WoW: Battleground Obsession
I really don't know what has come over me. Temporary insanity of some sorts. I've been playing WoW for quite awhile. Before that AC for about 5 years. And for me, MMORPG is all about PvE. Never could get the 'fun' in PvP. Weird that, because I'm really into America's Army (yes, 'still') or any other FPS shooter that's good. But in a MMORPG? Nah. But now, whoaaa, I"m THERE. (and I ain't talking about ganking mayhem. I'm talking 'controlled' area's specifically for PvP purposes: Battleground.)
I want the rewards. I want the rankings. I want shiny things I couldn't get elsewhere unless on Raids. Raids I'll never get to do for the most part for I barely have time for Instances. Sure, this will probably hamstring me by not having the 'ultimate' shiny thing to whump with. But hey, we all chase our 'windmills'. But the deal is, I can't find all I need to know about Battlegrounds. How many points to get a rank? Where to get rewards? What strategies to use (especially for Paladin's. Blessings? Aura's etc.). I've experienced what it's like to be at the top of the hill, being at the high end of a level section. Now I'm at the low end (lowest) and even tho' I'm getting whupped badly, still try for a lick or too and ....enjoying it regardless:>) So even tho's I've searched how and low (for me), I know that there must be some sites I'm missing etc. (I'm not the best 'searcher')So any links would be great. That and I would like any insight's, discussions etc. from that battle hardened PvP vet's here.
I still would like to get a group of GWJ'er's together for this. Would be great fun and having a cohesive group to battle with is of course the way to go. But I've really seen little interest's from a post of enquiry thread I made elsewhere. I completely understand it's hard to coordinate do to jobs, family etc. (it is for me!). That and I've failed in my VOIP aspect in that I can hear, but not talk. Yes, it drives me batty, but I hopefully will have it fixed soon. But still, even if on the fly, it would be great. But I ain't the nagging type. I will query in game a bit, but if no response...It could be too folks are doing their own thing on the fly or have groups they do their thing with already. Whatever. It still would be fun as it has been in FPS's.
One7 wrote:If you use FuBar, the HonorFu plugin keeps track of some interesting stats like your win/loss record, honor for the day/week, % gained in your current rank etc etc. Hope this helpsHonorFu is outstanding.
Thanks Moon' for the clarifications.
karmajay wrote:I also find that it makes my love my Shatterer mace that much more. I got an Icy enchant on it specifically to make it more useful in BG's.
Haven't done any BG's in a long time, but I do remember enjoying them a lot. Arathi in particular. A little disappointing to hear how long the queues apparently are for this on Blackhand.
Does anyone know where or how to get a better sword (or mace if they seem better, but I'd like to stay with a sword) and get someone to put a good enchant on it? (my sword now is a level 23 blue. I'm on the verge of 31).
Thanks!
I've got no tips for PvP'ing as a paladin except that I hate it when they use the Hammer of GG. 
I suggest checking out the general PvP board and your class board. Edit: Also, listen to MoonDragon. He covered the basics of what I've observed Paladins (the good ones, anyone) doing from the other side of the Thin Red Line.
The only thing I can add is that, as a Shaman, I do best in a support role in a group. Yes, I can DPS, but if anyone (in range) requires healing, that's what I do (thanks Quickheal!). It is this fact that keeps getting me invited back to PvP groups with much more hardcore players. If no one requires healing, I'll fire off a Chain Lightning or Lightning Bolt and maybe a FROST SHOCK! and then get back to the healing. In general, my "routine" will go Heal, Heal, Heal, DPS, Heal, Heal, Heal, DPS, etc. This technique also lets me stack back off the front line and therefore keeps me in the action (i.e. having fun) longer because the enemy tends to focus on the closest target.
In my experience, if you're going to solo/PUG, do not go to AB. AV is the easiest place to blend into the crowd since it's so big and as long as you can get into the raid, you should get plenty of honor and rep with no problem. At the other end of the spectrum is WSG. Since the field is so small and the gameplay is so basic and everyone generally knows what to do, you're just as likely to get into a winning WSG as a solo/PUG as not. And then there's AB.
Because of its scope in both geography and group size, Arathi Basin requires coordination. My current CP group is a well-coordinated (thanks to Ventrilo), well-balanced, and of course, well-geared group that 5-caps and finishes an AB round in 8 minutes or less 90% of the time. When I can't get in with them, I usually go to one of the other two but if I am so foolish as to make the mistake of going into AB as a solo/PUG, it's usually a 20-40 minute exercise in frustraction.
Finally, as to how the Honor System itself works, I think this may cover the basics you're looking for. Also, check the player-generated FAQ on the same board for more god info.
Edit: Rep Farming is a collusive agreement between two teams on opposite factions that make a coordinated effort (usually through Ventrilo) to get into the same BG at the same time and alternately let the other side win with no effort.
Something similar that you may run into if you do this BG thing for an extended period of time is when two hardcore teams randomly end up in the same BG, they'll recognize that putting up a fight would be an "epic struggle" to be sure but would also significantly slow down the quick pace of the CP grind they have going on. When this happens, one team may choose to simply not fight in the interest of expediency. If the two should coincidentally meet again, the "other" team may return the favor... or not. While when viewed individually, this may appear to be rep farming, the difference is that, depending on the queues, there is very likely many legitimate matches in between the aforementioned meetings... at least on the Horde side where we have nearly-instant queues most of the time.
Xfire|XBL
gr.umpic.us|grumpicus.com
Commissioner, GWJFFL|GWJFFL2
Hello Grumpicus! Good to hear from you! I remember the days...but I'm sure you're a gawd now:>) Thanks for the advice, links and all. Much appreciated!
(and Quickheal looks very cool).
I remember the days...but I'm sure you're a gawd
I remember running Stockades and a couple other things in the neighborhood of level 30. Good times, good times... but I got bit by the PvP server bug and, so far, haven't found a cure. Maybe I haven't really looked for one. Xfire|XBL
gr.umpic.us|grumpicus.com
Commissioner, GWJFFL|GWJFFL2
Does anyone know where or how to get a better sword (or mace if they seem better, but I'd like to stay with a sword) and get someone to put a good enchant on it? (my sword now is a level 23 blue. I'm on the verge of 31).
Checking Thottbot shows there are a small number of blue 1H swords in the 31 range... tainted pierce is exactly lvl 31 req, but is just a random drop. Might be able to find one on the AH (that's where I got mine).
The Electrocutioner's Leg is a small chance drop off of one of the bosses of Gnomeregan.
If you happen to be revered with the Warsong Gulch (silverwing sentinels?) faction, the Protector's Sword Is nice, but you'd have to be lvl 38 to use the one they offer at your level.
Skriss: lvl 70 undead mage - Bloodhoof
Kyrator: lvl 63 night elf rogue - Blackhand
Thadryn: lvl 70 draenei mage - Blackhand
Quote:Does anyone know where or how to get a better sword (or mace if they seem better, but I'd like to stay with a sword) and get someone to put a good enchant on it? (my sword now is a level 23 blue. I'm on the verge of 31).Checking Thottbot shows there are a small number of blue 1H swords in the 31 range... tainted pierce is exactly lvl 31 req, but is just a random drop. Might be able to find one on the AH (that's where I got mine).
The Electrocutioner's Leg is a small chance drop off of one of the bosses of Gnomeregan.
If you happen to be revered with the Warsong Gulch (silverwing sentinels?) faction, the Protector's Sword Is nice, but you'd have to be lvl 38 to use the one they offer at your level.
Thanks Ty' for looking those up for me. Very nice. I can only dream of being high enough with the Silverwing's for that Protector Sword. But they all look good. Geeze, Tainted Sword, level 31, but dropped by 32-34 Elites at Scarlet Monastry. Right. Oh well.
Geeze, Tainted Sword, level 31, but dropped by 32-34 Elites at Scarlet Monastry. Right. Oh well.
Well, you can always pick up a green weapon from the AH for a couple of levels. There is a quest chain that starts in Desolace (min lvl 34), that leads to an SM quest (in the name of the light). One of the rewards is a 30dps 1H sword, that I used for a long time. I'm sure you could get a group for SM from guildies or otherwise!
Skriss: lvl 70 undead mage - Bloodhoof
Kyrator: lvl 63 night elf rogue - Blackhand
Thadryn: lvl 70 draenei mage - Blackhand
I got bit by the PvP server bug
I hear that, world pvp changed my opinion of the game for the better. BG is fun but you can only play those 3 maps so many times, plus there are frustrating abuses of the pvp system, such as twinked-out lowbies with insane amounts of equipment. Plus the wait time can be very long. All this should change in the 1.12 patch. Two words: world pvp.
We shall grapple with the ineffable, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Quote:Geeze, Tainted Sword, level 31, but dropped by 32-34 Elites at Scarlet Monastry. Right. Oh well.
Well, you can always pick up a green weapon from the AH for a couple of levels. There is a quest chain that starts in Desolace (min lvl 34), that leads to an SM quest (in the name of the light). One of the rewards is a 30dps 1H sword, that I used for a long time. I'm sure you could get a group for SM from guildies or otherwise!
Thanks again for the information!
Btw: Grumpicus- Thanks for the tip on QuickHeal. Love it!
Grumpicus wrote:I got bit by the PvP server bugI hear that, world pvp changed my opinion of the game for the better. BG is fun but you can only play those 3 maps so many times, plus there are frustrating abuses of the pvp system, such as twinked-out lowbies with insane amounts of equipment. Plus the wait time can be very long. All this should change in the 1.12 patch. Two words: world pvp.
'World PvP'? Interesting. But only if there is a ranking and rewards. Just battling folks for the sake of it is not really a 'thing' for me unless there is a 'goal' of some sort (besides personal satisfaction:>) Is there a link to this?-thanks
Worldofwarcraft.com has link to a quick 'World PvP' preview on their front page. Unfortunatey, it looks like the two new objectives will apply to 60's only.
Worldofwarcraft.com has link to a quick 'World PvP' preview on their front page. Unfortunatey, it looks like the two new objectives will apply to 60's only.
Thanks! I just had found that. Yep, as most things now, it's more for the 'uber' folks. Oh, well. Could be interesting. I hope they have blimps for tourist that like to watch:>)
One7 wrote:Worldofwarcraft.com has link to a quick 'World PvP' preview on their front page. Unfortunatey, it looks like the two new objectives will apply to 60's only.Thanks! I just had found that. Yep, as most things now, it's more for the 'uber' folks. Oh, well. Could be interesting. I hope they have blimps for tourist that like to watch:>)
ESPN 239875: WoW. Your source for Alliance vs Horde rivalry.
IronClad Online: PurEvil
Well after originally, when in my late 20's, getting in about 4 times fairly quickly,
I've waited about 2hrs+ each day since last Thursday (and this weekend on at least two sessions each day a wait of this length) and zip. Nada. Very discouraging. This new feeling of PvP'ing had given WoW a burst of pleasure that was declining. But now. Well I just hope that this coming 'holiday for BG's ' weekend for WSG will get it going again. Although I still have not gotten into AB (although it was cool to find the BG intrance of AB at Refuge Point. Being Alliance for longer then I have before is giving me some joy in seeing new places I use to just sneak by:>) Theremore was pretty cool too. I just hope I don't have to wait for the 'Holiday' weekends to play a Battleground each month. Maybe the 30's is just sort of dead. Maybe because it was AV holdiday weekend, none of the alt's of the 60 crowd were playing. I just hope it get's better.
I'm not in your level bracket.
Me, I dig Arathi Basin, but not so much WSG, though it's still entertaining. Can't wait to try Alterac Valley once I qualify (i.e. cross into the 50's).
Well, I don't have any great links for you. I google'd "WoW battlegrounds guide" and found one good page at WorldOfWar.net, but I don't think it'll answer any questions you have. Here's a couple links that might be interesting to look at:
Battlegrounds Guide
Battlegrounds Reputation Guide
I'm with you on PVP too. I never PVP'd in AC. But then again, if you weren't a 3-schooler with uber-tinked armor, there wasn't much point... and I was a gimped out one-school archer. I had no chance against about 99% of Morningthaw. I love the idea of these battlegrounds though. I actually submitted an idea to Turbine a few years ago that was extremely similar to the battlegrounds, but it was probably never read.
I've only done WSG so far, mainly because I've never gotten through the queue of Arathi Basin... though, that one sounds more entertaining to me. I've had good and bad experiences with WSG, but in all honesty, I'm hooked.
IronClad Online: PurEvil
I hear you Donan. I didn't even start PvPing until I had been 60 for a while. And as a warrior - I literally dropped my Mortal Strike build and switched to Protection the day I started PvP. By all accounts thats just asking to be gimped. But I found it actually worked out fairly well for me and I've had a great time with it. I don't really have any places that I've read useful PvP information from. Everything I've learned has been OJT.
I hit Stormpike Exhalted last night and I'm LOVING the rewards. Almost dropped my entire bankroll but I don't have any regrets. I'm concentrating on the reputation rewards and just seeing where the PvP ranking takes me. If I make Knight or higher eventually I'll be happy.
Get to Alterac Valley as soon as you get into the level 50 bracket - you'll get Reputation and XP. I just saw Arathi Basin and Warsong Gulch for the first time yesterday. I may start farming rep in those but I need to learn them a little more.
A couple things I've found as a warrior:
I'll square off against melee types one on one but any of the casters give me hell every time. I routinely get owned my mages and warlocks. Priests I can take occasionally.
If I can stick with a crowd of people I will. Warriors aren't real solitary types. Our strong suits really shine when I've got others around me.
In Alterac Valley it's a pain to get a raid invite sometimes. If there isn't one in the first couple minutes I start one and just put out a "PST for Invites" message. Auto-Promote the first ten people that come in and tell them to invite everyone they can - after that you're good to go.
Really just watch the people around you, find someone who seems to know what their doing and follow their lead for a while. In a few weeks you'll figure out your own way of doing things and people will start following you
"Fault always lies in the same place...with those foolish enough to lay blame"*
-Cort
*Unless you're Amazon or Funcom, in which case, SCREW YOU.
Here's how my BG experience usually goes:
1. Join queue.
2. Farm gold or help lowbies with quests for two hours.
3. Log off for the night.
I also hate WSG, for three reasons. First, it is a crappy CTF design - there are no tunnels or functional cover to hide movement so there are no alternate routes to cover, but the center area is too large to force conflict well (especially when you add in Druids). Second, if you don't have a druid to carry the flag, and the other side does, you lose automatically. Third, the only time it pops on our server is when the main horde PvP guild queues for it, so we get rolled immediately.
We had a guy in our guild make it to Grand Marshal, then he started a horde toon and is now working toward High Warlord. That's some serious BG love.
"Raise high the black flags, my children."
-- Gebhard von Blucher.
Each battleground has an actual physical location in the world. Near the entrances you can find NPCs that provide some of the rewards. Each of the battlegrounds has an associated faction and by participating in this particular BG, you raise your appropriate faction. Many of the rewards require high faction and rank.
There are no rank point brackets because rank is determined on a sliding scale. Every week, a list is made of all people that have honor and then 1 is declared a Grand Marshall (or whatever the top rank is), a few are assigned the second rank, a few more the third, and so on. So basically it's a percentage based sliding scale. Also don't forget that your honor (or at least its impact on your rank) atrophies. Your old honor points have less impact on your standing than your more recent honor. Or something like that. Therefore, in order to attain rank, it's not a matter of grinding X points, but rather grinding harder than X other people.
As far as Pally strategies... I can't help there. I'm a bit too afraid to go into BGs with my 60 Pally as she's has only 1 epic on her (a ring) and still some green armour items. I have a feeling she would be minced meat very quickly. One thing is for sure: you cannot be a fighter as a Pally. Embrace heals, stuns, de-debuffs and you'll be ok. And get ready to die a lot. But that doesn't matter. If you die, but your team is achieving its objectives, you still win at the end of the day. And honor is based off of winning the games--for the most part--not getting kills.
(@)
Something cool that alot of PvPers dont realize is that direction does count for something. Set up a couple of 'straffing keys'. If you are a warrior and rolling up to someone one on one, you can straff around them. You will be hitting them but they will have to turn around to hit you. It helps out quite a bit.
I don't think I've ever said this sentence before, but man would I love to hump that butterfly.-- KrazyTaco
One phone call and you're melting like butter over my kettle pop. -- Edwin to Mex
2005 GWJFFL2 Champion
I was in the same boat as you Donan in that I unexpectedly starting having a blast in pvp, and my schedule prevents me from having the 4 hour block of time to raid. If you're patient and you play on the side that is outnumbered, pvp is a good way to put together a nice collection of gear without ever raiding. And since the pvp rank rewards were just upgraded, you could argue that the rank 10 set (boots, gloves, chest, leggings, shoulders, and helm) are almost as good as the 8 piece class sets from Molten Core. Add world drops, craftable items, enchants, quest rewards, and a few items from 5-man content, and you'll be able to compete with anyone.
Tips for WSG: stay out of midfield. If you don't care about killing blows and only want to win the match do one of the following: escort the flag carrier, play defense if the flag is in your base, or go on offense when the opposing team has your flag. Getting caught up in midfield fighting, while either flag is elsewhere doesn't really help much.
AB: assign each of the three groups a node to defend. We start off matches by saying "Group 1: Blacksmith, Group 2: Lumber Mill, Group 3: Mill, First to res caps the farm." You want to control 3 nodes as often as possible.
AV: I don't have much to offer here...on my server horde gets consistently crushed in this BG. Everyone does their own thing while the Alliance always seems to have a set of objectives laid out. Last night I think we lost in about 25 minutes, with a full 40 man raid group. A pretty sorry feat.
Mods: BGinvite is nice because sometimes the biggest obstacle to winning a match is actually starting the raid group. With this mod you can automatically send invites to everyone in the instance. However this will be obsolete as of the next patch. In 1.12 everyone in the instance will be automatically placed into the raid group. If you use FuBar, the HonorFu plugin keeps track of some interesting stats like your win/loss record, honor for the day/week, % gained in your current rank etc etc. Hope this helps
I just got into it last week (although queued for WSG and AB, I have only gotten into AV). I have really enjoyed it. I am a 58 Priest (with no epics). I am having a blast. I sign up for it when I first log in each night and then go about my regular business. If I get in, great. If not, I had a regular night of WOW.
I run into DeapSea every now and again. Last night I was trying to track him down in AV so I could be his personal healer as he dealt out some GWJ goodness. It worked on occasion, but I made my priestliness a bit too obvious and spent some time repeatedly running back from the graveyard. Still, a fun, fun time.
Gamer Tag -- Edgar Newt
HonorFu is outstanding.
Gamer Tag -- Edgar Newt
Thanks folks! I would like AB better too I think. I just can never get into the dang thing. If you get in and we are in the same spread, I think you can add me to join you or something. I know there's is 'join as a group' initially, but from some of my reading it sounds like you can add someone even if you are already in. But again, maybe I'm misunderstanding something. Yep, can't wait to for AV. That really sounds like fun.
Wow Pur', I forgot you were an old AC Morningthaw player. Cool! Thanks for the links too.
Deep': interesting insights. Thanks.
Super': It sure seem's that way more times then not.
Moon': Thanks for the clarification and insight(!). I'm wondering if my team is desperate for a score if I could follow a flag bearer and do Divine Intervention to get them to score or something:>)
Karma': I figured as much. What really crack's me up (in a negative way) is that I've alway's hated 'bunny jumping' in FPS's. And it's taking a solid blow to the head to realize with what has been going on in front of me (because I just thougth it's and FPS thing!), but it's happening in PvP MMORPG for gawd sakes!...lol. Rogues and warrior's jumping around like the have pojo stick for goodness sakes. I want to just wrestle them to the ground and stake 'em:>) Or at least lasso them and drag them for awhile...lol.
Thanks for the tips One7!.
Say, what the devil is 'farming reputation'? I thought I've read this is frowned upon and steps are being taking etc. etc. But this might be for something else.
I'll have to go load that. I've come from not being able to get mods to work to having now 9 running. I'm a bit afraid of overload with FuBar. But I think I'll just have to give it a go.
Any tricks with using key commands? I have a devil of a time trying to find a flag runner to help. Or even someone nearby when there's a big furball going on.
I was trying to use the 'F' key when I had a fellow player banging away, but as noted above, with all the hopping, twirling, square dancing and rumba (oh wait, got a bit OT there) it's hard to 'lock' on.
Massively important tip there, Karmajay. In my limited BG experiences, I did much better than I should have just because I'm constantly moving. I'm a paladin, so I use my seals and judgements as best I can, throw on some stuns when I can, use my bubble if needed to heal someone or just keep harassing the opponents while reinforcements arrive. I fight with a shield in BG's so I can do better with defense and keep others healed (and no, I'm not a holy spec, I'm a protection spec; doesn't mean I can't heal!). I'm not a damage-dealer, I'm a protector and harasser.
I also find that it makes my love my Shatterer mace that much more. I got an Icy enchant on it specifically to make it more useful in BG's.
Haven't done any BG's in a long time, but I do remember enjoying them a lot. Arathi in particular. A little disappointing to hear how long the queues apparently are for this on Blackhand.
I actually think its a shame that the new pvp world objectives arent for lower levels as well.
I cant count the number of fights I picked at the crossroads on Dark Iron. That was some good high teens low 20's fun!
Being fangoriously devoured by a gelatinous monster.
quote=Donan]I'm wondering if my team is desperate for a score if I could follow a flag bearer and do Divine Intervention to get them to score or something:>)
I'm not sure if DI is a good one (as the person cannot do anything while inside the DI bubble), but Blessing of Protection certainly is. As is a Blessing of Freedom if snared. As is Lay on Hands. As is stunning the persuers.
Flag carrier will have an "enchant" icon on them to tell you htey are carrying the flag. Also, you can see the flag trail from a mile away when in WSG. If you are having trouble targetting people, you can use TAB to scroll through near enemies, or press V to toggle their name/hp bars above their heads.
(@)