Is John McCain an American citizen?

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Paleocon's picture
Location: Cabin John, MD

Interesting article.

"McCain was born in Colon, Panama, on the Atlantic Side of Panama. There was no military or US civilian hospital on the Atlantic at that time he was born. This is the reason there are no Canal Zone Health Department records. He was not born in the Canal Zone. His birth record is right in the Colon Hospital, Panama, records along with every one born on the Atlantic Side of Panama who was living in the Canal Zone at that time. His birth location of Colon is no secret in Panama. In fact, those of us from the Canal Zone are amazed about his "military hospital birth" claim which is pure fiction"

There is only an up or down--up to a man's age-old dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order--or down to the ant heap totalitarianism,... those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course.

Finger of God
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Staats's picture
Location: Minnesota

If parents are U.S. citizens, the children should be U.S. citizens.

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Paleocon's picture
Location: Cabin John, MD

Staats wrote:
If parents are U.S. citizens, the children should be U.S. citizens.

Yes and no:

Quote:
Jus Sanguinis. "Right of blood." Anybody born outside the U.S. to U.S. citizens has right to U.S. citizenship. My retired State Department informants believe that these children are also "natural born" and have the right to become president. So do Tribe and Olsen. But other constitutional lawyers, like Professor Duggin, say the issue is not clear cut. The constitution is ambiguous and the point has never been argued before the Supreme Court.

Normally, parents of children in the Jus Sanguinis category file a Form 240 Report of Birth to the local U.S. Consulate to establish the right to citizenship. For what it's worth, it does not seem that McCain's parents filed such a form. Looking through State Department records at the National Archives, I found numerous Forms 240 filed for children born in the Canal Zone in 1936, but no such form for Senator McCain. (The fact that his parents did not file the form does not mean that he is not a citizen, just that it could be a little more difficult to prove.)

There is only an up or down--up to a man's age-old dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order--or down to the ant heap totalitarianism,... those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course.

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OG_slinger's picture

So he's a filthy immigrant? Deport him! Build a fence around him!

Goin' Commando
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Edwin's picture
Location: Miami, FL

Can we restart the republican primary? Maybe this time we can get a decent candidate.

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Paleocon's picture
Location: Cabin John, MD

Edwin wrote:
Can we restart the republican primary? Maybe this time we can get a decent candidate.

Don't blame me. I voted for Romney.

There is only an up or down--up to a man's age-old dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order--or down to the ant heap totalitarianism,... those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course.

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wordsmythe's picture
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Edwin wrote:
Can we restart the republican primary? Maybe this time we can get a decent candidate.

Ha!

rabbit wrote:

Wordsmythe is my hero.

1Dgaf wrote:
Then again, it's easy to be funny online.

bnpederson wrote:
I'm just upset at being removed from your sig.

XBL: E Munnie

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wordsmythe's picture
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Sorry, what I mean by that is that I think McCain's at least mediocre when compared with some of the options. Then again, I still hope that 2008 McCain is more like 2000 McCain than he seems.

rabbit wrote:

Wordsmythe is my hero.

1Dgaf wrote:
Then again, it's easy to be funny online.

bnpederson wrote:
I'm just upset at being removed from your sig.

XBL: E Munnie

Goin' Commando
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Edwin's picture
Location: Miami, FL

wordsmythe wrote:
Sorry, what I mean by that is that I think McCain's at least mediocre when compared with some of the options. Then again, I still hope that 2008 McCain is more like 2000 McCain than he seems.

He died when he sold his sole for the nomination. It's well documented in the other voting thread.

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Rat Boy's picture
Location: Hitting. It.

Edwin wrote:
wordsmythe wrote:
Sorry, what I mean by that is that I think McCain's at least mediocre when compared with some of the options. Then again, I still hope that 2008 McCain is more like 2000 McCain than he seems.

He died when he sold his sole for the nomination. It's well documented in the other voting thread.

Never make a pact with the Shoe Devil, I say.

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Paleocon's picture
Location: Cabin John, MD

Rat Boy wrote:
Edwin wrote:
wordsmythe wrote:
Sorry, what I mean by that is that I think McCain's at least mediocre when compared with some of the options. Then again, I still hope that 2008 McCain is more like 2000 McCain than he seems.

He died when he sold his sole for the nomination. It's well documented in the other voting thread.

Never make a pact with the Shoe Devil, I say.

you mean THIS shoe devil?

There is only an up or down--up to a man's age-old dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order--or down to the ant heap totalitarianism,... those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course.

Goin' Commando
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Edwin's picture
Location: Miami, FL

Damn it. SOUL.

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OG_slinger's picture

Paleocon wrote:
Rat Boy wrote:
Edwin wrote:
wordsmythe wrote:
Sorry, what I mean by that is that I think McCain's at least mediocre when compared with some of the options. Then again, I still hope that 2008 McCain is more like 2000 McCain than he seems.

He died when he sold his sole for the nomination. It's well documented in the other voting thread.

Never make a pact with the Shoe Devil, I say.

you mean THIS shoe devil?

Since I believe in science, I was hoping more for the Shoe Event Horizon.

Abandon All Hope
Chiggie Von Richthofen's picture
Location: Trying to choose a damn avatar.

I'm still keeping my stand that he is Vern from Dreamworks' Over the Hedge.

Indecisive
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Funkenpants's picture

Paleocon wrote:
But other constitutional lawyers, like Professor Duggin, say the issue is not clear cut. The constitution is ambiguous and the point has never been argued before the Supreme Court.

At first glance, I wouldn't want to be the lawyer burdended with arguing that a "natural born citizen" has to be born within the borders of the U.S. I wonder what the legal arguments in favor of such an interpretation are.

Finger of God
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Staats's picture
Location: Minnesota

Yea, it doesn't make a lot of practical sense. It's a road that (I hope) would lead to a constitutional amendment to clarify the issue.

Xbox Live: StaatsM

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OG_slinger's picture

Staats wrote:
Yea, it doesn't make a lot of practical sense. It's a road that (I hope) would lead to a constitutional amendment to clarify the issue.

Better be careful with that. I don't want to live to see the Terminator as President because we up and changed the Constitution.

Abandon All Hope
Chiggie Von Richthofen's picture
Location: Trying to choose a damn avatar.

See, my problem would be that he's a turtle. I don't think turtles should be able to run for office. If that makes me a specist, fine, but I don't think this country is ready for a turtle president.

It is interesting to see such a diverse race though.

You know.

Black, Woman, Turtle.

It's Jolly Time
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Jolly Bill's picture
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Demolition man wrote:
Even though he was not born in this country, his popularity at the time caused the 61st Amendment which states...

We've got a few amendments to go

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dhelor's picture
Location: Oregon

Chiggie Von Richthofen wrote:
I'm still keeping my stand that he is Vern from Dreamworks' Over the Hedge.

No, no, no. He's Piglet:

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Abandon All Hope
Chiggie Von Richthofen's picture
Location: Trying to choose a damn avatar.

I don't like the idea of a pig president either.

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dhelor's picture
Location: Oregon

Chiggie Von Richthofen wrote:
I don't like the idea of a pig president either.

Oh d-d-d-dear.

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Indecisive
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Funkenpants's picture

OG_slinger wrote:
I don't want to live to see the Terminator as President because we up and changed the Constitution.

Exactly. I'm pretty sure I don't want any of our current crop of leaders to go messing around with the constitution at this stage. The way D.C. works these days, to get the one clarification, we'll end up with 10 new amendments suiting various powerful lobbies on a "bipartisan" basis (these days, "bipartisan" is a code word for everyone f*cking you over rather than just one party or the other).

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Heh heh.

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Dwarfzilla_fuge's picture
Location: San Francisco

Staats wrote:
If parents are U.S. citizens, the children should be U.S. citizens.

They still have to fill out some paperwork.