick and the "novelty" of a white quarterback with a "black" style of play. In many ways, Tebow is the Eminem of the NFL, with the latter being imminently more talented. Alternatively, we can suggest that Tebow is to black quarterbacks who play at HBCU's as white girls who are "thick" are to black women with the same physiques. One is "exotic"; the other is "ordinary" and "typical."

In all, the ESPN round table hits on a number of issues, and while they over read "racism" and "racial resentment" into the Tebow debate, the panelists are spot on in that a black quarterback who played like him would not get any of his shine.

Is Tebow the great white hope? And what does this tell us about race and sports--what should be the greatest of all meritocracies where none of these questions of identity ought to matter--but where the real world offers no such comforts?

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What do you think? Is his "exotic" appeal what made him a national phenomenon?

Whoa. Eminem has real talent. It isnt just that he is a white rapper, the man has amazing rhymes and some things to say. Tebow is just some mediocre QB that got lucky and will not stick around for over a decade. There is no real comparison.

Then, is he the Vanilla Ice of the NFL, or the Snow of the NLF?

NathanialG wrote:

Whoa. Eminem has real talent. It isnt just that he is a white rapper, the man has amazing rhymes and some things to say. Tebow is just some mediocre QB that got lucky and will not stick around for over a decade. There is no real comparison.

He says it so the rest of us don't have to.

As far as I can see, it's just the constant praying plus the 'miraculous' saves. Those saves will evaporate, and so will Tebow.

It is worth pointing out, however, that saying Tebow has no talent is patently untrue. If you can quarterback *at all* at the national level, you're extraordinarily talented compared to normal people. He may not be talented enough, but he's far better than 99.999% of us ever will be.

Reposted from the NFL thread in Sports:

I'm not going to share in the Tebow hate, but will point out that this outcome is really not at all surprising. When you look at his QB rating, he finished out the year right ahead of Rex Grossman (#27) and right behind Colt McCoy (#25). You just don't get to win in a shootout with Tom Brady with those kinds of numbers even if the defense is as porous as NE's is.

The surprising thing to me was how committed Denver was to the option even after it became transparently clear that the Patriots had figured it out and were not going to let themselves be beat by it. Bellicheck had all the lanes blocked off, gave the corners safety help, and provided just enough QB pressure to make Tebow commit to something. And at point, Brady had more touchdowns than Tebow had first downs AND more points than he had yards.

As much as I'm glad to see the madness over Tebow end, I don't think he or anyone deserves either the hype or the schadenfreude over this sort of beating. More to the point, I also don't think that enough attention is brought to the fact that Bellicheck routinely runs up the score out of spite (e.g.: what the hell was Brady still doing in the game after halftime?) or to send a message.

Won't the real Tim Tebow please stand up?

Sad that this is stated as a race issue. He was interesting to watch this season, and publicly modest. He was willing to throw himself into the line to gain a few yards at a time when quarterbacks slide to avoid being it. People love that. Yeah, the guy is not a great QB, but the broncos were entertaining at a time when the NFL has gotten kind of boring with all the passing.

IMAGE(https://p.twimg.com/AjNgISrCEAEK8Di.jpg)

Tim Tebow stats: 126/271 (46.5%), 1729 yards, 12 TD, 6 INT, 122 rushes, 660 yards (5.4 ypc), 6 TDs

Cam Newton stats: 310/517 (60%), 4051 yards, 21 TD, 17 INT, 126 rushes, 706 yards (5.6 ypc), 14 TDs

Look at those stat lines and tell me Tim Tebow should be the one being talked about. Cam Newton was phenomenal this year (which kills me to say, as a Bucs fan who totally made fun of Cam Newton all offseason); he is a much, much better QB than Tebow. He throws better, he runs better, he has proverbial "fire" and leadership--he's the real running threat at QB, not Tebow. Carolina put together an offense that managed to feature Newton's running ability plus also have the threat of the pass, and he executed it wonderfully. Tebow? He played in 14 games this year. He had over 50% completion FOUR times. He was an abysmal QB. Not bad, abysmal, and the whole "his threat to run counterbalances his passing problems" is utter crap in comparison to Newton's year.

Cam Newton is a better QB in every conceivable way, except for one thing; Tim Tebow is much, much better at being white.

If you want to argue racism, at least find a situation where the two QBs are in similar circumstances. Carolina won only six games this year, and Newton has been terrific. But a great QB on a losing team always has trouble getting the attention given to a QB on a winning team. It has always been this way. If Carolina was in the playoffs, maybe we'd be hearing more about Newton. It also doesn't help that Carolina is a small market team that doesn't have a national following.

Plus, the reason Tebow is a story is because everyone who knows anything about football knows that his throwing arm is subpar. When he took over at Denver, the season looked lost. He was put in by management just as a way to please the fans in what was looking to be a disastrous season. He then saves the season and takes Denver not just to the playoffs, but past the wild-card stage and into New England. Tebow's obvious inferiority to elite quarterbacks coupled with his team's improbable presence in the playoffs is what made him a great story for the year.

The American media is not exactly known for understatement. This year the big story is Tebow. Next year if Carolina wins its first four games and Newton is raging, the media will be talking about how Newton is superbowl bound and maybe the best ever. This is what they do. Then we'll have Rush Limbaugh screaming about how the only reason people talk about Newton is because he's a black guy playing a position that is typically played by a white guy. Ask Donavon McNabb about that.

I don't think it is his whiteness that matters. I think it is demonstrable Christianity.

IIRC, Tebow's jersey was the best-selling jersey in 2010. It was top ten last year at the start of the year even though he was still a backup QB. People were not buying that jersey because of any reason other than symbolic value; he wasn't expected to succeed. His jersey sales were, in fact, higher before he was a starter rather than afterwards.

Newton got plenty of hype at the start of the year, and was in the media all the time; he started his career with two 400-yard passing games and broke the all-time QB rushing TD record. The media hasn't been silent on him at all and he's been rightly hyped as the consensus Rookie of the Year. That being said, at no point has Newton appeared on the front page of CNN over and over again. When the Panthers have won, the story hasn't been "CAM NEWTON DOES IT AGAIN". Cam Newton is not bandied about every single day in the media. As mentioned in the football thread, the yesterday one of the pre-game shows referred to Mike McCoy as "Tebow's offensive coordinator" in a graphic, not Denver's offensive coordinator. That is what the Tebow hype has done.

Tebow is hyped because he is white and an evangelical Christian, and he's a symbol of what a large portion of people think is good and right. Cam Newton is not. This is absolutely and utterly about race and symbolism.

This year the big story is Tebow.

And the focus should really be the team around him. Those guys are so good they can carry a crappy quarterback and win anyway.

The fact that the story is about Tebow, when his team is infinitely more interesting, is just all kinds of wrong.

I think if Cam Newton were obnoxiously demonstrative about his faith as a born again Christian, he would probably get more press as well.

There may be a racial component to it (there invariably is), but I think that the religious one is probably of greater significance.

Joe Flacco, for instance, is white, a better quarterback in just about every respect, and garners no respect either in or out of Baltimore. Even in his worst year in the last three, he still comes out with hugely better stats than Tebow. Much of that has to do with the fact that he generally keeps his mouth shut and just plays.

Malor wrote:
This year the big story is Tebow.

And the focus should really be the team around him. Those guys are so good they can carry a crappy quarterback and win anyway.

The fact that the story is about Tebow, when his team is infinitely more interesting, is just all kinds of wrong.

His team isn't more interesting. Prior to Tebow taking over, his team was headed to an Indianapolis-level season. I don't think you'll find too many football analysts who would say that if you pulled out Tebow and slipped in a different QB then Denver would be Super Bowl-bound. Tebow hasn't claimed all the credit for his victories, and his teammates seem to like him. It's the sports media that decided to make him a story. And yes, Tebow's public Christianity helps him with a segment of the fan market, but that's normal. Kurt Warner and Drew Brees are both very public about their faith. It's part of the marketing of the game.

MilkmanDanimal wrote:

When the Panthers have won, the story hasn't been "CAM NEWTON DOES IT AGAIN".

Did the Panthers win with a mediocre QB? No. They lost with a great QB. And they only won six times. That's not a really interesting story to a broad national audience. Carolina is a small market team that doesn't get a lot of national exposure week to week.

The problem with looking at Newton in relation to Tebow is that if you go purely on skill, then Newton is one of the top 6-7 guys in a year when Brady, Rogers, and Brees were tossing up awesome stats week to week. If he was a white guy, would you be claiming that he wasn't getting enough exposure? That it was fair for the sports media to talk up the top three and leave him out?

So, uh, what exactly differentiates a black style of quarterbacking from a white one? Is it just a tendency/willingness to scramble and run head-first?

Tim Tebow's style of play works great in high school and college but doesn't translate well to the NFL. The kid has won at the high school and college level but is going to struggle to keep his job in the NFL. Read options and QB's playing RB doesn't work because the defenders are too big and too fast. The NFL is littered with the bodies of great college QB's who couldn't make the transition. Guys like Eric Couch and Vince Young come to mind.

Tebow's success this year was a combination of playing on team with a great defense and opposing teams being incredibly stupid. Now that teams have a few games worth of film on TT, he'll see less and less success.

It's possible that the Bronco's will build and offense around Tebow's unique skill set but it's unlikely because if he gets hurt their season is over. There's reason you don't see a lot of teams running the wishbone in the pros.

As for his religious fervor, I could care less. I just wish I didn't have to hear about it. I don't think he asked for it to become part of his overall identity but it is and he doesn't seem to mind.

4xis.black wrote:

So, uh, what exactly differentiates a black style of quarterbacking from a white one? Is it just a tendency/willingness to scramble and run head-first?

That was news to me as well. I had never known that there were certain ethnic styles of quarterbacking.

I'm still struggling with the concept that Eminem is considered talented...or even good. Then I remember that for commercial rap I guess he would be considered talented.

TheGameguru wrote:

I'm still struggling with the concept that Eminem is considered talented...or even good. Then I remember that for commercial rap I guess he would be considered talented.

Wow. Well, a lot of us consider him to be quite talented. He's skilled, technically proficient and just interesting to listen to. Plus he managed to make a movie that was half decent which most musicians never do. He's talented.

Paleocon wrote:

I think if Cam Newton were obnoxiously demonstrative about his faith as a born again Christian, he would probably get more press as well.

There may be a racial component to it (there invariably is), but I think that the religious one is probably of greater significance.

Actually, if Cam Newton were obnoxiously demonstrative about his faith I don't think he'd get treated the same as Tebow. Remember this guy?

IMAGE(http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photo_StoryLevel/080315/080315-wright-obama-hmed-7a.grid-6x2.jpg)

In all seriousness, though, I think there is a race angle here. That being that not only does the 24/7 media cycle love a good Christian, but they love reporting on one who seems like a throwback to the "good old days".

Thin_J wrote:
NathanialG wrote:

Whoa. Eminem has real talent. It isnt just that he is a white rapper, the man has amazing rhymes and some things to say. Tebow is just some mediocre QB that got lucky and will not stick around for over a decade. There is no real comparison.

He says it so the rest of us don't have to.

I'm sure he's gotten better since I decided not to pay attention to him.

wordsmythe wrote:
Thin_J wrote:
NathanialG wrote:

Whoa. Eminem has real talent. It isnt just that he is a white rapper, the man has amazing rhymes and some things to say. Tebow is just some mediocre QB that got lucky and will not stick around for over a decade. There is no real comparison.

He says it so the rest of us don't have to.

I'm sure he's gotten better since I decided not to pay attention to him.

Would you believe he is exactly the same as he was when he debuted?

I assumed the Tebow mania had a good deal to do with the "Rudy" factor. (ie. subpar underdog guy with a big heart leads his team to victory)

A couple words in Tebow's defense.

First, it is as absurd to blame him exclusively for the media frenzy that surrounds him as it is to exclusively credit him for the Bronco's success. I've seen nothing to imply he seeks screen time beyond being a NFL quarterback. Having his job involves a certain amount of media attention. Tautology: he has his job. Ergo... He also has an unusual attribute in that he's visibly religious. At its heart this is just a new, odd thing. The press runs with it because if news commentators don't run with stuff like that the 900 hours a week of NFL coverage boils down to repeating the scores and 899 hours of padding. When you get something like this, and it seems to resonate with a lot of fans, of course they're going to run with it. SportsCenter will run with it exactly as far as the ratings will take them. Everyone who watches SC is exactly as responsible for it as everyone else. I haven't seen much to imply he courts the spotlight and much to imply his religion is a serious part of him, not an affectation.

Secondly, it's just as silly to blame him for being religious. In the end, what has that hurt? Not a thing. From his perspective, the religion thing is probably just as powerful a grounding agent as anything. Given how much furor goes on about this kid, it would be incredibly easy for him to lose his mind in any direction. If you think about how many people hate him, how many people love him, his erratic record, and the fact that he seems to recognize both his own limitations and the serious risks of being fired from his job they impart, getting excessive about something as a simple way to vent stress and stay grounded could well be a necessity. And what did he pick? He prays a lot. Honestly, how is this a problem? Really?

Third, regarding his merits, let's look at what this guy does. His scores aren't that hot, but quarterbacks have an undeniable second role as team leaders, and there he's done very well. Yes, he's had good luck and a good team. Absolutely. He's also been quick to credit them. From what I've read, he has displayed real leadership and has improved morale. Other, statistically better, QBs have failed to do that. There's no stat that measures leadership nor its reciprocal, morale-breaking-cockbaggery.

He lead a decent team to decent success. He was flavor of the month, provided a narrative, and gave a bunch of annoying talking heads something to talk about.

Heaven help us if the sports-narrative types find out about Jon Jones.

All I know is that Tebow is responsible for my Facebook feed (since I only use it for my closest friends and my family) becoming nigh-unreadable with all the religious crap. It's as if he's Jesus Christ reborn as an NFL quarterback, and a walking poster-child for the pro-life movement. *shrug*

I'm not a football fan, and obviously I'm not a fan of evangelicals either. So it's pretty much the same for me as back when Facebook was nothing but a massive daily dose of Farmville spam.

Miashara wrote:

He prays a lot. Honestly, how is this a problem? Really?

That's the part of the dislike I don't get. Public display of religion doesn't bother me outside of politics, where it usually involves telling someone what to do based on "what God wants," or when it's used to berate gay people or sexual active girls.

I'm not religious, but I generally don't have any issues with those who are - in fact, I find they are on average more generous and selfless than others (when they stay out of other people's bedrooms).

My problem with Tebow is with the notion that God or Jesus or whoever cares more about helping you win your football game than helping those who are actually suffering.

Dysplastic wrote:

I'm not religious, but I generally don't have any issues with those who are - in fact, I find they are on average more generous and selfless than others (when they stay out of other people's bedrooms).

My problem with Tebow is with the notion that God or Jesus or whoever cares more about helping you win your football game than helping those who are actually suffering.

Well, the explanation I've heard on occasion is that it isn't God's job to alleviate suffering. It's his job to bring glory to himself and our job to comply. If that can be achieved by saving a bunch of kids from an elementary school fire, great! If it brings more glory for a demonstratively religious celebrity to win a football game, even better!

Dysplastic wrote:

My problem with Tebow is with the notion that God or Jesus or whoever cares more about helping you win your football game than helping those who are actually suffering.

Exactly.

Semi-relatedly, I keep waiting for these T-Shirts to show up.

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/aOM98.png)

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