Review of Baseball games(current 2). And the State of baseball games in general.
This review pretty much say's it all for me. Although all these new and cool features are challenging, the bottom line is that what allot of us want is an simple, easy game of baseball that play's well on-line, and of course gives us fairly realistic stat's and etc. so we can have a fun league play. Period. (many still hark back to EA's MVP 05 as the best bb game in recent memory).
Anyway, I couldn't agree more with the person's summation:
'...
April 3, 2008
GAME DAY
MLB 08 THE SHOW, MLB 2K8 make baseball a difficult game
MLB 08 The Show and MLB 2K8 may make you nostalgic for bygone video games.
By Pete Metzger, Special to The Times (Los Angeles)
The fictional manager of the Durham Bulls (played with grit by the late Trey Wilson) said it best in the classic film "Bull Durham." Baseball, he reflected, "is a simple game. You throw the ball. You hit the ball. You catch the ball."
So why do the makers of this year's crop of baseball video games have to make it so hard?
With "total control," gamers playing MLB 2K8 use the right stick to control just about everything. It takes a long time to get comfortable enough to make the game enjoyable. Timing exactly how to push the stick around is tough enough while throwing pitches; figuring out how to do it while hitting seems impossible. (Disabling the "total control" by switching the game to the button-pushing "classic control" mode is an improvement yet still overly complex.)
2K8 is also sloppier than the pine tar smeared on Vladimir Guerrero's batting helmet. The hideously rendered players stutter and jump around in ways that are telltale signs of a game rushed to market before it was finished. The one redeeming quality is the great announcers, voiced by ESPN's Jon Miller and Joe Morgan, two of the best (besides Dodger icon Vin Scully, of course).
Luckily, the controls in MLB08 The Show are simpler, albeit far from easy. Even on the rookie setting, the simplest play required a complex combination of buttons pressed at exactly the right time.
The visuals and polish of The Show, however, help break up the double play. The players look great and move fluidly and naturally, the stadiums look good and the interfaces are well designed and natural.
There is also a story line where gamers can create a player and work to get him to the majors, a nice wrinkle. Unfortunately, making your player good enough to land the hefty contract requires a lot of time using said lousy controls.
Remember the baseball games of 20 years ago? One button to pitch and one to hit? Simple, easy-to-control fun. Unfortunately, those days have gone the way of Ebbets Field.
Grades: MLB08 The Show, B- (good visuals, bad controls); MLB2K8, D (the Devil Rays of video games).
Details: MLB 08 The Show: PlayStation 3, PlayStation 2 and PlayStation portable platforms; $39.99-59.99; rated Everyone. MLB 2K8: All platforms; $29.99-$59.99; rated Everyone.
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"Luckily, the controls in MLB08 The Show are simpler, albeit far from easy. Even on the rookie setting, the simplest play required a complex combination of buttons pressed at exactly the right time."
Hm... pressing 'circle' to throw the ball to first is now considered a complex combination of buttons? Or perhaps he considers maneuvering an analog thumbstick in a given direction to position his fielder under a flyball a complex combination of buttons. After all, there are 360 degrees of possible movement inherent in that thumbstick... it's scary trying to figure out which is the right degree! Yes, metered pitching might require at least a good ten years of time having lived on this earth in order to suss out its intricacies, but both games kindly allow you simplify the controls to the point that you're basically playing RBI Baseball, if that's your thing.
"Remember the baseball games of 20 years ago? One button to pitch and one to hit?"
Yes, and we have come a long way, thankfully. I hear what you're saying though, Donan, when it comes to being locked into certain play mechanics for online and league play. They should let you simplify matters there too, if you like.
By the way, MLB '08: The Show for the PS3 just got a patch this morning, fixing some issues with incorrect stances, scoring errors on walk-off homeruns, and player fatigue.
www.roundersthecomic.com
I love MLB '08: The Show. Not because it's a baseball game but because it's an RPG. I'm always trying to improve my character's strength as I want a tank chracter. You know when mini-boss battles are coming up(usually first game of a series) and can actually tweak your character so that they have a better chance against them. The experience system works well as you can't just grind easy opponents forever, the game will bump you up to a higher difficulty. Combat is turn based. During each turn you can predict what the monster/pitcher will do and if you guess correctly you'll have a huge advantage. However if neither side wins that round, a new round starts up. The only downside is that during a turn the combat is timed and you need to make a split decision whether you should attack or defend.
As an RPG it's well done, as a professional baseball game, I dunno, I haven't played a single regular season game with an MLB team.
Certis wrote:
AOC: Jozak - Conqueror on Wiccana
XBL: elliottxW
I was more than pleased with MLB06 and MLB07:The Show on the PS2. They both rank higher than MVP05 for me. I've never even played Road to the Show. I'm a season/franchise kind of guy. It's amazing how natural and fluid the players moved around and the ball physics just felt right. I'm afraid to go back to play them, fearing it'd make me realize how shoddy the 2k games are.
That said, I've gotten used to 2K8 on the 360 even with its 'complicated' right analog stick and have really taken to the game. I have no real complaints after the latest patch. I'm actually playing a fairly realistic season right now winning and losing games with scores like 3-1, 5-3, with the right amount of base hits, etc.
I suspect The Show on the PS3 still blows 2k8 out of the water though. I'm seriously going to base my next console purchase on the strength of its baseball game.
Xbox Live: NOVOCAIN1217
I really enjoy both games. I play the show on the PSP and MLB2k8 on the 360. MLB is a more frustrating game, as it comes close to being good, but once again 2k's lack of post release support really cheeses me off. No roster update since February?!?!? The animations are BETTER than last years, but still in beta form, unfortunatley.
Also, if they would just steal the show's hitting interface, timing, aiming with the left stick and all, it would be a much better game.
All that said, I have had some great games with you guys and a few pubbies. You needn't throw all strikes online, but you should be around the plate. The more you play, the more you can evaluate a pitch in time to swing. But, it could be a lot better if you had more time.
You don't have to call me Lieutenant, Rosie......
XBox Live: SwampYankee68
I really want to like MLB 2K8, but man it fustrates me. Does anyone get 'normal' stats in a game?
And the fielding, although better then 2K7, still has allot to be desired. The 'collision' thing. The amazing game controlled players that 'assumes' the play is over and freezes what you can do with a player during a play. Example, I hit a ball down first. 1st baseman booted it and it trickled into right field, close to the right field line. The right fielder comes in to about a foot to the ball and 'freezes' there. Can't move it and I'm going, 'what the h*ll'. Then from off screen comes the center fielder...Yelp, I had to change players for some reason to make the right fielder field the ball when the center fielder was off the freaking screen. Geeze. Or when you hit a ball close to 2nd, shortstop ranges near the bag to field it and you want to flick it to 2nd baseman whose AT THE BAG. But no, it won't let you. It's 'assuming' you will cross the bag yourself before you throw it to first for a double-play. Geeeeze. And the usual fielding inconsistences. You not only have to practically stomp the ball in the ground before you can field it, but then have to stop motion and pick it up to throw it. I've read that it does not like you charging the ball all the way. It expects you to charge, stop, pick the ball up and make the play. And one last vent: if you hit a ball into the outfield, you absolutely have to make the right directional jump at the moment of bat contact of the ball, or your 'holes' are much, much larger. Whereas the AI fielder always make the correct dirctional jump AND makes these amazing catches...all the time. (has anyone seen the AI outfielders collide? Has anyone actually seen a AI fielder mishandle a ground ball? I've seen infield boots and miscues. But don't recollect any outfield ones.
I really like many things about 2K8. I really like the pitching interface (very cool is that different Umps, have different called strike zones). The throwing of the ball in the field with the stick. But as Swampy mentions, the game fustrates the heck out of me. I want to like it, but I have so much more fun with my PS 2 'The Show'. Not just doing the module, 'Road to the Show' (which is loads of fun!), but playing a league (yes, choices to manage, franchise AND just play a league). So yes, I play both. One to enjoy in SP. One to play and get fustrated in SP. And of course to 'try' and play on-line with other GWJ'ers. It's absolutely rediculous that 2K could not make on-line play better. Look at FPS's that have sooooo much more going on and lag is 'rare'. True, the 'zones' of precise pitching, hitting and fielding only acerbates more from the poor on-line coding.
Well put. Too bad the developers cant read that Donan. But if you ever tried to post it on the 2k website the fanboys would eviscerate you.
You don't have to call me Lieutenant, Rosie......
XBox Live: SwampYankee68
Actually I took a gulp and did just that (i.e. posted this to the 2K site). On the whole, most folks there are gripping quite a bit. Several agreed with me. Couple mentioned using sliders for a more realistic game (can slider's be used for on-line, league play? If so, we should agree on some settings and everyone use them. This person mention a few for better play).
EDIT: Here's a nice thread on Slider's from 2k forums. And some links. I think I'll be trying SFGiant's to see how it goes:
http://2ksports.com/forums/showthread.php?t=167779
I just landed a PS3 and picked up a copy of The Show and while my impressions are preliminary it is, so far, the best baseball game I've played since High Heat 2002 for the PC. I'm a stickler for the batter/pitcher matchup in these games and The Show's is significantly better. To be fair, I did like the creativity of Total Control Pitching in 2k, but I was never able to get settings together that forced me to throw or receive an acceptable number of walks. In particular I never throw a walk in that game unless I'm intentionally pitching around a hitter. Using The Show's default setting I'm throwing around one or two walks a game, which is low, but still better and I'd imagine I can tweak that; I'm also seeing much more intense at bats with lots of foul balls and potential to miss my pitch target. Love it.
Likewise, I think the fielding in The Show is worlds better. The animations and gameplay are so much smoother than 2k it borders on ridiculous. Not to mention the game uses far better camera angles for balls hit into play and the stadiums feel much bigger and more realistic than in 2k. My only gripe is that outfielders in The Show cover a *ton* of ground and I think that cuts down on the number of hits that should go for extra bases. (Not sure I've seen a triple yet.) On the whole, I think The Show is just a superior game in nearly every possible way. (But again, I've only had about three hours with it so far.)
As for the article that kicked off this thread. I want to agree with the guy, but I think he takes it much too far. (Giving this game a B- is just ridiculous to me and I think Slumberland's reference to RBI Baseball is right on as to what that writer seems to be pining for.) You can have reasonably simple controls in-game if you want them and I really don't think The Show's controls are all that complicated to begin with. Personally, I'd rather see the franchise modes in these games get simpler. (I haven't messed with The Show's yet at all, but 2k's franchise mode is just plain tedious.)
---Todd
The Nut and the Feisty Weasel: A place where a deranged Ohio State Buckeye and a rabid Michigan Wolverine fan come together... and air grievances.
I have to agree for the most part with Ubrakto (Todd). I only play this on the PS 2, but the feel for baseball with the animation, announcers etc. is just so much better then 2K. I'm having loads of fun. I've played into June(about 2 1/2 months) in Road to the Show (Career Mode...great fun) and about 8 games in for a league. I actually fine 2K8 fielders more apt to catch anything. The Show has been about right for me. I can get them into the gaps or down the line better. I agree too, as I have before, I truly enjoy 2K's pitcher/batter interface, but again, you have to play with the slider's sooo much, and still no guarantee about walks and such. And too, I really like throwing to bases with the stick.
But The Show's, to go along with the article, is much simpler imho, but not so simple to take away the challenge (and too much of a challenge and I'm fighting the game, not the sport it's simulating). Lot's more analysis of what a pitcher tends to throw (gawd I miss that in 2K), batter tendencies etc. And yes, play field does seem larger and more 'real'. Not to be repetitive, but the ambiance and player animations are just so superior to 2K AND smoother (course I'm on the PS 2:>). The camera on plays is more interesting too. PLUS, I can control player's during plays to almost my hearts content (i.e. move them, throw wherever etc.), whereas 2K decides if you should participate, and for the most part your immediately shut down.
And there's a real love of the Game. Get this video of what happens if your pitcher just hangs out and what the other players tend to do:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Gc5eYrqaxu4
Only watched about half of that video (gotta get some work done before I leave work for the day), but that video is hysterical!
The Nut and the Feisty Weasel: A place where a deranged Ohio State Buckeye and a rabid Michigan Wolverine fan come together... and air grievances.