Stupid little bags of testosterone

trichy wrote:

I may have to give this one a shot, dammit.

Tequila is never the answer.

TheHipGamer wrote:
trichy wrote:

I may have to give this one a shot, dammit.

Tequila is never the answer.

That is just not true.

Ghostship wrote:

Oh, and if my completely unfounded thoughts on psychology are correct, you daughter will probably feel most comfortable with what she knows. As difficult a leap as it may be to make, she'll probably be naturally attracted and feel most comfortable with a boyfriend whose values, mannerisms, social standing, behaviour... are more like... her dad's. *sheilds face with arm, cautiously peering beyond* From your earlier post it looks like the key factor for this to be true is in place. She has to have the best opinion of Dad, for that to be a safe comfortable place.

No, this is definitely a true point. Parents have a major effect on their kids. I've seen it in myself and my siblings. Everything we ever hated about our parents persists in us, and it actually makes me afraid of how I might turn out in a long-term relationship.

My Dad never really disciplined my sister. It was always my mom. As a result, my sister and mom have some deep grudges against each other. No matter how bad my sister got, though, my Dad always gave her the most approval.

Most of her relationships have been with men without a spine. Not to say my Dad doesn't have a spine. But the way my Dad treats my mom and my brother and me has transferred to how my sister treats other people. Her boyfriends have no thought to themselves, no spine, and no goals or motivation. She basically gets bored of them not having goals or motivation and moves on.

Except for the one nice guy, a real decent dude, that wasn't willing to deal with her crap. That ended ugly.

It may not be that children look for EXACTLY what their parents were, but girls that are given nothing but toys as a sign of affection grow up believing vanity is love. Girls without a positive male role model may end up dating some bad guys because they don't know what to look for.

The same rings true for men, too. I'd say you should see if there's a way to meet this boy's parents. See what they are like. However, that's not to say that is a good way to tell if the kid is good to go. Some parents are really nice, and their kid is a total c*ck bag. Other parents are absolutely horrible, yet the kid turns out pretty decent. But, it can help.

The line between being actively involved in a kid's life and being over-bearing is super-thin, though.

trichy wrote:

Part of my negative reaction to Susan and Dorothy was the fact that they ... dressed like hobos with leprosy.

Tell me, how do they feel about Soundgarden? Do they acknowledge that Dave Grohl was a better drummer than lead singer?

trichy wrote:

I may have to give this one a shot, dammit.

Funny, that's exactly what Craig was thinking

I kid, but if this guy isn't trying to do a swift one, at least he has the forethought to treat the parental figures of the girl he likes with some respect and conduct himself with dignity. For what it's worth, I dare say he will do the same with your daughter.

After my neighbor and his wife called it quits and officially moved out from each other I would get tapped on occasion to give him a hand when he had the girls(both under 5) for the weekend. Having fun with the girls on the weekend involved taking them climbing, cutest climbing shoes ever, and skiing. His theory was that his girls would be the most bad ass chicks once they hit their teens and started dating. Also, the boys would be unable to keep up and through some form of natural selection they would be killed off as they tried to.

trichy wrote:
peedmyself wrote:

It could be worse, when I was in junior high the hot girls all dated university guys for a while. I don't think any of us knew it was a crime at the time.

MURDER.

So Craig stopped by last night. He was polite, introduced himself to Jen and me, called us ma'am and sir, and actually dressed decently. Part of my negative reaction to Susan and Dorothy was the fact that they were smug little bastards who acted like little sh*ts around Emily's mom and dressed like hobos with leprosy. Craig brought Emily daisies, sat and visited with her for about half an hour, then thanked me and Jen and left.

I may have to give this one a shot, dammit.

That's a good sign for your daughter, too. She likes him and not the hobos.

Helping all your children be badass in some fashion like that works pretty well just as a goal in and of itself. It won't keep away the good ones. My daughter still does the car maintenance and some repairs for her husband. He is allowed to hold the flashlight and hand her stuff. He thinks it's sexy.

You have to help them keep a certain balance in mind, too. She may tease him about his Deathmobile truck but if she wants something painted, she consults with him on the color and then steps back and holds the ladder for him. That's what he does, and he does it very well and she respects that.

They have their trials. My daughter is an incredibly strong person and can be stubborn as hell; she drops my jaw sometimes. He's still trying to figure out what he wants to be when he grows up in a lot of ways. They work at being married just like everyone else does. When they have issues, they have shown they know how to give and take. It augers well for their eventual success from where I sit on the sidelines anyways. Ask me again in 10 years.

The part about picking someone like your Dad is complicated. But I can say in his case there are some serious similarities between him and my ex. Not creepy ones, but more correlations than you would expect from a random population sample. On the other hand, my ex isn't anything like my step dad, or my real father. You've given me some food for thought on this one.

NathanialG wrote:
TheHipGamer wrote:
trichy wrote:

I may have to give this one a shot, dammit.

Tequila is never the answer.

That is just not true.

He's right! Stick with whiskey.

InspectorFowler wrote:

SuperDave, they were doing that 15 years ago, and I presume even before that.

Dammit, InspectorFowler. All this time I've been thinking I was just born 10 years too soon, and now I find out I was just hopelessly useless with the ladies as a teen.

Ghostship wrote:

Oh, and if my completely unfounded thoughts on psychology are correct, you daughter will probably feel most comfortable with what she knows. As difficult a leap as it may be to make, she'll probably be naturally attracted and feel most comfortable with a boyfriend whose values, mannerisms, social standing, behaviour... are more like... her dad's.

Hmm. Given that my wife's father was an abusive alcoholic, this theory doesn't speak well to my strength of character. :0

His theory was that his girls would be the most bad ass chicks once they hit their teens and started dating.

My brother did that. Since he ran a military training facility, he was able to pass on skills well beyond the basics of pistol, rifle, shotgun, unarmed and knife work, as well a tactical entries and the like. I won't get within ten feet of his daughters without a visual check to see what they are carrying at the moment, and what mood they are in.

As for correlations between parents and SOs, it's not always that direct. What a child sees as important (for good or ill) about their parents are going to inform what they look for in a mate and in themselves as they grow. Oftentimes that comes out as a reaction against previous models as it does anything else. Things like dating a teetotaler because you have an alcoholic parent, or swinging back the other way and being attracted to someone who enjoys alcohol frequently but makes a point of doing it responsibly.

And honestly, it's often easy to overlook a parent's good qualities because they aren't the "squeaky wheel" that flaws can be. An otherwise fantastic father who could never hold a steady job may most be remembered for the economic stress he put the family through, unfortunately.

I'll say this - my own kid is a toddler but I have several nieces and nephews who are about the age of your daughter. I've seen heard from them about some pretty outrageous behavior from classmates. If these boys are being polite and bringing over gifts, then just keep in mind they are probably way ahead of a lot of their peers. That doesn't mean you should be happy that your daughter will be dating soon, just that it could be a lot worse. I know I'm probably overblowing things, but it does seem like today's youth have far less respect for others than kids even in the late 80s early 90s when I was growing up. A lot of the a-hat behavior that's encouraged online seems to bleed over into real life. Also, they seem to drink more and have sex at much younger ages. My teacher friends talk about a sizable minority of 8th graders and high school freshmen being sexually active. That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

jdzappa wrote:

That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

What are the chances the current kids are lying too?

Something I don't think has been mentioned in this thread is the prevalence of the "My child would never do that" angle. As much as I'm sure she's an absolute angel, how do you react if your daughter is the one who won't leave the boys alone. It works both ways.

gregrampage wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

What are the chances the current kids are lying too?

Good question but in the past couple years teen birth rates have been spiking.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/...

I'm not pretending that my classmates and I were perfect in high school, but today's "hook up" culture didn't really exist. And for me it's less about judging these kids than being very concerned.

gregrampage wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

What are the chances the current kids are lying too?

Good question but in the past couple years teen birth rates have been spiking.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/...

I'm not pretending that my classmates and I were perfect in high school, but today's "hook up" culture didn't really exist. And for me it's less about judging these kids than being very concerned.

People think that I am getting a shotgun because I like clay pigeon shooting. I'm getting a shotgun because I have a daughter.

She's only 3, but I really want to practice.

CheezePavilion wrote:
jdzappa wrote:
gregrampage wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

What are the chances the current kids are lying too?

Good question but in the past couple years teen birth rates have been spiking.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/...

I'm not pretending that my classmates and I were perfect in high school, but today's "hook up" culture didn't really exist. And for me it's less about judging these kids than being very concerned.

Wait, were any of us in high school only a couple of years ago? And why is something published in 2010 talking about numbers from 2006?

See, I've been seeing articles like this that seem to indicate a recent drop in teen pregnancy and sexual activity rates. But to be fair, for a parent, those statistics only matter if your kid falls in the negative category.

jdzappa wrote:
gregrampage wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

What are the chances the current kids are lying too?

Good question but in the past couple years teen birth rates have been spiking.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/...

I'm not pretending that my classmates and I were perfect in high school, but today's "hook up" culture didn't really exist. And for me it's less about judging these kids than being very concerned.

Wait, were any of us in high school only a couple of years ago? And why is something published in 2010 talking about numbers from 2006?

jdzappa wrote:

I know I'm probably overblowing things, but it does seem like today's youth have far less respect for others than kids even in the late 80s early 90s when I was growing up. A lot of the a-hat behavior that's encouraged online seems to bleed over into real life. Also, they seem to drink more and have sex at much younger ages. My teacher friends talk about a sizable minority of 8th graders and high school freshmen being sexually active. That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

From the article:
"We do know that when we saw the big decline in the '90s, that a lot of that decline was due to improved contraceptive use among teens."

Well, they may be having more sex, but it also looks like they were more responsible with birth control than your generation. If there was a drop in pregnancy rate between 1996-2006 it seems they were being *more* responsible than the kids from the late 80s/early 90s.

trichy wrote:
CheezePavilion wrote:
jdzappa wrote:
gregrampage wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

That was really, really rare when I was in high school. We all lied about scoring, but I'm pretty sure almost all of my freshmen classmates were virgins.

What are the chances the current kids are lying too?

Good question but in the past couple years teen birth rates have been spiking.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/...

I'm not pretending that my classmates and I were perfect in high school, but today's "hook up" culture didn't really exist. And for me it's less about judging these kids than being very concerned.

Wait, were any of us in high school only a couple of years ago? And why is something published in 2010 talking about numbers from 2006?

See, I've been seeing articles like this that seem to indicate a recent drop in teen pregnancy and sexual activity rates. But to be fair, for a parent, those statistics only matter if your kid falls in the negative category.

Sure--if you're a parent, *nothing* matters nearly as much as whichever category your kid falls in.

Bonus_Eruptus wrote:

Dammit, InspectorFowler. All this time I've been thinking I was just born 10 years too soon, and now I find out I was just hopelessly useless with the ladies as a teen.

Well, I had this surefire trick back when I was single/dating. It was a combination of being pretty funny, charming, and genuinely interested in what girls were about. When I hear other guys talk about their high school/college years, I realize a couple things - one is that, yes, I missed out on all the bars and the drinking and the random hookups. But two is that a very, very average looking guy can still "score" if he defines scoring as "legitimately making a girl feel really special without lying to her so that she reciprocates his feelings of attraction".

It wasn't intentional at all. I just knew that I wasn't good looking enough to just "pick up" girls, so I just figured I should be myself. I was hopelessly smitten by many a young lady, and you'd be surprised how much young ladies like a guy who is fascinated by them.

The filthy side of this, of course, is that young ladies are just as hormone-driven as young men. When you skip all the bulls*** posturing and pretending, and establish an actual trust with a girl, you'd be surprised who will be interested in what...activities.

I do not miss those years, because for every girl I was interested in, there was obviously a heartbreak somewhere down the road. My wife and I have been married 10 years now, and they will have to literally pry one of us out of the other one's (hopefully not cold) dead fingers.

I was really more concerned about teh buttsex, but good advice nonetheless.

Hmm. I wonder if kids are as naive an clueless as some of my generation was in jr. high school.

Spoilered for parental sanity:

Spoiler:

Some silly clucks out there thought that oral/anal/manual/etc. "didn't count" somehow, and that as long as vaginal penetration didn't occur, you were still technically a virgin.

In sum, I think proper sex ed is key. Specifically, one that isn't abstinence-focused. I went from a school district with a good program to a school with a poor one (lower-middle-class urban to upper-middle-class suburban), and the number of pregnancies/abortions/std's between the two was noticeably different. Teaching kids "don't do this fun, new, awesome thing I don't want to think about you doing!" pretty much guarantees they'll do it all the more.

Amoebic wrote:
Spoiler:

Some silly clucks out there thought that oral/anal/manual/etc. "didn't count" somehow, and that as long as vaginal penetration didn't occur, you were still technically a virgin.

Sadly that's still around.

Spoiler:

It's actually very common among Christians who want to save themselves for marriage but really don't. Specifically the anal part. I think most people agree oral/manual doesn't count for virginity.

gregrampage wrote:
Amoebic wrote:
Spoiler:

Some silly clucks out there thought that oral/anal/manual/etc. "didn't count" somehow, and that as long as vaginal penetration didn't occur, you were still technically a virgin.

Sadly that's still around.

Spoiler:

It's actually very common among Christians who want to save themselves for marriage but really don't. Specifically the anal part. I think most people agree oral/manual doesn't count for virginity.

Spoiler:

I think the term for those people is "bareback Christians".

SuperDave wrote:
gregrampage wrote:
Amoebic wrote:
Spoiler:

Some silly clucks out there thought that oral/anal/manual/etc. "didn't count" somehow, and that as long as vaginal penetration didn't occur, you were still technically a virgin.

Sadly that's still around.

Spoiler:

It's actually very common among Christians who want to save themselves for marriage but really don't. Specifically the anal part. I think most people agree oral/manual doesn't count for virginity.

Spoiler:

I think the term for those people is "bareback Christians".

It's amazing how many ways there are to say "frickin' idiot" in the English language.

These words... I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

You people are killing *Legion*!

It's a special kind of community that can listen sympathetically to a father's concerns for his daughter's well being, and within four pages, offer both heartfelt advice and anal sex commentary.