New tech allows planes to fly when damaged...

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I did a search and couldn't find a topic on this but..... holy cow, this is cool! Some technical/programming wiz-bangery has been performed on a model aircraft to be able to survive significant damage and still fly!

http://www.rockwellcollins.com/news/video/damage-tolerance.html

This is pretty cool. This needs to be in a flight sim game

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Back in 83 an Israeli F-15 landed without its right wing, but that's only relevant to the pre-edit. Having looked it up I'm going to post it .

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Edit? By what mancy do you think me capable of, sir?

I'm not familiar with that F15 thing... but was that pilot skill rather than a control thing? I think that the point of this is that most pilots will either panic and bail or panic and die.... Neither being great.... though to be fair. If you're hit once the chances are that your aerodynamics will be pretty shot - reducing your maneuverability and the chances that you'll get hit again.

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Some stuff about it that aired on History Channel. Sounds like he wasn't fully aware of the extent of the damage until afterwards.

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My Dad actually contracted with Rockwell Collins at one point in the last couple years, though I don't think he was working on this particular project.

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Duoae wrote:
I'm not familiar with that F15 thing... but was that pilot skill rather than a control thing?

To be honest, the first thing I thought when reading this was that WWII planes also had this "feature." That certainly was more about pilot skill, though.

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A while back I read an article about a university doing research on how bats fly since they have incredible maneuverability even when missing more than half the surface area of their wings. I think it'll still be a long while before we see an airplane that flaps but every now and then you come across something that makes Creationism look a little less crazy.

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wordsmythe wrote:
Duoae wrote:
I'm not familiar with that F15 thing... but was that pilot skill rather than a control thing?

To be honest, the first thing I thought when reading this was that WWII planes also had this "feature." That certainly was more about pilot skill, though.

Really? I wouldn't have thought that the relatively low airspeeds of WWII planes would have been able to keep the lift up for long enough to fly them. Any links to planes from that era surviving losing most of their wing?

[edit] Re-reading my title i suppose you could be thinking about minor damage like bullet holes etc?

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Duoae wrote:
wordsmythe wrote:
Duoae wrote:
I'm not familiar with that F15 thing... but was that pilot skill rather than a control thing?

To be honest, the first thing I thought when reading this was that WWII planes also had this "feature." That certainly was more about pilot skill, though.

Really? I wouldn't have thought that the relatively low airspeeds of WWII planes would have been able to keep the lift up for long enough to fly them. Any links to planes from that era surviving losing most of their wing?

[edit] Re-reading my title i suppose you could be thinking about minor damage like bullet holes etc?

Yeah, a few bullet holes isn't a big deal. The F-15 in question lost its wing. Its ENTIRE wing. Nothing left but a spray of smoke and leaking fuel.

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A significant amount of lift on the F-15 comes from the shape of the fuselage, so losing most of the wing didn't result in a complete loss of lift on that side. The aircraft was traveling light, I think, and the pilot had a lot of power on hand to keep the plane fast enough where it could stay in air.

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Duoae wrote:
wordsmythe wrote:
Duoae wrote:
I'm not familiar with that F15 thing... but was that pilot skill rather than a control thing?

To be honest, the first thing I thought when reading this was that WWII planes also had this "feature." That certainly was more about pilot skill, though.

Really? I wouldn't have thought that the relatively low airspeeds of WWII planes would have been able to keep the lift up for long enough to fly them. Any links to planes from that era surviving losing most of their wing?

[edit] Re-reading my title i suppose you could be thinking about minor damage like bullet holes etc?

Yeah, I was thinking originally of bombers with 3 of 4 engines dead, etc. I think I've heard stories of half-missing wings, but that's it.

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Funkenpants wrote:
A significant amount of lift on the F-15 comes from the shape of the fuselage, so losing most of the wing didn't result in a complete loss of lift on that side. The aircraft was traveling light, I think, and the pilot had a lot of power on hand to keep the plane fast enough where it could stay in air.

Honestly, though, I don't think F-15s have enough power to keep the plane fast enough to outrun the sh*t that would be continuously geysering from my freaked out sphincter.

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ColdForged wrote:
Funkenpants wrote:
A significant amount of lift on the F-15 comes from the shape of the fuselage, so losing most of the wing didn't result in a complete loss of lift on that side. The aircraft was traveling light, I think, and the pilot had a lot of power on hand to keep the plane fast enough where it could stay in air.

Honestly, though, I don't think F-15s have enough power to keep the plane fast enough to outrun the sh*t that would be continuously geysering from my freaked out sphincter.

Ew, gross.
That's gross.
You're gross.

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wordsmythe wrote:
Yeah, I was thinking originally of bombers with 3 of 4 engines dead, etc. I think I've heard stories of half-missing wings, but that's it.

Sure, there are numerous pictures and stories of bombers coming home with ridiculous battle-damage, including partially missing wings, vertical stabilisers, chunks of the fuselage, and even the nose of the aircraft. I think part of the issue that that the media portrays aircraft as flying deathtraps just waiting to spin out of control the moment it hits a gnat, but in fact this is far from the truth.

Airliners, for example, can glide if they lose all engine power. Sure, you'll be trading altitude for airspeed, but as long as you don't run out of both at the same time (as the pilot saying goes), it's possible to land it. The A-10 is designed to be able to take heavy damage to its wings, fuselage, and engines without airworthiness failure. Modern fighters derive a lot of their lift from their fuselage (note the near symmetry of their wing camber), hence their ability to fly upside down and on their side without losing altitude.

LobsterMobster wrote:
I think it'll still be a long while before we see an airplane that flaps but every now and then you come across something that makes Creationism look a little less crazy.

Er, no. Interestingly, the Wright brothers originally had a warping-wing control scheme, but ailerons carried the day. Now, warping wing technology with advanced materials is being tested for bleeding-edge fighters. Flapping wings were tried for a long time as people tried to imitate birds to fly. It wasn't until asymmetric wings were designed that we were able to gain flight, and I don't see flapping wings as being useful in any sense beyond perhaps tiny drones, as I doubt it scales well.

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ColdForged wrote:
Honestly, though, I don't think F-15s have enough power to keep the plane fast enough to outrun the sh*t that would be continuously geysering from my freaked out sphincter.

That's why Boeing is working on a special automated evacuation system under a $300 million Pentagon contract. According to the manufacturer, a sensor package monitors the size of the pilot's sphincter and responds with a high speed vacuum when it determines a geyser event is about to occur.

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Physically altering the lift surface to affect flight characteristics could be a huge advance in the speed of the plane, as you go faster and faster you need less lift relative to forward thrust, and the need to reduce drag becomes more important, and inversely on takeoff you could maximize lift to get off the ground on a much shorter runway than a conventional plane of similiar size/weight.

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Nosferatu wrote:
Physically altering the lift surface to affect flight characteristics could be a huge advance in the speed of the plane, as you go faster and faster you need less lift relative to forward thrust, and the need to reduce drag becomes more important, and inversely on takeoff you could maximize lift to get off the ground on a much shorter runway than a conventional plane of similiar size/weight.

Very true, hence variable geometry wings, as seen on the F-14, F-111, B-1B, Tornado, among others.

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Eh, this isn't really anything new. The F-117 was fly by wire, and planes since then have been largely so as well. Because of that, even with no damage, the plane does more flying than the pilot does. Still cool tech nonetheless though

This is not to say the pilot has nothing to do with it, but increasingly less incidents, including the Israeli F-15, and a US F-16, are brought back due to pilot skill as opposed to computer control. For the pilot skill deals, look for an A-10 missing an engine from Gulf War I. Those are nearly universally pilot skill.

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